Dear Mark: Why “Game Changers” Isn’t Worth My Time and Sugar Addictions

For today’s edition of Dear Mark, I’m answering a couple questions. The first one is a big one, one that multiple people have asked me across several different mediums: why don’t I do a full review of “Game Changers,” the vegan documentary on Netflix, or at least watch the film? I explain why I won’t watch it, why I don’t think it’s worth your time, and why I’ve already addressed it all before. Then, I answer why sugar is such a fixation for us and give some options for avoiding or mitigating it.

Let’s go:


How come you dismissed the “Game Changers” documentary without watching it?

Because it’s not worth my time. The premise is simply preposterous.

Humans are omnivores. We have eaten meat for millions of years. And not just “eaten meat.”

We used animal femurs as bone marrow storage containers. We fought off massive African predators just to get at the meat and crack the bones for the goodness inside. We slurped brains. We smashed bones to bits and boiled them in animal skin bags to extract every last ounce of collagen and fat. We drove entire species to extinction in our lust for large portions of fatty animal meat.

Even after we were hunter-gatherers, the importance of animal products persisted. The biggest influx of humanity that provided a large portion of extant DNA across Europe and huge parts of Asia were livestock-driving nomadic herdsmen who ate cheese and yogurt (animal products—and not low-fat), drank blood, and hunted game. They farmed a little but relied so heavily on animal products for their calories that they had to borrow the agricultural words from the populations they displaced. To give you a taste of how important animal products were to them, their word for wealth was the same as the word for cattle.

What—that just goes away? Those millions of years of slurping and gnawing and atlatl-ing and spear throwing and stalking and weapons-craft and herding…don’t matter?

So, when a persuasive documentary comes out preaching about the evils of red meat (and let’s face it: it’s always about red meat) and the benefits of excising all meat from your diet in favor of plants, I laugh. I shrug. I smirk even.

Red meat consumption is down across the board. People listened to the “experts.” And guess what? Health got worse. Waists grew. Healthcare spending shot up. Diabetes spiked. Heart disease persisted (deaths decreased, thanks to better emergency care, but incidence is still there).

Does the documentary address all that? Does it mention the word “evolution”?

My time matters too much to me to waste it on the documentary. The arguments I’ve laid out in other responses to attacks on meat eating stand and, most likely, apply to the arguments in the documentary. Check these out for a few of my explorations of the “meat is bad” topic:

Is meat as bad as smoking?

Will meat give you diabetes?

Is charred meat bad for you?

Does red meat give you colon cancer?

Will red meat kill you?

Is saturated fat deadly?

Read those, then get back to me. And I probably still won’t watch the documentary.

I’d rather spend my time:

Helping people who want the help.

Coming up with interesting new products that help people make better choices in the grocery store.

Standup paddling.

Playing Ultimate frisbee (and playing in general).

Writing about new topics or new developments of old topics.

I have yet to see a new argument from the plant-based crowd. I’ve heard the same things for years upon years. Nothing changes. “There’s nothing new under the sun.”

We have better things to do. Bigger fish to fry (in a gluten-free breading using low-PUFA oil kind of way).

How to conquer sugar addiction and is there a primal need to eat something sweet? Would Grok ever get the urge for something sweet?

Our relationship with sugar goes way back. In ancestral situations, sugar was rare. The urge to eat something sweet was so strong because it was so hard to get—a powerful urge was required to coerce the organism to do the work required to get the sugar. And in those situations, sugar was beneficial. An odd trove of honey represented a potent source of caloric energy, a way to replenish glycogen stores. Acute doses versus chronic overload. We have old cave paintings from 25000 years ago of honey hunters climbing trees to grab hives; that’s how much they prized it. Fruit, while not always plentiful or as oversized as today’s fruit, definitely existed—albeit to varying degrees depending on the climate and region. The farther you got from the equator, the scarcer sweet tastes became.

Even up to a few hundred years ago, when sugar was actually available, it remained a luxury item. It had to be imported, out of reach for most regular people.

Today, sugar is everywhere. We’re glutted with the stuff. We can’t escape it. And yet we still retain that ancestral mindset of sugar scarcity. Our bodies still crave it. Our physiological desires were molded in the context of low sugar availability. Introduce them to a sugar-replete environment and you get obesity, diabetes, heart disease, metabolic syndrome, and tooth decay.

I’m not sure if there’s a physiological need today to consume sugar. But there’s certainly a physiological desire to consume it. And really, the only way past it is to erect artificial barriers to sugar consumption.

Don’t keep sugar in the house.

Don’t use artificial sweeteners or even natural ones like stevia or monk fruit if they trigger the craving for real sugar.

Just say no. Sheer willpower may not hold out forever, but in those instances where you’re faced with an intense dose of sugar and you don’t want to eat it, don’t give in. You can do this.

Chronic doses of sugar are the real killer: those little peanut butter cups at the co-worker’s desk you grab every time you walk by, those peanut M&Ms at the secretary’s desk, those half donuts in the break room—they add up. They always add up. Acute doses of sugar probably aren’t a big deal for most reasonably healthy people. High quality dessert after a great dinner out? Birthday party and the host is a legit whiz in the kitchen? Try it.

Avoid anything you’re intolerant of or allergic to, of course. Avoid gluten whenever possible.

Whatever you do, don’t waste your acute doses of sugar on garbage. Don’t eat a Hostess donut. Don’t eat a half gallon of low-fat frozen yogurt from those places that charge you by the ounce.

Eat real ice cream made with great ingredients—just a child’s scoop. Don’t get the weird “ice cream” shake from the fast food joint.

Don’t get the microwaved lava cake from the chain restaurant. Share a portion of real panna cotta from the fancy restaurant.

That’s it for today, folks. If you have any other suggestions or comments or questions, throw them in down below.

Take care, everyone.

TAGS:  dear mark, Hype

About the Author

Mark Sisson is the founder of Mark’s Daily Apple, godfather to the Primal food and lifestyle movement, and the New York Times bestselling author of The Keto Reset Diet. His latest book is Keto for Life, where he discusses how he combines the keto diet with a Primal lifestyle for optimal health and longevity. Mark is the author of numerous other books as well, including The Primal Blueprint, which was credited with turbocharging the growth of the primal/paleo movement back in 2009. After spending three decades researching and educating folks on why food is the key component to achieving and maintaining optimal wellness, Mark launched Primal Kitchen, a real-food company that creates Primal/paleo, keto, and Whole30-friendly kitchen staples.

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94 thoughts on “Dear Mark: Why “Game Changers” Isn’t Worth My Time and Sugar Addictions”

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  1. Thank you so much Mark, I appreciate you not giving time to game changers- especially when so many of your posts already cover what you would say.

    And as for sugar, the less you have the less you crave I agree. Even limes taste super sweet to me now! I have always been very, very thin and when I was younger thought nothing of my sugar addiction (if your super skinny why care right????) But it wreaked havoc on my gut health eventually (along with lots of ‘healthy whole grains’) I couldn’t absorb anything in the end plus developed ulcerative colitis.

    Also having IBD and after a recent cancer diagnosis what do you think of carnivore for cancer? I have heard great things in relation to treating both ailments and am thinking about trying it more and more.

    I really don’t handle meat well (especially cooked) and am thinking of a fairly radical all seafood carnivore diet.

    Shellfish, whole fish, both cooked and raw and seaweed- that’s it. would it be possible to stay healthy on an exclusively carnivore seafood diet you think? Would love your input?

  2. All peer-reviewed medical studies, support the fact at the Moore animal products you eat the more diseases you encounter and the less healthy you become. And the more plants you eat the healthier and more fit you become. He’s afraid to watch the documentary, because he’ll see his delusional belief system go up and smoke!

  3. I didn’t watch ‘Game Changers’, either, but I see that Arnold Schwarzenegger is featured priminently in its promotion and I’m wondering whether they’re SERIOUSLY arguing that this steroid-created lab goon is actually representative of veganism.

    It also makes me wonder how many of the other “manly men” in the doc are actually just juiced up like a UFC fighter in 2000.

    1. Maybe if you had bothered to watch it you would realise that theres a bodybuilder on there thats eaten plant based his whole life, but don’t let that destroy your narrative. Saying that I’m sure you’ll probably just claim he’s roiding his balls off too, using plant based steroids

      1. Dave…..
        Naaah….. He’s more likely to cite those parts of the research that “Game Changer” left out when quoting it.

        That the omnivores on comparable regimes gained more lean muscle mass.
        That the omnivores on comparable regimes tested higher in essential muscle-building hormones.
        That the same benefits claimed for beet juice are exceeded by meat components.

    2. DMG, Do any of those studies specify that the meat is organic? I’m sure all the chemicals (growth hormones, antibiotics, steroids, etc) we feed the animals that are in the general section of the supermarket have more to do with increases in diseases than the meat products themselves.

    3. Schwarzenegger lowered his LDL cholesterol to 109 by switching to a plant-based diet.

    4. Schwarzenegger lowered his LDL cholesterol to 109 by switching to a plant-based diet. Also, our early ancestors were nearly all vegetarians.

      1. Gary Taubes’ book might change your mind about this. In fact they couldn’t find one ancient vegetarian culture. But I’d still argue even if there were such culture, the other random few hundred plus they looked into reflect what humans biologically are— omnivores. Don’t drink the koolaid and complicate things

  4. Evolution is discussed. All animal proteins are discussed, red meat isn’t the only food pointed to as the issue at hand.

    Archeological geneticist, cardiologist’s, the chair of biological anthropology from Harvard and many more scientific contributors are interviewed and they give evolutionary evidence on how early humans likely ate.

    Adjusting views based on new evidence is the point of this documentary. When you’re (Mark) in the public view and you give advice that’s harmful it’s your followers that will pay the price.

    For anyone still reading this, watch the documentary and make choices for yourself before dismissing the newest evidence for health and athletic performance.

    1. The documentary is misleading on multiple levels. It frames nutrition as an either/or fallacy, misrepresents data, submits quack science as accepted fact, etc. Nobody in position to respectably evaluate that “documentary” can take it seriously. “Cloudy blood” means absolutely nothing. Not ONCE did it mention collagen. I could go on for hours, but won’t. The documentary was better than most in its ilk, but still garbage from beginning to end insofar as one seeks to understand the complexity at hand.

  5. Well said, Mark. Vegans are clowns; it’s best to ignore their propaganda. Besides, we all know they’re eventually gonna end up eating meat sometime in the near future.

    “Does the documentary mention the word evolution?”

    Veganism, like other forms of political radicalism, is about remaking humanity and human society in its own image, history and genetics be damned. Therefore, vegans don’t concern themselves with evolution. They don’t care if humans have evolved over millions of years to thrive under certain conditions. To vegans and other radicals, humans are endlessly malleable creatures that can thrive on tofurkey just as well as venison.

    1. It does in fact mention evolution at length. Mark’s portrayal of our ancestors is not accurate. We have always relied more on gathering for our calories than hunting. If you look at our digestive system it was not designed to handle meat eating. I’m not sure why you feel the need to attack vegans and categorize them in such a ridiculous way. Deciding to become a vegan is absolutely not a political statement. It is for most of us, looking at the evidence, both for our own health and the planet’s and deciding to make a change. It is not propaganda, it is sharing valuable information and medical studies that people might not have had access to. Watch the documentary with an open mind and see what you come away with.

      1. You’re still gonna end up eating meat in the next year or two. You know you will.

      2. Our digestive systems share more in common with carnivores than herbivores.
        And “experts” often do have a political agenda

      3. “We have always relied more on gathering for our calories than hunting. If you look at our digestive system it was not designed to handle meat eating.”

        Absurd. This is a patent untruth. One need only look at the very beginning of the digestive system–the teeth–to see that humans are omnivores who scavenge meat at the very least.

        There’s very good evidence that shellfish and fish in rivers, streams, and lakes was an all-important source of food for early humans. But that’s if you, like, care about the science and not handwaving to make a point.

        “I’m not sure why you feel the need to attack vegans and categorize them in such a ridiculous way.”

        If y’all would stop lying, maybe your movement would have a better reputation. If you just posed it as a religious question and admitted that you seek “mortification of the flesh” then people would be more willing to live and let live.

  6. ‘Red meat consumption is down across the board. People listened to the “experts.” And guess what? Health got worse. Waists grew. Healthcare spending shot up. Diabetes spiked. Heart disease persisted (deaths decreased, thanks to better emergency care, but incidence is still there).’
    No source for such a claim? Sounds like typical keto pushing propaganda that doesn’t acknowledge newer clinical studies. You won’t so much as watch a movie, it sounds like, because it might threaten your livelihood?
    You don’t acknowledge environmental benefits of reducing meat intake. Or mention the debates of the new Canadian diet, where in my opinion keto researchers didn’t have a leg to stand on (a carb is a carb is a carb, right? ?). And sugar. Way to differate between good and bad sugars. It’s almost impossible to eat too much fruit from the research I’ve seen?
    Overall this is a pointless article. No sources. No new arguments.

    1. Ok Mister “thissiteisgarbage”, have you actually read anything else on this site besides this one post? Have you been reading all the research-backed articles he’s been posting for many years? This article is absolutely not pointless, he was addressing questions HIS READERS asked him, and he answered them. Sure it’s pointless to you, you have a different opinion and are clearly not a regular on this blog. He doesn’t have a list of sources because he’s addressed this many times before and he made it clear he doesn’t find this worth his time. Why does that need sources?

      1. This. Mark has always been a proponent of posting research to back up his articles, he shouldn’t feel compelled to post links to refute yet another agenda-driven, drivel piece.

    2. Well, most of us have already read and researched all of those things anyway. It is not all that difficult find it if you look.

    3. “No source for such a claim? ”

      Those are multiple claims, if they were all found in one study, the study wouldn’t pass peer review.

      I notice that you haven’t given any sources either.

      You’re getting shouty because you know that there’s nothing you can do about people’s personal choices. I think you’re resorting to the tools of a coward, hiding behind ugly words because you know it’s wrong to force people to eat things that hurt them, and it’s wrong to withhold food that is nutritious.

      When will YOU read the original Atkins diet book? Have you watched “Fat Head”? Have you read Denise Minger? Robb Wolf? Phinney and Volek? Gary Taubes? Robert Lustig? Maria Emmerich? This movement didn’t spring up overnight. There are good reasons why it exists.

      You could be a paid sock puppet for big ag or food producers for all we know. I think attack comments are suspicious and I think you were paid to say what you said. I’ve seen this sort of comment on several websites I read. All the highest quality websites in Keto dieting have been attacked like this. By this time, it’s a badge of honor, not a negative.

      The food industry must be terrified of Paleo-keto, maybe because it leads to less packaged food buying and more home cooking. If so, then your arguments have no nutrition leg to stand on.

      For decades the nutrition information was that we should cook more food at home because it’s always higher quality food than restaurants, fast food and packaged food. If you care about nutrition, you should be applauding this community. We eat nutrient dense food and we cook it at home a lot more often than the norm.

  7. Where were you educated? I feel sorry for your professors to critique a piece of research without reading it would never be accepted. To do the same with a video or any other form of presenter excetera is just insane. It reminds me of what’s going on politically, the anti-science, facts are facts, and talk about all kinds of other things to distract people. You really think people are going to take you seriously? Well maybe the other people who are also anti-science. Do the job right watch it critique it with good factual research that may go against it if you can find it then people will take you seriously.

    1. Well said. I’m so disappointed in Mark. I expected more from him

    2. He soundly critiques the idea of a vegan diet for humans. If you use evolution as your starting point for studying biology you don’t need to read/watch every vegan argument to know that a diet of no animal foods is new in human history. It’s an experiment, and maybe it will work well for some time for some people, but as a long-term way of eating it’s unprecedented for our species.

    3. I get your take but I also disagree. At some point, I just get tired of listening to or watching propaganda and I turn it off. Life is too short. So, for one movie or article to take this view, I don’t see a problem. I doubt this will be the approach to all articles and research.

    4. Oh, please. He specifically said he doesn’t find it worth his time, he is not interested. How is that anti-science? He isn’t required to watch and debunk every vegan documentary that comes out. That’s his personal choice.

  8. Hi Mark
    I’m disappointed that you didn’t watch Game Changers. As I would have liked to hear your views on some specific issues. Especially the issue of the idea that the new advances in the technology (the ability to see micro fossils) shows that plants played far more of an important role in the diet of our ancestors than previously thought (bone, stone, etc preserving much better than plant matter). I’d also like to hear your views on the environmental impact that industrial agriculture is having and how we can approach that in a pragmatic way. This is going to be a very influential documentary (it’s already made me think about my choices, purely from an environmental point of view), so I think that the best way you can help people is to give your always considered view.

    1. Ruminant animals are CRUCIAL for the health of our environment. We only have enough topsoil for 60 more years of monocopping and farming with current practices. Humans cannot do better what mother nature has perfected over millennia.

      1. I agree, without the ruminant animals our earth would have too much of it turn into desert land.

      2. Yes, I agree that many parts of the earth evolved with ruminant animals – especially the part of the world I live in. But, what the film talks about is the intensive and cruel rearing of cows in the most horrendous conditions, with the waste not properly treated and the conditions requiring huge amounts of drugs for the animals – even those organically reared. What the beef industry is doing now has nothing to do with how ruminants evolved to live.

        1. Catherine.

          I have spent my life in animal agriculture, and that kind of propagandising misrepresentation is one of the primary reasons why I don’t find films of this nature to be worth the time of day.

          1. It cherry-picks. 97% of the ruminants in this country – a major exporter of beef and mutton – are grazing on grass-pastures at any one time.

          2. Healthy, stress-free, well-nourished animals grow faster, use fodder more efficiently and are MORE PROFITABLE. It is in our own best interests to ensure that our livestock are in as good a condition as possible.

          3.. We have known for a LONG TIME that livestock that are stressed and suffering at slaughter are LESS TENDER and TASTE LESS PLEASANT. We are not so stupid as to invest so much time and effort in creating a high-value product merely in order to degrade it at the last step.

          4.. The VAST majority of fodder fed to animals CANNOT be eaten by human beings. It is grossly dishonest to claim that we can simply substitute plant matter for animal-derived nutrition.

          Even if you do not trust our ethics ( and why we would choose to spend a lifetime working with animals if we hate them – as vegan propaganda claims – is beyond rational comprehension) you have to be extremely gullible to think that we would act against our own best interests.

          If this film misrepresents me in this way, what else does it misrepresent?


          1. Thanks Peter for your input. It is helpful to hear your views. Aside from a dedicated primal person, I am the grand daughter of a cattle farmer, so I also know about well run and badly run farms. I also know that the way my grand father ran his beef farm would not be able to feed the world’s current demand for meat because he used so much land for such a relatively small number of cattle. My grand fathers cattle would graze freely, roaming across lush pastures. I’m sure you’re right in saying that the majority of the soy/corn/grain fed to animals couldn’t be fed to humans – but I am interested in the alternatives uses that land used to grow animal feed could be put to.
            I know that most farmers love animals – my grand father certainly did (and he passed that deep love onto me) and any decisions and choices I make are not meant to vilify those farmers. I’m just trying to find a way that healthily and sustainably feeds the world and cares for the environment. I’ve been following Marks blog for over 10 years and it has helped me always to keep updated.
            I’m learning and keeping an open mind. Keeping an open mind and be willing to change it based on the evidence it important – so that’s what I try and do. Which means that I’m always willing and grateful to hear your point of view.

        2. Aha, so Mark got the sharp end of the attack comments stick because he’s into Organic?

          There’s a concerted effort to degrade the Organic label in the USDA, they recently held a vote on whether or not GMO could be organic. I mean a few months ago. That’s only the latest salvo.

          To correct you, organic animals are fed organic feed, get sick much less often, and are required to get outside. Sting operations on fake Organic farms use flyovers to verify animals are outdoors part of the day. Among other requirements, they can only be given drugs if they are in fact sick and they can’t be slaughtered soon after being cured of an illness. They wouldn’t even pass meat inspection if they show signs of recent illness.

          PCO has a grass fed AND organic label and I hope many more meat producers start using it. I can find it easily on milk already.

          OMRI keeps a list of permitted inputs to organic farms. Each input has to solve a real problem that wasn’t solved by good management. No preventative inputs are allowed in Organic.

          And then there are artisan farmers who grow and finish pigs on acorns (forest fed) and provide a small local harvest of real pork, the likes of which haven’t been seen in decades in the US. For a while, we could get boar from Texas when they had an overpopulation problem. Wildcrafted, and very nice. Such side activities help farmers make a little cash out of their nuisances.

          Who in their right mind would want to stand against this? To be against this is to be against artisan farming, and against human nutrition. Is it hard to be an artisan farmer? Yes. That’s why it gets such a high price.

          If all NC pigs were raised this way, we would’ve never had that lawsuit about pig farming, that’s for sure. We’re putting our subsidies into the wrong things. Organic feed should be subsidized, helping organic farmers who grow plants as well as the ones who keep animals for food.

          The subsidy structure needs to change if we’re going to give small farming a real chance. Corporate Ag lobbyists will try to tell us that’s a bad idea, but it’s a blatantly self serving criticism.

  9. Well I have watched the game changers a few times now and I have cut back on eating meat to only once a week and can feel the benefits already. I am sleeping better a d feel much happier in myself and I am attending the gym and feeling stronger I put this down to watching the game changer and changing my life style.

  10. I too am so disappointed in Mark. He was a sort of hero to me. Being diagnosed with type 1 diabetes in my late 50’s I set out to research a diet that could help me control my blood sugars without using loads of insulin. I discovered Mark and not eating grains etc. I tried it and it worked. My aches and pains disappeared and I cut back on my insulin intake. I even put my mother on the diet, loads of meat and veg and little to no grains. She too felt better. Although I was still having spikes in my blood sugar and my cholesterol levels are very high I continue with the diet, still researching and looking at new studies.

    I watched The Game Changers and it really upset me. I couldn’t believe we have been lied to all our lives! I thought to myself, I know who will give me a straight, scientific answer to this, Mark!

    How wrong was I! I can’t believe you have dismissed the documentary like this Mark. I know your whole livelihood is based on eating meat but to dismiss new research without even watching it!? What does that say about you. Are you in it just for the money? Do you even care?

    Very sad and disappointed. Shame on you

    1. It is a documentary. It is not a research. And claims are based on bad science / cherry picking.
      It is a propaganda, with the producer investing millions in vegan protein.
      Eating plant-based is good, but that doesn’t mean you shouldn’t eat animal products.

      1. What everyone is missing even James Wilks is that his basic premise is false. He says in the Documentary that his initial interest was sparked when he found out that the Gladiators were fed Beans and Barley. What he doesn`t get is that the Gladiators weren`t the High priced Pro Atheletes of their day they were slaves. They were treated the same as Cattle and were fed whatever was cheap. Their owners would not waste Meat on someone who could be killed at any time. It was simple economics not an Effort to create Supermen.

        1. And Sumo wrestlers eat a very high carb diet to build and maintain their obese body types.

  11. I eat vegetarian at least once a week and my portions of meat are smaller and carefully chosen. The waste in our society of food and everything else is what bothers me. Also, I’m completely turned off by yet another way to divide people. Have we lost the ability to respectfully disagree? Just more us vs them propaganda, I’m actually glad Mark didn’t engage.

  12. For all the people talking about “Game Changers”, you wanna know what the real game changer for me was? It was learning to think for myself. It was learning that everyone is different and what works for some may not work for others. Are you doing awesome eating less meat or no meat? Then great, as I’m sure it works well for some people. It did not for me.

    I was a vegetarian for five years at which point I then went vegan for a year and then went as far as raw vegan for two months. I started feeling lethargic and fatigued so I went to a doctor. My testosterone levels were low, I developed ED (at 25 years old I might add), I lost strength, felt tired and irritated all the time, had dandruff, digestive problems and just in general was not enjoying life. My doctor had no idea what was wrong and thought I might have Crohn’s disease. At a loss, I started adding animal products back in slowly, first just dairy and eggs. I quickly felt better and within a month the ED was gone, my energy was coming back and my strength skyrocketed. I decided to go full omnivore and now regularly eat normal amounts of meat. I feel great and have for the past ten years since eating this way, my cholesterol is low, my triglycerides are low, I have excellent heart function, and have healthier testosterone levels now than I did ten years ago. I haven’t looked back. I’m not judging or condemning anyone that’s eats vegan or vegetarian as I did both myself; just please don’t condemn others who don’t share your diet, not everyone can tolerate it despite their best intentions. And for those who do eat meat or other animal products, I would caution the same, as I suspect there are those who feel terrible eating animal products and vegan may work great for them. As for environmental concerns, there is no diet that doesn’t cause some form of harm, and I cannot fathom how the pasture raised beef I get from the farmer ten minutes from my house is somehow worse than blueberries shipped from Chile or the like; my personal ethos is to eat as local as possible as much as possible, whether it be plant or animal, and that works for me; it may not for you and that’s fine.

    We all need to stop judging each other so harshly, and experiment to see what’s best for ourselves rather then relying on other people to do the work for us. There are lots of resources out there and this blog is an excellent one for those who do eat meat. For those who don’t, why come on here just to spread your anger? Direct it to something positive. Just my two cents. I wish the best to everyone here, regardless of what you eat.

    1. Amen to this, Dave. I never bother with the latest results of food research or the various documentaries that come out. I eat what works for me, period. I don’t understand why so many people think someone else is going to know more about their body than they do.

    2. Finally some common sense !! Thanks Dave, well said. It reminds me of a saying I once heard… “What other people eat is none of your business”

  13. I am looking for help from both sides of this argument. I had been eating primal for most of 2019 in order to fix GI symptoms, which it was starting to do. Unfortunately I had a heart attack in September 2019 at the age of 38. I don’t smoke, only have the occasional drink, am 6’1″ and 186lbs. My only marker was after years of normal cholesterol levels, it was high when I went to the hospital. So now on the advice of doctors I have started adding grains (still gluten free ones) back into my diet, but now the GI symptoms are returning, however my chest and EKG are looking good. I watched Game Changes, and I feel both the Primal/Keto/Paleo and the Plant Based communities make good arguments. I honestly feel stuck, I don’t know how I could go back to full on paleo dieting after having a heart attack on it, but I also felt the best on it. So if anyone else has advice or a similar why they navigated this please let me know, I really don’t care who is “right” I just want a way of eating that makes me feel good and is good for my arteries. Please don’t bash my situation with simple blanket statements, I am looking for real world solutions. Thanks in advance.

    1. If you had a heart attack after having been on a paleo eating plan for less than a year I hope you aren’t blaming that way of eating. Heart problems come for years of lifestyle problems. If you eat horrible for decades and then improve your diet for a year, well, after all those years of abuse of your body, it needs time to heal and respond to the healing process.

      1. Thanks for your reply, I appreciate the input. That is were the debate is, my full back story is that I was significantly overweight in my teens and college, but lost 100+ LBS back in 2006-2009, and have maintained a healthy weight for the last 10 years with a “paleo-ish” diet, cross training, cycling and lifting. I consider my last 10 years a VERY healthy lifestyle and had normal cholesterol levels all the way until this past year when I fully eliminated grains and increased fat consumption. So the real problem is trying to figure out what was the root cause; was it my bad lifestyle in my youth (obviously that contributed some)? Is it genetics? Was it just “going to happen” and I was able to hold it off for 10 yrs with a healthier lifestyle as my ER doc said. I hope you understand how emotionally it is very hard to think about embracing a keto or paleo diet when that is when it occurred even in light of some research. I am not “blaming” any particular diet, and fully expect that everyone is different. I really don’t care what the diet is, I just want to a diet that I can digest and keeps my heart pumping so I can ride a bike 🙂

        1. Have you considered genetic testing for something like APOE e4? That might be an interesting discovery. There are some great comprehensive labs out there that might help, like Boston Heart.
          I hope you are recovering quickly!

    2. I suggest that you look for the MD’s out there who are supportive of the keto diet. Once your doctor says to do X, the only way to argue is by finding another MD who says not-X. Otherwise, untrained people would be put in the position of giving medical advice and that’s never good.

      A good site to look at is Diet Doctor.

      However, not everyone is cut out for a keto diet. You might do better with just a simple Paleo diet. Primal is actually more permissive, it permits occasional dairy, soy or grains, as long as it’s honestly occasional, not “I put soy sauce on everything.”

      If you have gut issues, please see a gastroenterologist and keep going back over and over until you get your answers. Gastro’s tend to look at you, decide you don’t need surgery and send you home with a PPI. Don’t let them dismiss you like that. Ask them about diet. Insist that you get a Celiac screening.

      For that matter, check with an endocrinologist and insist on having a Reverse T3 test. If that’s too high, it will look like your thyroid is fine, but most of the hormone is unusable. If you don’t know what I mean, there are wonderful websites out there like “Stop the Thyroid Madness” which gives lots of detail. It’s a short step from gut issues to thyroid issues.

      If you are brave about arguing against mainstream medicine, then I suggest the book “Statin Nation” by Malcolm Kendrick which will help you understand the bad science in the heart disease world. It can be scary reading, but here’s something that isn’t scary.. how’s your Vitamin C levels? Do you at least take 2000 mg a day?

      There’s a lot more than this out there, but here’s a recent review that cautiously recommends vitamin C for CVD:

      There are tons of others talking about oxidation of fats in blood vessels and antioxidant vitamins A, C and E. You don’t have to be anti-statin or have big arguments about whether or not cholesterol is a problem or not… in order to appreciate that antioxidant vitamins can help.

      1. Thank you for all these great resources! I agree with your first paragraph, you really need an MD that embraces whatever lifestyle you are trying to implement. I have not heard of the T3 test and will check it out. My GI has been helpful in ruling out any active gut inflammation, celiac, or crohns. Do you recommend any particular food sensitivity testing? I had started reading about vitA,C, and E and trying to figure out how you “dissolve” calcium deposits in the arteries. And thank you for the book recommendation, I will give it a read. Thanks again

    3. Hi JFitz, Sorry to hear about your HA. I have read lately that heart disease is more likely to be caused by inflammation rather than cholesterol. Do you know what your crp-s is now and what it was at the time of your HA? Also have you had a CAC test? This will tell you the condition of arteries. Good luck with figuring out what is the best way of eating for you…it may not be either or….maybe a combo of the 2.

    4. You can eat root vegetables to get your carbs rather than relying on grains if those are causing you issues. Also try pseudo grains like buckwheat and quinoa. They aren’t bitter if prepared properly although they can be quite bland. Rice is probably the safest grain to eat as long as you aren’t allergic to it.

      If I were you I would just look into vitamins and minerals and make sure my diet provided them within the limitations of my food intolerances and supplement if needed. Red meat provides high levels of iron and zinc to the diet (as well as other things) but there are some alternatives (such as oysters, or supplements).

      I personally believe that beans should not be cut out of the diet unless you’re doing a temporary FODMAP thing. They’re extremely healthful, but they kind of suck as your *only* source of protein.

      Listen to your body, and read up on nutrition. It wouldn’t hurt to do a consultation with an RD as well. They do have their biases but they’re good about finding nutritional balance for people with food intolerances.

  14. Jesus, people. He doesn’t have to give his time to anything he doesn’t want to. He doesn’t deserve shame for that. Mark has a life, ya know, like everyone else. I’m surprised to see so many people saying they’re disappointed in him for something so little. If he decides to watch it and address things from it, I’ll happily read it. But you can’t expect everything from him. If you’re dissatisfied, then research it yourself. Thanks for everything you do, Mark!

  15. Take your sugar article and replace the word ‘sugar’ with the word ‘meat’. Now re-read and using the same mindset at least try and go without meat for a week and see how you feel afterwards. Forget the history and science for a moment and just simply judge how it affects you and your body by how you feel.

    The fact you won’t even watch something but dismiss it outright is poor. What are you scared of? Surely it will be easy for you to get all the ammo you need to rip it to shreds by just watching it.

    1. Actually….. I’ve gone without vegetables for over three months now.
      I’ve lost weight, my Doctor says that my bloodwork is “perfect” and I’m feeling better than I have for decades.
      Both physically AND mentally.

      Because I’m treating this as a dietary experiment, not a religious commitment, (and it’s funny how similar most vegans sound to cultists) I’m not afraid to occasionally experiment by adding certain foods back in.

      Results have varied from “meh”, to definitely NOT.

      Are you prepared to practice what you preach? Try something that you haven’t?.?

      1. Actually, this is me practicing what I preach. I’ve been eating meat my whole life as part of an unbalanced diet right up until a week ago, when I watched the documentary and decided to accept the challenge and commit to this for a week.

        The week is almost up. My findings were that I feel less lethargic, I find that I’m able to ‘let go’ of mental setbacks easier and quicker. I’m the type of person that usually dwells on things, but I’m surprised at just how easily I can get over it now, so my mood has improved, something that took a few days to realise. Bowel movements are more firm and better. I just ‘feel’ healthier in general.

        Negatives are increased flatulence (incredibly smelly to boot!), more expense (I’m not much of a cook so have to pay a premium for a lot of this stuff), always hungry, constantly feel the need to be snacking on something.

        How much of the positives can I actually attribute to being plant based? Hard to tell for sure because od how terrible my diet was before. My new vegan diet is unbalanced in itself. I didnt just go from a meat driven diet to meat free and manage to get the portions for food groups right on the button frst try, thats for sure. I’d probably feel less hungry if I ate more meals, but I’m just snacking all the time on things. Its a huge change that I will take time to adapt to.

        I will definitely eat meat again, but watching the documentary and giving it a try has changed the way I think about food. For people like me who have gone through life just eating whatever they want I think this documentary is perfect fodder to make you stop and think. Its opened me up to trying a lot of new things that I was too stubborn or uncaring to do before.

        I will probably have a combination of the diets to find the healthiest way that suits me. No more cheap nasty heavily processed meat for me though.

        I’m not a vegan, I’m trying it out for now. Not sure when I feel like stopping, but some of the comments with how offensive people are towards vegans and vegetarians is pretty ignorant and disgusting, just because of how they want to eat. I used to think like that myself though, mock what you dont understand. Im sure theres plenty of douche vegans out there who want to tell everyone how they should eat, but theres also plenty of the same who eat meat. Lets not tar everyone with the same brush eh?

        1. Dave.

          I’ll wish you luck, because it’s no skin off my nose what you eat. One week is not a reasonable trial period, either, no more than fasting for a week is indicative of the consequences of fasting for months..
          There are too many people in the Paleo/Primal and Carnivore communities who have tried veganism and (after initial benefits, because almost any transition to a whole-food from the standard western diet with its processed carbs and industrial seed oils is beneficial) seen their health deteriorate in the long term.

          But to claim that meat and sugar are interchangeable as far as Mark’s article is concerned – especially considering the amount of scientific material that Mark linked to – is not honest.

          “Game Changer” has been rigorously critiqued by any number of people with the relevant expertise. There is no reason why any one person should watch it for themselves if they are disinclined to do so.

  16. I’m totally with you on this. The plant-based everything crowd just flat out ignores reality.

    1. Agriculture, especially “big” agriculture is not somehow good for the environment. Soy ain’t gonna save us.
    2. Meat isn’t bad. Factory farming is, but that argument coming from people who want to replace it with soy? Okay. Hilarious.
    3. Plants don’t have everything your body needs. B-12, thanks for playing.
    4. Eating plants isn’t “cruelty free.” In addition to all the organisms that agriculture displaces, I’m still not entirely sure why killing an animal to survive is cruel but killing plants is fine. They are life. They respond to external stimulus. They have evolved to survive and avoid becoming dinner. Bring your lunch isn’t on most plants’ to-do list.
    5. Agriculture benefits from animal production. Rotational farming and, you know, the whole food web, symbiotic relationships, and the circle of life thing.

    On one hand I live in amazing times. I have access to so much communication and information. On the other hand I live in a time where Arnold “Pumping Iron” Schwarzenegger is shilling plant-based propaganda.

    And to those saying that commenting and critiquing something without watching it isn’t real science or something, give me a break. I’m sure you check out every single position documentary before dismissing it. The world has no shortage of ideas I already know have no bearing. I don’t need to waste an hour or two of my time consuming that stuff.

    Read papers with actual sources. Heck, I rarely care for documentaries about politically/socially charged topics anyway. It’s almost always one-sided emotional fluff. If I want to study any topic of that nature, give me a sourced paper so I can do some legitimate research.

    And there just isn’t any serious supporting evidence for this plant-based fantasy. I like my B-12. I like my saturated fats. I like my complete proteins. I want nothing to do with your health-killing and environment-ravaging PUFAs.

    The most important lesson I learned from the primal and paleo community when trying to make a variety of lifestyle, health, and dietary choices was to use evolution as a guide. Finally, my body is the laboratory. All the crap about weight gain, cholesterol, blood pressure, etc I was told by conventional wisdom in regards to how I East was wrong. Just wrong.

    More importantly, some five years in, it’s still wrong. I’m out of the born-again health phase that comes after dropping a ton of weight. Vegans do it too. Only difference is after several years my hair isn’t falling out and my wife and I are not having fertility issues.

    1. Hello there
      As a 10 year paleo/primal living person and having read pretty much every post Mark has written for the past 10 years (just so I don’t attract the vegan hate), I just wanted to clarify something.

      You mention B12. You are quite right in the fact that plants don’t contain B12 and meat does. However, in this case, context is everything.

      B12 is made by bacteria in the soil. In the past, ruminants got their B12 by eating plants with a bit of soil. Humans could get their B12 by eating meat, plants with a bit of soil and/or by drinking fresh water from clean rivers/streams. Since industrial agriculture and the widespread use of pesticides, the bacteria in the soil that produces B12 is no longer. So, now, plants with a bit of soil, do not contain B12.

      Now, the reason your meat has B12 in it is because the animals are given supplemental B12, either directly in the form of supplements or via fortified feed – ie they can no longer get it in the natural way by eating grass with soil on it, because there’s none in the soil.

      I’m not telling you not to eat meat, but the fact that meat has B12 and plants do not, isn’t really evidence of anything other than pesticides/ household bleach isn’t good for the environmental..

      I welcome informed debate on this topic – the vegan hate that seems to have permeated this thread has been depressing for me and I can only hope that those posts only represent a tiny minority of MDA readers – as I’ve always felt that this site has been a safe haven for informed and civilised discussion. Nobody has ever changed their mind by being abused and shouted at.

    1. Welcome them. Vegans and plant-based eaters are willing to do some pretty extreme stuff for their own health, and many believe they’re acting on current science. So, it’s good for everyone for them to have the exposure.

      1. Exactly my thought – be glad they have some exposure to paleo/primal. In the coming years, some of them may fall ill or just feel crummy and will decide to eat animal products again. Then, they may look on this information with new eyes.

        Remember that many of us here are former vegetarians or vegans who went through this already and found Primal living as a way to heal ourselves.

  17. Question asked and answered. It’s hilarious that anyone who has followed Mark’s body of work over the years, who as he noted has addressed this issue many many times, thinks he should take the time to watch that film. If you believe someone like Dean Ornish and his ilk really have something positive to offer, I don’t know what to tell you. Go full on plant-based if you want … you don’t need Mark’s blessing for that and no need to be derisive that he subscribes to an ancestral diet and doesn’t want to spend an hour-and-a-half of his time watching propaganda that is antithetical to that. I read some reviews of it and gleaned all the “facts” I needed to know.

  18. For all the idiotic hens saying “shame on Mark”, or some other nonsense. The guy has been putting out tons of high-quality, and free health and wellness content for many years, helped dozens of people achieve the health they want and stay there. You’ll have to forgive the guy for not wanting to indulge yet another agenda-driven, hack documentary. Not his job to refute every claim out there.

  19. Great answer for the omnivore question. One of the problems with the polarization is that we’re so busy arguing from vegan to carnivore, that the reason vegan started out is being ignored. In the 1990s, when I chose to become vegetarian and later vegan, the reason wasn’t nutrition. It was mercy. While we’re busy arguing nutrition, our slaughterhouses haven’t been made more merciful or cleaner, nor have the workers been given emotional support and in some cases not even decent financial remuneration. We haven’t reformed agriculture to give the animals a decent life yet. Or even a life that leads to healthier meat for us. We have work to do.

    I didn’t ask to live in a universe where I have to rely on an animal’s death in order to be healthy. I’d prefer not to. But to avoid meat is to self destruct and I won’t go that far. I won’t even limit meat consumption because my appetite tells me when I’ve had enough. Which is not something I can say about sugar. Sugar is a bottom less pit of cravings. Meat is self limiting because it makes you honestly full.

    1. Angelica.

      While I can understand the argument from empathy, I can’t respect it.

      Farmed animals generally live safer, more comfortable lives and die far less painful deaths. Most deaths in nature are painful. There are no hospitals, drugs or warm beds. Wild animals die from predation, disease, malnutrition, parasites and exposure. If I routinely permitted that to happen to my livestock, I would be prosecuted for cruelty …… and be bankrupt into the bargain.

      Well fed, contented animals grow faster, produce more and are MORE PROFITABLE. If you don’t trust my ethics, at least trust my sense of self-interest.

      We also know that stress at slaughter degrades meat. I is tougher and does not taste as good. We are not so stupid as to be heedless of the quality of our product.

      1. Not to mention the number of animals killed in agriculture; harvesting, loss prevention, habitat destruction.

      2. Can you tell me exactly what bothers you about what I said? I’m not sure that I see any disagreement in what we each have said. Except that I think meat processing and slaughter could be improved and you don’t. The recent immigrant raids on meat packing places should’ve opened everyone’s eyes to some of the issues. We have work to do and we’re too busy arguing vegan vs paelo.

        I do a lot of farm tours and several times I’ve had to hold my opinions because I didn’t want to get in the face of a farmer. Organic chickens being continuously fed grain. Therefore they don’t move around, but pick a victim and chase it until they’ve pecked that chicken bloody and sometimes to death. They do this because they are omnivores, they want that protein. They need forage space.

        I’ve watched organic cows on a dairy farm, properly in a field. Except the babies were crated and eating grain. One of them was mad with grief and butting the stall until it passed out. While I was there.

        Yes we can do better. People sometimes follow the letter of the Organic standard and miss the meaning of it.

        I’ve participated in a pig and a goat slaughtered in my life. I know what it takes. I don’t have the heart to visit a slaughterhouse. But there are reformers who do care and can stomach it. Usually in the permies community (permaculture), or in artisan farming. They don’t have expensive lobbyists. Here’s one of their blogs where he details his problems with pig slaughter and packing:

        So is he lying? Is there really no room for improvement? Or is this a knee jerk reaction to the ideas of subsidy and regulation?

        1. Angelica.

          Firstly… I’m in the ruminant grazing industry, so I won’t speak for other industries.

          Secondly, I suggest that you look at the work of Temple Grandin on design and function of handling facilities and abattoirs. We are way ahead of you.

          2. Strive to remember that for an animal , an abattoir is just another building. They react negatively to the
          unfamiliar, but anyone who has handled them much
          knows that they cannot anticipate the difference
          between a painless, beneficial medical procedure, and

          3… Again, remember that animals are not human. Applying emotional terms in relation to confinement or separation may do credit to your empathy, but not your common sense. YOU anticipate endless separation, loss or death. They do not and rapidly become accustomed to changed circumstances.

          Thirdly…. Animals are not people.

          1. I can’t agree that farming is ok the way it is, and I can’t agree that meat slaughter and processing has no room for improvement. No matter how often you insult my common sense, or I shame you about your lack of feeling, we won’t agree. Let’s try to be OK with that. Why are you so keen to get my agreement? I showed you where the system is inadequate and you reply with insults and derision? That’s a point to me I think. This wasn’t a discussion about whether animals are human. You brought that up.

    2. Angelica.

      You did not “show me” anything much.
      You cherry-picked a poor example and assumed that it applied across an entire industry without reference to th variation in practices.

      My first response was to your post on the reasons why you chose to be vegan in the past. To reiterate, I consider those arguments to be unfair and unrealistic. I should be able to give reasons in support of my argument, even if it does make yours look ridiculous.

  20. What everyone forgets about – James Cameron is a famous teller of fairy tales 🙂

    Whereas Mark is serious about facts and science concerning our bodies.

    So there is no need for him to watch it.
    It is also investment gains influenced propaganda, when you research it closer.

    Watch ‘Future Man’ , S01E07 “Pandora’s Mailbox” – you’ll get a thing or two about James Cameron 😀

    P.S. I’m not a regular in here, as a matter of fact it’s been years since my last visit – but see clearly that this place is under attack by some troll vegan army .. ;>
    How did they got here, one can wonder …

  21. My criteria are whenever a documentary mentions “ethics” or “sustainability” I know it’s vegan propaganda rather than science.

  22. I am disappointed in you not watching it as well.

    You are always so thorough in your POV vs defensive – even regarding endurance sports, marathon training etc.

    When I finished the movie I came here to see your response to Soy Imitations of Meat – the lack of archaeological evidence of plants/why, etc. and the argument on estrogen/soy on hormones and Pea Protein vs. whey, muscle recovery, blood tests.

    I would have a lot more respect to hear your point of view based on watching the actual movie.

    I have a fridge full of Primal Food dressings, mayonnaise and basically anything you’ve written/said. As a sponge of knowledge, I don’t know why an hour or more would be too much to reinforce your POV or counter argue theres.


    1. Janna….
      Mark is probably rather disappointed that you apparently did not bother to read the links he provided.

      He’s giving you information, and you seem to be demanding g that he do your thinking for you.

      Do the reading and – as he says – if you still have questions, get back to him.

  23. Admittedly, I got sucked into Game Changers and started to question my dedication to Primal living.
    The document completely lost credibility for me when they showed plant based diet athletes and included Tom Brady. Yes his diet, from what I have read, is plant based and he eats protein from animal sources.
    Mark Sisson recommends plant based meals, Big Ass salad anyone?!

    1. All diets are plant based. OK, some of the jellies I ate in college could have be manufactured from oil or coal tar, but plants are the primary producers, for most of everything we eat.

  24. The biggest problem I have with this response (or lack of one), is that we now live in a society where the crybabies are winning: if you moan and stamp your feet long and hard enough (whether you’re right or wrong), eventually the lawmakers will give in to your demands. And that’s what worries me about veganism as a movement; it’s a genuine threat to our way of life, and indeed our health. We need more documentaries countering the vegan propaganda (or we need at least for the existing ones to be promoted a lot more vigorously in the mainstream media). The Paleo movement’s viewpoint (and the science that supports it) carry an enormous amount of clout, but far too few people have even heard of it.

    Also, it’s remarkable how many vegans have suddenly crawled out of the woodwork to troll this post.

  25. It’s amazing to me that there is such opposing views on eating meat or not eating meat, research or none, evolution or creation… just take a look around you. Your family and relatives, your friends and acquaintances especially the older ones. Who are the healthiest, who are living or lived the longest? What did they do? What did they eat? Figure it out based on your nearest circle of influence what may work best for you! Then let your body be your guide! Personally, I had great grandparents that grew all their own veggies, ate eggs every day from their own chickens, ate some of those chickens, ate beef & pork from my uncle’s farm, milk and cheese that those cows produced. They ate fish when they could, usually caught in the lakes and rivers nearby. (They lived in Southern Alberta Canada) She lived to 106 & he lived to 96! Their kids (my grandparents) lived into their 90’s. Most of my family members have lived into their 80’s & 90’s except for 1 grandmother at 70. She unfortunately was obese. Loved eating sugar in all forms, candy, cookies etc. Loved her bread and pasta. Look at Mark Sisson, an amazing example of health and vitality at age 65! We really don’t need to look back thousands or millions of years. Look around you and figure out what works for you!!!

  26. I understand why the tone of Mark’s dismissal may have upset some of you folks, but the dismissal itself is completely justified for the following reasons:

    1. Mark’s job is to stay on top of all current research about a variety of health/wellness/diet topics. The source data used in the film would presumably be something Mark has already seen and scrutinized on this website.

    2. If the source research in the film is not the most current or relevant research into the topic, then the the film is irrelevant on its face.

    There would simply be no reason to see the film if the data has already been scrutinized elsewhere on this website and it’s unlikely any new data was presented. If new data was presented, it would only be a matter of time until Mark addresses it here.

  27. When I read or hear someone talk about how humans were not designed (or did not evolve) to eat/digest meat, I have to consider that about 60 years or so ago, the common body was considerably less overweight. Just go back and look at old news reels or television shows that had the general public in them. I know that in the show “I Love Lucy”, Ethel was considered fat. Not today, at least by comparison. So did the human digestive system change in less than 100 years or did the way food was raised and processed change? The move back to grass fed meat is good, so that indicates that there were changes in how meat was raised. But the changes in non-meat food must have had (and continues to have) a huge impact on the human body. I would bet that when someone goes vegetarian (and certainly vegan), they pay close attention to the labels and what goes into what they are eating. So it’s complicated, and it’s not really as black and white as humans would like for it to be. Mark – thanks for having the guts to write what you believe and not be concerned with the reactions from others.

  28. The Biggest takeaway I got from watching the Gamechangers was how everyone of the Atheletes were eating Artificial Meat Substituites in order to stick to the Plant Based Diet. This is processed food far from natural. If you look at the ingredients of the Beyond Meat Burger it is essentially the same as Dog Food. No thanks. Obviously they are craving real meat and have to Foll or trick themselves to stick to this Diet. Also the reason the Gladiators were mostly Vegan is because they were Slaves and meat wouldn`t be wasted on them as they were expendable.

  29. We did evolve eating an omnivorous diet. But I don’t think it’s correct to say that our species history should dictate our current choices – after all, we now live in houses and have eyeglasses, amongst other things.

    I especially don’t believe it’s good to look to our pre-civilization history to decide moral questions (and every vegan I’ve talked to is a vegan for moral reasons). Those same arguments have been used to excuse rape, and I don’t think you’d agree with *that*.

    Personally, I don’t think veganism is good for the environment. I think eating a lot less meat *is*, though. I also enjoy eating meat a lot, and it is highly tempting to accept your arguments at face value even knowing it’s motivated reasoning.

    None of this says you have to go look at the documentary, of course. They’re using motivated reasoning at least as much as we are. I just don’t think we should use evolution to answer moral questions, that’s all ?

    1. Hear, hear. Well said.
      Now we drive cars and turn on our heat or A/C. We are not always using our bodies to go from place to place, the soil and water are drastically different today. There weren’t billions of people in a warming and polluted planet. We weren’t literally killing off species in and out of the ocean. Different times and lifestyles, call for new ways of looking at food and our place in the natural world.

  30. I’m not a proponent of veganism but found a lot of value in the documentary. The purpose was not to promote people being vegan, but to encourage people to eat more plant based meals throughout the week. The takeaway, which I think you’d agree with Mark, is that we should eat more vegetables. You may not agree with this part, but many of us eat way too much meat. I was eating bacon in the morning, a 12 oz chicken breast for lunch and a 16 oz ribeye for dinner. That wasn’t healthy for me, and it probably isn’t for many people. I just cut the meat consumption down by half and replaced with more veggies. I don’t think many people in your field would argue that that was a bad move.

  31. Hi Mark,

    I was one of the first people to buy your book when it came out and also purchased the most recent edition. I am a big fan of your exercise and outlook on life but I think ignoring the facts and scientific data for the past 40 years regarding the value of a plant-based diet is very short-sighted. What if you found you could improve your health and longevity by making a change? Would that be bad?

    If you won’t watch “Game Changers” why not read the Scientific American article on November 13, 2019, Human Ancestors Were Nearly All Vegetarians?

    Here is a list of fact-based research including PubMed.Gov where all the research gets published.
    I don’t expect my post to change your mind or many of your followers (of which I was one until I did my own research) but it can potentially improve peoples health while being good for the planet.

    For your review:

    Food as Medicine, Michael Greger, M. D.

    Dr. John McDougall and Dr. Michael Gregor April 25, 2019

    Rip Esselstyn (Former Fire Fighter) Plant Strong and Healthy Living – Austin Firehouse

    Dr. John McDougall, MD, Interviews Dr. Dean Ornish, MD (note I got 4 min in, need to resume)

    Keto Diets: Are they Safe

    Is the Ketogenic Diet Safe? Lee Crosby, R.D.

    1. Thanks for this commentary and links. Meat-eating, especially in the amounts and way folks do it, is horrible for our planet and thus for us. I’m always looking for ways to stay healthy while living conscientiously. Fermentation and slowing on both grains and animal products make a lot of sense.

  32. Well, I did watch Game Changers and was surprised and frankly impressed by the number of professional athletes that cut out meat (all meat, this was definitely NOT about red meat) and their performance improved greatly. As for the increased penis size . . . well I’m going to let that go.

  33. Wow, this rant has more confirmation bias that most religions. Intellectually inductive and mis-informed.

  34. Is there something wrong with eating more beans and lentils instead of a ground beef?

    The main idea I got from this movie is that you don’t have to eat meat to get strong. Plants have all the protein you need to build muscle. That’s the biggest and most important thing I got from it.

    After watching the movie, I decided to look into what proteins and amino acids were. I didn’t know the difference. I didn’t realize that by all plants have varying amounts of the nine amino acids needed to make a protein. By combining a couple plants, such as beans and rice, we can make a complete protein. I realized what a dumba** I was by thinking only eggs and meat had protein.

    Go ahead an eat all the meat you want, I will not complain. I will continue to eat meat, although I will focus more on fish, which has more omega-3’s to help with reducing inflammation.

    Did you watch the Joe Rogan episode with Kressler? If you did, make sure to watch the episode with both Wilkes and Kressler. It’s good. A couple things to point out:
    – Kressler admitted that eating plants help reduce the oxidative stress that eating meat causes (which means that eating meat causes oxidative stress)
    – Kressler made sure to say 90% fat free meat (I ask why not 80% fat free? Is it because animal fat is not good for you?)

    By the way, the Amazon rainforest is being cut down to make room for farming cows. And the treatment of many cows and chickens that we keep for food is not good. That’s not in dispute. Am I self rightous? No, I had a tuna sandwich for lunch and beef kabob for dinner. I’m just eating much less of of it when I can.

    I invite you to watch it. It’s entertaining. Do you think the average person would get hurt by adopting their meal plans? If you’re a keto star, stay keto, it’s working right? If the average person who has an unhealthy diet can now choose the plant based diet as recommended on their website or the keto diet, wouldn’t either choice help out?

  35. Mark
    You are a cool guy. I have a lot of respect for you on many levels.
    If listened to you on YouTube multiple times and I recently watched the trailer to “Game Changers”.
    It seems to me that vegans are more liberal and “progressive” in their thinking (in general) and carnivores (yes, now no carb guys) would appear to be more conservative politically or even Trumpian. In a recent YouTube you claimed that those associated with “Game Changers” are the “left wing Hollywood elite”. That’s a political mantra are it’s tightly associated with highly conservative thinking. Just like with climate change the politics has us divided. You’d think nutrition would have been able to sidestep politics. It hasn’t.