Why Grains Are Unhealthy
I find that grain bashing makes for a tasty, but ultimately unsatisfying meal.
You all know how much I love doing it, though. But no matter how often I sit down to dine on the stuff (and I’ve done it with great gusto in the past), I always leave the table feeling like I left something behind. Like maybe I wasn’t harsh enough about the danger of gluten, or I failed to really convey just how much I hated lectins. If I didn’t know better, I’d think the mere mention of grains was eliciting a crazy insulin-esque response and throwing my satiety hormones all out of whack. I was filling up on anti-grain talk, but I just couldn’t fill that void for long.
Well, I’ve got the hunger today, and this time I aim to stuff myself to the point of perpetual sickness. I don’t ever want to have to look at another anti-grain argument again (yeah, right). If things get a little disjointed, or if I descend into bullet points and sentence fragments, it’s only because the hunger has taken over and I’ve decided to dispense with the pleasantries in order to lay it all out at once.
So please, bear with me.
Apart from maintaining social conventions in certain situations and obtaining cheap sugar calories, there is absolutely no reason to eat grains. Believe me – I’ve searched far and wide and asked everyone I can for just one good reason to eat cereal grains, but no one can do it. They may have answers, but they just aren’t good enough. For fun, though, let’s see take a look at some of the assertions:
“You need the fiber!”
Okay, for one: no, I don’t. If you’re referring to its oft-touted ability to move things along in the inner sanctum, fiber has some unintended consequences. A few years back, scientists found that high-fiber foods “bang up against the cells lining the gastrointestinal tract, rupturing their outer covering” which “increases the level of lubricating mucus.” Err, that sounds positively awful. Banging and tearing? Rupturing? These are not the words I like to hear. But wait! The study’s authors say, “It’s a good thing.” Fantastic! So when all those sticks and twigs rub up against my fleshy interior and literally rupture my intestinal lining, I’ve got nothing to worry about. It’s all part of the plan, right?
Somehow, I’m not convinced that a massive daily infusion of insoluble grain fiber is all that essential. And that “lubricating mucus” sounds an awful like the mucus people with irritable bowel syndrome complain about. From personal experience I can tell you that once I completed my exodus from grains, the IBS completely stopped. If you’re not yet convinced on the fiber issue I’ll refer you to Konstantin Monastyrsky’s Fiber Menace. Anyway, there’s plenty of fiber in the vegetables and fruit I eat. Which takes me to the next claim:
“You need the vitamins and minerals!”
You got me. I do need vitamins and minerals, like B1 and B2, magnesium and iron, zinc and potassium. But do I need to obtain them by eating a carb-heavy, bulky grain? No, no I don’t. You show me a serving of “healthy whole grains” that can compete – nutrient, vitamin, and mineral-wise – with a Big Ass Salad. What’s that? Can’t do it? Thought so.
“But it forms the foundation of the governmental food pyramid!”
You know, I should have just started the entire post with this one. I could have saved my fingers the trouble of typing and your eyes the trouble of reading. Governmental endorsements are not points in your favor, grain-eater; they are strikes against you. An appeal to authority (unless that “authority” is actually a preponderance of scientific evidence, of course) does not an effective argument make. Conventional Wisdom requires consistent, steady dissection and criticism if it is to be of any value.
There’s a reason grains are first and foremost on the list of foods to avoid when following the Primal Blueprint: they are completely and utterly pointless in the context of a healthy diet. In fact, if your average unhealthy person were to ask for the top three things to avoid in order to get healthy, I would tell them to stop smoking, to stop drinking their calories (as soda or juice), and to stop eating grains. Period. Full stop. They really are that bad.
I’ve mentioned this time and again, but the fundamental problem with grains is that they are a distinctly Neolithic food that the human animal has yet to adapt to consuming. In fact, cereal grains figured prominently in the commencement of the New Stone Age; grains were right there on the forefront of the agricultural revolution. Hell, they were the agricultural revolution – einkorn wheat, emmer, millet, and spelt formed the backbone of Neolithic farming. They could be stored for months at a time, they were easy enough to grow in massive enough quantities to support a burgeoning population, and they promoted the construction of permanent settlements. Oh, and they were easily hoarded, meaning they were probably an early form of currency (and, by extension, a potential source of income inequality). And here’s the kicker: they were harsh, tough things that probably didn’t even taste very good. It also took a ton of work just to make them edible, thanks to their toxic anti-nutrients.
Toxic anti-nutrients? Do tell.
Living things generally do not want to be consumed by other living things. Being digested, for the most part, tends to interrupt survival, procreation, propagation of the species – you know, standard stuff that fauna and flora consider pretty important. To avoid said consumption, living things employ various self defense mechanisms. Rabbits, for example, with their massive ears, considerable fast-twitch muscle fibers, and nasty claws, can usually hear a predator coming, outrun (out-hop?) nearly anything, and (in a pinch) slash a tender belly to shreds. Blue whales are too big to fit into your mouth, while porcupines are walking reverse pincushions. Point is, animals have active defense mechanisms. They run, fight, jump, climb, fly, sting, bite, and even appeal to our emotions (if you’ve ever seen a puppy beg for a treat with sad eyes, you know that isn’t just accidental cuteness) in order to survive. All the while, predators are constantly evolving and generating adaptations.
Plants, though, are passive organisms without the ability to move, think, and react (for the most part). They must employ different tactics to ensure propagation, and they generally have to rely on outside forces to spread their seed. And so various methods are “devised” to dissuade consumption long enough for the seed to get to where it’s going. Nuts have those tough shells, and grains have the toxic anti-nutrients, lectins, gluten, and phytates. (Of course there are some obvious exceptions. Fruits are tasty, nutritious, and delicious so that animals will eat them whole and poop out the seeds, preferably into some fertile soil. The seed stays intact throughout the digestive process; it is indigestible by design. No seed “wants” to be digested, because this would defeat the purpose. They “want” to be swallowed, or borne by the wind, or carried by a bee to the next flower, but they do not want to be digested.)
Some animals are clearly adapted to grain consumption. Birds, rodents, and some insects can deal with the anti-nutrients. Humans, however, cannot. Perhaps if grains represented a significant portion of our ancestral dietary history, things might be a bit different. Some of us can digest dairy, and we’ve got the amylase enzyme present in our saliva to break down starches if need be, but we simply do not have the wiring necessary to mitigate the harmful effects of lectins, gluten, and phytate.
Lectins are bad. They bind to insulin receptors, attack the stomach lining of insects, bind to human intestinal lining, and they seemingly cause leptin resistance. And leptin resistance predicts a “worsening of the features of the metabolic syndrome independently of obesity”. Fun stuff, huh?
Gluten might be even worse. Gluten, found in wheat, rye, and barley, is a composite of the proteins gliadin and glutenin. Around 1% of the population are celiacs, people who are completely and utterly intolerant of any gluten. In celiacs, any gluten in the diet can be disastrous. We’re talking compromised calcium and vitamin D3 levels, hyperparathyroidism, bone defects. Really terrible stuff. And it gets worse: just because you’re not celiac doesn’t mean you aren’t susceptible to the ravages of gluten. As Stephan highlights, one study showed that 29% of asymptomatic (read: not celiac) people nonetheless tested positive for anti-gliadin IgA in their stool. Anti-gliadin IgA is an antibody produced by the gut, and it remains there until it’s dispatched to ward off gliadin – a primary component of gluten. Basically, the only reason anti-gliadin IgA ends up in your stool is because your body sensed an impending threat – gluten. If gluten poses no threat, the anti-gliadin IgA stays in your gut. And to think, most Americans eat this stuff on a daily basis.
Phytates are a problem, too, because they make minerals bio-unavailable (so much for all those healthy vitamins and minerals we need from whole grains!), thus rendering null and void the last, remaining argument for cereal grain consumption.
What, then, is the point to all this grain madness? Is there a good reason for anyone (with access to meat, fruit, and vegetables, that is) to rely on cereal grains for a significant portion of their caloric intake?
The answer is unequivocally, undeniably no. We do not need grains to survive, let alone thrive. In fact, they are naturally selected to ward off pests, whether they be insects or hominids. I suggest we take the hint and stop eating them.
And with that, I’m done. I don’t think I could eat another bite.
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Posted By: Mark Sisson
Very timely, as I read this in my school’s buffet. I’m going to grab some more salad!
Sounds like a wonderful idea! There is nothing like a good ole primal salad
I can’t believe I just read this article…
It is a MUST READ for anyone who thinks grains are good for them! I will be passing this around the web like crazy
While I feel it’s probably right, it surely isn’t a must read. That is, unless your must read criteria favors feelings and cute parenthetical usage over evidence and citations.
Hello all,
I recently discovered this blog and have found it very interesting. There is a growing body of evidence that suggests a link between grain consumption and chronic degenerative diseases. I’m interested in the link between lectins from grains (specifically legumes) and neurodegenrative diseases such as dystonia and other movement disorders. Does anyone out there have information about this or know of anyone who has successfully treated their dystonia by adopting a Paleo-diet? Thanks….
Ah, grains, ie. cereal grains, are not legumes. Peas, beans, alfalfa, carob, soy, peanuts. They are plants in the Fabaceae family. Cereal grains are grasses in the monocat family Poaceae.
My husband and I recently embarked on a “healthier” alternative lifestyle just over a month ago…and when I say alternative, it’s due to the fact that it is not your average American diet including cereal, pasta, bread and “whole grains.” In fact, we eliminated grains completely and have been enjoying lean protein, vegetables and some fruits. In this past month, I have lost 11 lbs. (that I have been trying to lose the past two years) and my husband has lost 18 lbs. Now, I’m not promoting this as a “diet plan” because while that certainly was a nice side affect it was not our goal. I used to have serious gastrointestinal issues and migraines on a weekly basis. My husband used to have cravings where he would get up in the middle of the night, go to the kitchen and eat half a loaf of bread, not able to able to stop himself. After purging our bodies from the wheat/gluten, my problems have literally disappeared and my husbands cravings are gone. It sounds miraculous, I know…but this little scientific experiment that we tried on ourselves has definitely convinced us. We love our new Paleo-lifestyle and will never go back!
It really is amazing to me that our government pushes everyone to eat something so bad for you just so they can make billions of dollars a year. They know its bad for us, they just dont care. I am a veteran and after 1 particular tour in Iraq i all of a sudden had asthma. I was sent for tons of tests that came up inconclusive and they ended up giving me an inhaler an advair neither of which helped. After 2 years of using meds that didnt work and all types of tests nothing worked and i felt awful whenever i worked out. Fastforward to Crossfit….i started doing it with Seal Team 5 on a deployment and it was great, but i still felt like crap during workouts. I started going to and actual Crossfit gym and they taught me about eating Paleo. Within 4 weeks of being grain, dairy, and sugar free my asthma was GONE!!! Not only that but my energy levels increased, and i was sleeping more soundly through the night, and now ill be 40 next year and i am one of the top performing athletes in our gym. So good for you guys going Paleo and tell the world about it like i do. Everyone i meet and will give me a chance i tell them about the Paleo diet.
Gave up gluten because daughter gets rashes and who knows what else internally and have noticed improvements in my health as well. For instance, with my last pregnancy i didn’t gain as much weight or get swollen ankles and stuff. But i also don’t eat meat, except wildcaught seafood and eggs. and i don’t eat dairy. also don’t eat HFCS. so i’m questioning if it’s the gluten free that is responsible for me being healthy. Also i eat a lot of rice and corn because it doesn’t have gluten. Is rice and corn restricted in this diet? what about beans? we eat lots of beans (too much).
Arrepientanse hippies, todo lo que comen les hace da~o porque viven en una vida llena de pecado y por eso tienen miedo de comer lo que Dios creo para nuestro bien….ustedes le dicen malo a lo que Dios dice bueno. Estan enfermos por pecadores NO por comer gluten o granos. Arrepientanse!
LOL
cálmate wey
god didn’t create modern grains, people did by taking entirely inedible grasses and turning them into edible, albeit indigestible grains like wheat etc.
I have been learning more about the paleo diet from a friend of mine. My experience is in veganism and macrobiotics, and as I am learning more about our excess grain consumption as a society, what you say Marion really makes sense to me. You can pick an apple or pluck a lettuce leaf and it is ready to eat, but wheat or rice pulled from the ground are certainly not!
while I am on the fence about the whole grain issue I have to say Jesus Christ did eat bread did he not? I mean cavemen didn’t eat “salads” they didn’t eat fruit salads either. They didn’t eat nearly many of the things we eat today. They just weren’t available. So should we assume eating chinese, italian are bad too? I think the problem with the whole grains is that they are “bulking” up too much of most peoples meals. too many carbs and fiber. Instead of a bowl of cereal maybe some eggs and a piece of toast? Or a cup of cereal and some eggs? I have to admit that i haven’t eaten any cereal within a couple days and I don’t feel normal either… Should I eat more yogurt for that? how about those nuts that are bad for you too? maybe we shouldn’t eat anything because too much veggies and fruit are bad too? i think our modern day human life style completely strips us of our natural instinct for survival. If caveman saw a wheat field and he was hungry I bet he’d try and eat it if a nice buffalo wasn’t available. Why do Possums and rats snack on our food garbage? survival!
god didnt make the computer you’re sitting at.
or the polyester your wearing.
oh, and if it’s cotton you’re wearing, well remember, just like grains, cotton plants were harvested too.
this article is bogus.
and honestly, calling us hippy sinners? and that we’re only sick because we’re sinners? i can only presume you’re joking, otherwise take your zeal and stuff it where the sun don’t shine!
I think you have missed the fact that humans has been around for more than 100 000 years. Jesus christ was born 2012 years ago.
Anyone who believes in the christian god please explain why god was slacking at least 98000 of those years before he decided to sacrifice his son?
Ok. Grains are bad, too much sugar is bad, a bit of sugar is bad, salt is bad, milk is bad, gluten is bad, egg is bad, meat is bad (acoording to some people), being vegetarian is bad (according to other people), everything you like is bad and what you don’t like, but got used to them, became bad.
The problem is not what we eat but how we eat. How we mentally accept food as a good thing – or not. How we don’t feel guilty when we eat some things, how we start creating all kind of illness just after eating something we think is bad. Ten years ago we used to believe eggs were good for us, now the called modern science tell us they are bad. Everything can be bad if you trully believe they are bad.
I am not saying we should go and eat all the unhealthy food we can find. Of course we want to leave more and more, being able to share life with our grandchildren and, if is possible, with their kids too. But we cannot feel guity for everything people say is bad for you. What is bad for you may be good for me. It’s just the way we think, which way more powerfull than any diet you can find.
Or how would you explain that French people smoke more and still live longer than Americans? or that Italians and Germans drink more and also live longer?
(http://www.unnaturalcauses.org/assets/uploads/file/quiz_answers_only.pdf)
Again, lets pay attention to the way we see things, the way we believe something is bad or not to us. We don’t need to get totally crazy eating junk food, but also there is no point of liiving life when you can’t enjoy an amazing pasta full of grains and a beautiful grass of wine full of sugar. Life is just meant to be enjoyed.
I think we were meant to eat meat, veggies, and fruit, and even some dairy. I don’t think there is anything wrong with eating eggs (mainly because I don’t believe modern science is on our side, and anything approved by the government is a sham and a lie and a way to put more money in their pockets).
Life IS enjoyable without grains. My life is a living HELL with grains.
If you have never felt the feeling of a thousand hot burning sharp razor blades traveling slowly through your intestines, and the sudden diarrhea at the worst possible times, the migraines, the stomach cramping worse than any menstrual cramp I’ve ever had, and constantly feeling nauseated….then you shouldn’t say or assume that life with no grain is not enjoyable, because for some of us it feels like a painful, slow death.
I don’t think we were MEANT for eating anything specific. We have evolved and so our bodies has had more time to adapt to eating meat, veggies and fruit.
What you’ve just said is one of the most insanely idiotic things I have ever heard. At no point in your rambling, incoherent response were you even close to anything that could be considered a rational thought. Everyone in this room is now dumber for having listened to it. I award you no points, and may God have mercy on your soul.
I love your comment
What are we going to do, which most of the people we know and love would probably throw stones as if we tell them not only should they not eat grains, but no nuts and no seeds.
I, fortunately, met Wil Spencer of Body Electrician and I learned from him most of what you share here. I was having unbelievable digestion problems, IBS etc. Spent $1,000s on all manner of probiotics, but when I eliminated the grains etc., with days I saw immediate improvement.
Now I a working on repopulating my gut and restoring it after all the damage I have done for so long.
thanks
Very well said. When I spoke to one of fellow nurses about my dietary habits and explained that i don’t eat grains or potatoes legumes etc, she said “but how do you get your starches” like it was some sort of required food group. And this from a NURSE. She should know better, but many don’t because they just spit out what they are taught. And therein lies our problem…
That’s because she’s learned it from the doctor.
Well-we are subject to the media, government and big pharma(which has our gvt in its pocket)..I instruct nurses and med students..they are not physiologists. They are not given enough information on what is dietarily necessary. They are preprogramed before entering study to have the same adulterated view of what is “good” and “necessary” for existance. This includes some cancer meds and many medicines overall. Big pharma, plus government control of the FDA and media..hmm..what makes the world go around? Could it be money? Come on-
Thank you, Melissa!! You, for one, are a very aware of what’s going on around you and not hypnotized by our media, government and big industries that capitalize off of the bad health of the public. You also realize the the Federal Reserve is a private banking corporation, not part of the government at all? The Federal Reserve is the puppet master; all of the big industries and the government are far below them. I wonder what their agenda is??? Hmmm, you and I and a few others are well aware but most others are blind to their own demise.
Hmm, like the “alternative” health industry isn’t worth billions of dollars also? Like that whole area isn’t full of quacks and scam artists trying to part the desperate and ignorant from their hard earned money? C’mon yourself.
To be honest you sound a lot like my mum, who didn’t believe in getting pap smears because it’s all about “big pharma” playing on our fears. Hey, she eats all organic, is fit and meditates- what could possibly go wrong?
Now she has stage 3 cervical cancer and wont do the chemo- apparently peroxide and mega vitamin C injections do the same job >:[
People like you who bad mouth modern medicine make me so angry- go live in a third world country and watch your kid die of an infection that a good dose of antibiotics could have fixed, or watch your loved one die in childbirth or get cancer without any access to decent treatment and then whinge about how ~evil~ big pharma and modern medicine are.
You bloody idiot.
You are aware that a doctoral degrees require a compulsory 25hrs of nutrition in between 7-10 years of study. Surveys of American instutions found the majority manage less than 20hrs. Is the suggestion is that Doctors are some sort of authority on nutrition??
Realize that a lot of these nurses are taking this from actual classes, real professionals and researchers, not reading it online where anybody can post anything quite obviously.
Ummm…well Doctors take about a days worth of nutritional classes in the 4-8 years of medical school. That really isn’t good. Look it up. My husband works at a hospital (security) and has been told how much nutrition classes they’ve had, and they’ve said about 8 hours while they were in medical school. Anything over and above that(for them personally has been little to none), they had to learn on their own. But let me ask you, if you’re not taught to learn about nutrition in school to be a doctor or nurse, then why would you think that’s important to study once out of medical school? You’d probably think, I’ve already been taught what I was suppose to know about the human body, now it’s my job to keep up with the newest drugs coming out, and diseases, not the cause. Because that’s what they teach you in school. They are symptom chasers. I do believe Doctors have they’re place, if you’re having a heart attack, please go see a doctor. But if you have cancer, diabetes, high blood pressure, ect. please contact your local herbal doctor and talk to them about the problem. They will take care of it through natural remides. Also I do suggest coming to this site, and reading the blogs.
How many more hospitals and ER rooms have to be filled, before we get the hint…they don’t know how to cure us. The know how to stick us with needles, and pump us full of drugs our bodies don’t know what to do with. It’s so sad to see. My heart goes out to everyone who takes the Dr.s advice and gets worse. Yes Dr.s have helped people, but if it wasn’t for the conventional wisdom of, you’re sick go see a Dr. we wouldn’t be in that position to be saved. If we just took the time to research, how much greater our lives would be. Yes we’ve had our share of ER visits, my son has a bowl problem, why? Because of his old diet. We’re on a new road, and it’s going to take time, but I’m certain this is the road to recovery. Thanks Mark for posting this, and all the others. Everyone has given me much food for thought.
Dr’s may only get about 8 hours of nutrition training but nurses get an entire semester, we know better.
oh well said! I always trust the advice of security guards over a medical professional.
Everyone! Relieve the global strain on health systems while solving the overpopulation issue, see security guards and herbal charlatans for all your ailments!
Cancer and ‘herbal remedies’ should *never* be used in the same sentence. Anybody recommending such tripe should be exorcised, for they surely have a demon living inside their noggin.
this isn’t so much a response to esther as it is to ‘littleone’ and ‘tyler’.
it’s so disappointing to see such unenlightenment from people that have managed to stray so radically from the diet ‘prescribed’ by the government and health ‘authorities’ – the same people that want to prescribe you a drug for every ailment, needless to say those which include the ‘conventional’ cancer treatments.
if you’ve got enough stomach to make it to the end, i think you’ll be Very surprised with what you find and maybe, just maybe, you’ll be the ones telling all Your family, friends, colleagues, teachers, acquaintances, and anybody you bump into on the street about Budwig, Hoxsey, Pauling, Gerson, Simoncini etc. Some of which happened to be awarded the Nobel Prize for their work, only to thereafter have their studies obstructed by the the major pharma-corps of their day.
Aside from the fact that Esther did not say ‘herbal rememdies’, she said ‘NATURAL remedies’, if you had done any research on ‘natural cancer cures’ the way you had done on the paleo-diet, you’d know that these cures are based on diet, not ‘herbs’.
Having said that, do not under estimate the value/power of ‘herbs’. I’m sure i read an article on here where Mark promotes the use of fresh ‘herbs’ and spices? Definitely better used as preventative medicine rather than remedies but even mushrooms have been shown, in actual Scientific studies, carried out with ‘licensed’ medical professionals and doctors, to suppress the growth of cancer.
You have so much faith that we evolved to live on a certain diet, that this diet can reverse diseases which kill many and optimize how we function as animals, why is it so far fetched that we evolved to ‘heal’ ourselves with the [natural] medicines available to us directly from the environment around us as opposed to the medicines only available to us several hundred thousands years later, on the other side of an industrial revolution/pharma-cornucopia?
lol, with all my ranting, i forgot to post the link [that i hope Everyone will have the stomach, and the patience, to watch to the end - i.e. part 6]
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2DW-twcOQcE
of course, same applies here. don’t believe everything you read/hear/see. do the research yourself.
Stent: 8 hrs means 8 credit hours which is usually two semesters. One semester is 3 to 4 credit hrs.
Chiropractors take an entire year of nutrition courses… Not all Dr’s are created equal…
Just so you know, speaking from experience, doctors aren’t stupid. There are definitely some bad ones, but most of them really are trying to help. I’ve been lucky enough to get a couple of true professionals. Yes, they have stuck me with needles, and yes they prescribe medicine, but it all has a legitimate purpose. I’m diabetic, and without my doctor I’d be dead. I wouldn’t trust anyone else (outside myself and my family) more with my life. I know you are probably coming from a valid history of bad experience with doctors, but I just wanted to defend them a little bit. You just have to find the good ones.
I agree. Dr.’s are scaling their patients so they have to return, its all about the money now..
your so stupid
you’re a moron.
I agree with what you share about food. I am eating a paleo diet and feel great. Please don’t direct people to “herbal doctors” stating they will “take care of it” for serious medical and health issues. Sometimes they can, my friend died foregoing traditional western medicine treatments for herbs. Sometimes herbs work; great! You can’t deny that chemo has saved thousands of lives. It’s a delicate choice; herbal doctors are a great source toward recovery from treatments such as chemo.
My dad died just over a year ago from cancer ALL THANKS to the “dr’s” for killing him. We found out to late he could have naturally been cured. I am 32 and both parents are dead from cancer. I have learned a great lesson though, and I know my parents are happy about that. But to know the could have been saved is such a sad thing and I try to tell as many as I can that not all doctors are there to “help” you, and to do your research first. Anything you want is right here online or get a natural doc. Cancer docs are a scam EAT more milkshakes, high fat food, and here eat this candy while you get your chemo and don’t forget to grab a free soda while your at it. I know its not my fault but I listened to the doc when he said those things to my dad and I gave them to him not knowing it was only feeding his cancer. After chemo sometimes he would need a $6,000 shot to bring his immune system back up. WONDER WHY??? I sure do feel bad I did not look into it further on my own before it was to late. It has changed my husband and my life big time though and I am very thankful for that. One of the best things I learned is about the ozone machine and everyone should get one and use it!
Thanks for your post Esther:)
Perhaps it was an older nurse? or doctor? do you really think that once they graduated 20-30 years ago they kept up on the research?
I have a B.Sc. Neuroscience, and M.Sc. Physical Therapy… yes, I’m a health professional. And I did LOTS of study on nutrition, biochemistry, exercise physiology. And this post makes sense.
So…. I guess I didn’t pay attention to those “real” professionals and researchers, right?
The YouTube video above has been removed by the user. Why is that?
I am new so be gentle but I read some of this stuff and wonder why you people instantly buy into what is said. A lot of crap is out on the market. You can not believe everything you read. You should do your own research and find 3 reliable trusted sources to back up anything that Mark or anyone else says before you but into it. Just my opinion. How do you know what he says is true? Just because he read or conducted a study you do not know the confines of the study etc… spend some time before you make rash statements.
I’ve done the research. I’ve also applied it. You can’t deny the evidence I have – a more than 90 pound weight loss with no effort, cravings, or hunger; cessation of migraines, IBS and arthritis; normalization of blood sugars and cholesterol levels; increased energy; better sleep – the list goes on and on. I didn’t “instantly buy into” anything.
3 reliable trusted sources? Let me introduce you to the shelf of about thirty books on diet and nutrition that I’ve read (and I know there’s thirty or so, because I just unpacked them from moving boxes in my new place). I’m not an idiot and neither are the other folks who’ve taken up Mark’s way of eating. We’re the smart ones, and we’ll live longer and healthier than anyone else on the planet.
My statements are founded in science and my own experience over the last eleven months. They’re the farthest thing from “rash.”
Completely unwarranted attack, Griff. Your anecdote isn’t a counterargument to what sara suggested. You don’t represent the people she’s talking about; you’ve done your research. Are you everyone that has read, is reading, and will read this article? No.
“We’re the smart ones, and we’ll live longer and healthier than anyone else on the planet.”
Congratulations.
“My statements are founded in science and my own experience over the last eleven months.” As Erin writes below, a lot of the science on nutrition takes a long time to pan out. I bet a lot of your 30 books were based one epidemiological studies, most of which do anything but provide proof contributing to the efficacy of a particular way of eating.
*shrug* Whatever, “empty”. In addition to the science, I’ve also got the proof of my own experience – so if you choose to eat things that will poison you, that is so beyond “not my problem” that it’s not even in this solar system.
The scientific experiment of the last sixty years – of low-fat high-carb eating and health – has FAILED. The science of the last sixty years shows this conclusively. Our grandparents and their parents and their grandparents, all the way back to Grok, ate the way that Primal people do now, and they all lived into their 80s and 90s, usually in at least decent health. Our parents, on the other hand, ate the low-fat high-carb way, and started dropping like flies in their 40s and 50s from heart disease, diabetes, cancer, and stroke. Hmmm. I see a connection there.
There is zero proof that this newfangled low-fat high-carb method of eating works, and a metric asston of proof that it doesn’t, if you’ll open your eyes and LOOK.
And if you want non-epidemiological studies, start with the Eades’ Protein Power, Anthony Colpo’s The Great Cholesterol Con, and Taubes’ Good Calories, Bad Calories. All of them are chock-full of peer-reviewed, non-epidemiological studies. That should cheer you up.
Woah, Mark, sorry; did I catch you on the wrong day?
I’m not sure what you’re arguing here. I never criticized what was written above, nor did sara. She just said this: be a little critical before you just accept it as truth.
Despite your inability to properly read my posts, I’ll bite.
-”Primal” people? Can you define what this means?
- 3 books, out of 30, that’s 10% of your books.
“Our grandparents and their parents and their grandparents, all the way back to Grok, ate the way that Primal people do now, and they all lived into their 80s and 90s, usually in at least decent health. Our parents, on the other hand, ate the low-fat high-carb way, and started dropping like flies in their 40s and 50s from heart disease, diabetes, cancer, and stroke. Hmmm. I see a connection there.”
You think the life expectancy of our parents was 40 YEARS LOWER than that of our grandparents? lol wut? Crazy much?
“Our grandparents and their parents and their grandparents, all the way back to Grok, ate the way that Primal people do now, and they all lived into their 80s and 90s, usually in at least decent health. Our parents, on the other hand, ate the low-fat high-carb way, and started dropping like flies in their 40s and 50s from heart disease, diabetes, cancer, and stroke. Hmmm. I see a connection there.”
Primal, schmimal. The primal diets may have been great for people who were active on the farm or the factory all day, but these days most people are anything but. The other consideration is the fact that everything is heavily processed. Even produce for goodness sake! For every healthy new diet that becomes trendy (in the sense of eating better—not losing weight) there’s five-gazillion different processed foods out there and most of the population in the US is living it.
And as far as that low-fat/high-carb diet goes, my father-in-law is ALIVE, because his once “primal” diet (high protein, high fat) got changed when he hit his 40s/50s to the low-fat, high carb diet you are speaking of. His father has a heavy-duty heart attack at 65. FIL had a very mild one at 62 and is doing great now at 70 (granted he needs to get out of the house, but that’s a whole other issue).
I don’t agree grains are evil. However, I bet they are very overused in diets. Anything can be horrible for you if that’s *all* you eat. Balance is important.
That said, I plan to be switching our bread to Trader Joe’s Quinoa bread this year. It’s relatively inexpensive compared to the higher quality breads (like Pepperidge Farm or Arnold), it’s packed with nutrients, and it’s quiet tasty and soft.
Thank you! The internet is a good place to get random ideas to make you think. HOwever, it should not be a source of hard and fast rules for anything. Go to the sources, whether diet, history, religion or politics~ick, for your information. And by the by, doctors, nurses & all people in general are characterized both by the diligent and the slackers. It’s our~sick~ so called ‘health’care reimbursement system that waits until people get ill in order to recieve funding to treat. See: Congress subcommittees. The system need to change to a true HEALTHcare system that promotes health~not just treat the illness that errupts from our poor uninformed eating & lifestyle choices.
Listen to this person – do your own research before buying into what anyone else tells you. I am a dietitian and there is absolutely NO research out there from any real source that supports or can even give you a reason not to eat gluten or grains unless you have a gluten intolerance or allergy. Yes, of course a salad full of veggies will have more vitamins, minerals, and even fiber (though it will have different vitamins and minerals), but that just proves this guy couldn’t find a better argument so he wrote something that is obviously true. Also, how far out of date is this guy? The government does not even use a pyramid any more. It’s now a plate because the government did not want people eating so many grains and the pyramid sent the wrong message. Search REAL nutrition journals, such as the Journal of the Academy of Nutrition and Dietetics or Food and Nutrition for answers to his questions. Do your own research and talk to a Registered Dietitian yourself!
I follow a food plan free of grains and other “conventional” starches. I’m a nurse practitioner and have a dietician friend that eats the same way. My husband is a physician and sees no need for grains in the diet either. NOTHING I was taught in “actual classes” said that grains were needed for good health; it was just part of the goverment generated food pyramid. Many things we were taught in school were based on tradition, not hard science.
I had the exact same thought.
Well – did you see this article? – Most medical schools do not meet the min. 25 hrs of rec. nutrition training. http://bit.ly/9b9DLn
So, as a 2nd year medical student, I’d just like to say I had 2 months of clinical nutrition. And if you’re appalled at that, you should also be appalled by the fact that we covered immunology in 2 weeks, microbiology in a month and a half, and genetics in a month. (Although I’d also like to impress upon you the intensity and amount of material that is covered in every hour of class time. Undergrad this ain’t.) There is so much to learn in medical school that it’s impossible to sit in a classroom and absorb it all in the four years we have. That’s why a huge bulk of our learning takes place on the floors during our second two years of training. It’s unfair to say that just because it sounds like we haven’t had much class time spent in a particular field, doesn’t mean we come out unqualified boobs (though from the looks of these posts, I might find quite a few people who disagree with me on that).
I will freely admit that doctors (as far as I’ve observed, and from what I’ve gathered talking to a close friend who is a clinical nutritionist) don’t consult nutritionists often enough and are, in fact, underinformed about the current research in nutrition. However, if you’ve ever looked at the peer-reviewed literature on nutrition, you would see that it is often conflicting, and most real, firm evidence takes a very long time to pan out. I would also point out that we’re taught time and again that that eating less, eating less junk (in general), and exercising are really the best ways to improve your health (and for the love of God, stop smoking!). So might I be so bold as to suggest that your health improvements are simply due to the fact that you’ve changed to a healthier lifestyle overall? (That it’s not just the grains?)
Erin,
Hi, I’m also a medical student and was wondering your thoughts on Primal Blueprint, if you’re doing it, and if so how it’s fit into the crazy schedules we have?
Hope you don’t mind me contacting you. I just found this site yesterday and I wanted some input from someone who understands the demands of med school. Thanks!
dhknobe@gmail.com
I’m not an RN or a doctor.
Having the letters MD, RN, etc after your name or being a nutritionist, or even being a doctor who is well-versed in nutrition is all fine and dandy. In order to truly understand nutrition, you have to be well versed in the digestive processes as well.
Scenario:
You have a plant-based diet, that is low/no fat and high carb, largely based around grains. This diet has been shown to reverse heart disease, diabetes, cancer, arthritis, yada, yada, yada.
You have grain free diets (there are several versions, not just the one mentioned in this blog). These diets have been shown to reverse heart disease, cancer, diabetes, arthritis, auto-immune disorders, asthma, allergies (food and environmental), adhd, autism, yada, yada, yada.
You have two diets, that are on complete opposite ends of the spectrum, that have yielded similar results. Why is that?
Because you can’t have your cake and eat it too. The body isn’t capable of digesting animal protein and grains at the same time. They require two completely different digestive processes, and your body will always go for the grains first because they’re the single most difficult food source to digest. Then your digestive system gets confused, because it has to switch gears to digest the animal protein. The typical American diet constantly mixes the two, which confuses and overloads the digestive system and it gets burned out. When you continually stress out your digestive system, it will then cause serious damage to your digestive tract(this damage can be fixed, if you can guess how…).
You can’t have animal protein AND grains. You will kill yourself, eventually, if you do. This is why both types of diets yield the same results. Grain free diets are much more compatible with people who have gastrointestinal problems. In addition to that, grain free diets are much more compatible with people who’s health problems are *caused* by gastrointestinal problems. Yes, gastrointestinal problems can have very serious, very far reaching effects, including making you susceptible to things like cancer, heart disease, auto-immune diseases and even schizophrenia.
Oh, one more thing. Fruit uses a third digestive process, so it should never be combined with animal protein and/or grains. And veggies require very little effort to digest, and they aid the digestive process, so you can eat them with anything.
You said it buddy. You’re a lobbyist.
I’m an RN. Here’s a little info for you. Take care.
“Phytic acid, aka phytate, aka IP-6, is one of the most powerful antioxidants found in foods. Some nutritionally-oriented cancer researchers think that IP-6 is probably the most powerful natural anti-cancer sustances. IP-6 is found in grains, beans, nuts & seeds. Wheat is especially high in this cancer fighter.”
“Phytic acid works differently than other antioxidants. Most antioxidants circulate in the bloood, stopping free radicals there. Phytate has the unique ability to work inside your cells, stopping free radicals that are formed duringthe normal process of cell metabolism.”
I’m not an RN.
I think ingested antioxidants don’t hold a candle to our endogenous antioxidants, and in fact researchers have shown shoveling in the plant stuff down-regulates production of the home-grown gold.
Catalase, superoxide dismutase and glutathione peroxidase are local antioxidant enzymes produced where they are needed, when they are needed by a cell which needs them to run its power plants safely.
Additionally, I think it’s folly to broadly paint anti-oxidants as “good” and free radicals as “bad.”
When mitochrondia get hit by enough free radicals it’s a signal to increase production of our own antioxidants.
When poster G writes “Phytate has the unique ability to work inside your cells, stopping free radicals that are formed during the normal process of cell metabolism” — methinks that’s not a good thing
free radicals causes problems to our bodies, like… i dunno… CANCER… moron
Yeah. We wouldn’t need to fight cancer if we didn’t digest grains.
Todd, perhaps you should do a little research yourself. Start with Good Calories-Bad Calories by Gary Taubes…investigate the entire bibliography and substantiate your stand on grains point-by-point; a tip… you will NOT be able to do it. Historical scientific evidence supports that agricultural societies have steadily declined in health and increased in obesity and diseases of Western Culture. You, like so many other absolutely refuse to admit you have been hoodwinked by the government, Ancel Keyes….must I continue? I think not.
People in Asia/Japan (where I live) eat rice/carbs at almost every meal, live the longest of anyone everywhere (Japan has the highest longevity rates) and seem to have very few health problems. Of course, lung and colon cancer are high, but generally, carbs/starches are a large part of their daily diet. So…..I’m just saying: this is all a bit confusing. How does anyone explain the discrepancy of an Asian diet with carbs still produce such long lifespans?
Hmmm whell it seems that all the no-grainers are a bit sarcastic and cold. I knew guy who ate just like this and he was a pure Power Trip 24/7; he was a big and lean healthy-looking guy, but not mentally!! VERY anxious and Bipolar. I just want to say that grains actually increase and maintain seratoninn levels (the happy chemical) while meat will actually lower it somewhat. And everyone will die one day. I TRULY believe that eating bread will NOT poison you, trust me.
I have tried this no-grain diet and it made me VERY bipolar. But I’ve realised its not about how long you live, but HOW you live. I would rather focus on being happy and healthy so that I can help others do the same! Instead of obsessing about my diet. And btw I am a very healthy lady, have always been on the slim side, and very happily eat my way through the high whole grains and fruits, low meat diet 
and I understand that what is not good for 1 percent of the population with celiac disease is pretty beneficial to the rest of the population
Bipolarism isn’t caused by not eating grains, it’s a genetic disorder…
Bipolar disorder isn’t caused by genetics. It’s a MENTAL disorder and technically ANYONE is a risk to be diagnosed with it.
Genetics do SUPPOSEDLY create a higher risk to develop in those whose families have known cases of mental illnesses. Results linking it to purely genetics have never been completely conclusive due to never being able to replicate results.
It’s just one of the few items that can affect and cause the development in individuals. Others causes are psychological being from chemical imbalances to structural imperfections of the brain and could even include damage caused from drug use. The other being environmental(Where they grew up, parental style, traumatic events in past)
The biggest thing one needs to learn to do when they are diagnosed with manic-depressive disorder is regulation. You learn to probably regulate everything. You get into a routine. Any rapid changes to these routines can cause a downward or upward spiral into mania or depression. Nutrition is one of most important factors! The fact that hunger and anxiety both cause the same exact symptoms on your bodies even shows this.
So yes, food can in fact have an impact on someone who is living with bipolar disorder without the proper nutrition or a rather sudden diet change can cause you to have an episode.
My knowledge comes from the fact that I, myself, am manic depressive and have taken classes to allow me to learn how to properly handle my situation. Through that learning and understanding, I am able to go without my medication, which is I’m highly against.
Please, educate yourself before being a dick online or someone else may just come along correct you.
“BTW, paleolithic tribes did not live past 35 years of age and did not live long enough to develop heart disease and colon cancer.”
Maybe because of the paleolithic tribes diet their bones appear to be 35 years old being compared to modern mans bones. Perhaps they lived much longer and healthier then we do today.
lol, That’s not how carbon-dating works.
Longevity data tend to be distorted by factoring in infant mortality rates (and likely other things affecting these rates). Prehistoric people lived longer than 30-35 years, on average. They foraged and ate a wide variety of things, with little competition for resources. Agriculture was probably one of the worst things to happen to humans, especially women. Diet and life span took a nose dive after that.
This is untrue. there was fierce competition among human ancestors, and if you read up on evolution, you can see that humans indeed had shorter life spans years ago.
There’s plenty of nice data out there to support this stuff. In no particular order, here’s some nice data I just pulled off PubMed.
UCSF – short term paleo intervention improving blood pressure, glucose tolerance, insulin secretion, insulin sensitivity and lipid profiles.
http://www.nature.com/ejcn/journal/v63/n8/abs/ejcn20094a.html
and another on glucose tolerance:
http://www.springerlink.com/content/h7628r66r0552222/
particularly important for type 2 diabetes:
http://www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/pii/S0002822307019281
http://www.ajcn.org/content/82/1/242S.short (Harvard School of Public Health)
high protein diets reducing risk of heart disease:
http://www.ajcn.org/content/87/5/1571S.short
no improvement, but no damage in terms of heart disease and risk markers for high protein:
http://www.ajcn.org/content/87/1/23.short
a bit of that ‘I’m fuller longer and don’t get energy dips’ data
http://www.ajcn.org/content/87/1/44.short
not a perfect study, but gluten in non-celiacs with gut compaints causing bloating, pain, tiredness…
http://onlinelibrary.wiley.com/doi/10.1111/j.1440-1746.2011.06653.x/full
here’s a quick scatter of lots of nice new attention to the gut and immune system
http://www.sciencemag.org/content/307/5717/1920.short
http://journals.lww.com/co-endocrinology/Abstract/2011/08000/The_gut_as_a_regulator_of_early_inflammation_in.3.aspx
introducing gluten earlier in infant’s lives = more celiac disease
http://jama.ama-assn.org/content/293/19/2343.short
but hey, just as a proof we ‘do our research’ – this kind of stuff gives me pause, makes me look up more and make my own decisions about exactly how to go about doing my version of a paleo diet:
http://circ.ahajournals.org/cgi/content/meeting_abstract/122/21_MeetingAbstracts/A20256
(and hey, it’s affordable!)
http://www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/pii/S0271531711000960
Hope you like colon cancer.
Thanks Mark – I have been slipping lately and this was the article that I needed to read.
Sometimes reminders like this and a little reinforcement are useful. Thanks for reading, Alex!
A reminder for me about how much I don’t miss them
Hey Mark, new to you, but like what you are saying about no grains, they have never made me feel good. What else to eat besides fruits a veggies, Maybe this brocitis will go away. see ya.
Dan: Try a steak.
TRY A STEAK?
Steak has never and will never be good for you and is NOT nutrient dense. Just like the dairy that Mark bashes, it also is full of chemicals and comes from the same factories. In addition, steak is high in saturated fats.
Saturated fats = clogged arteries = heart attacks. That doesn’t change, but actually increases, from cutting out whole grains.
How did that Atkins guy die?
There’s a clue.
Karen: Fail.
I guess you never got to those parts of the blog explaining that grain-fed chemical-laden non-organic meat with unbalanced Omega 3:6 ratios and man-made trans fats wasn’t part of Grok’s meal plan, or the guides on Fats and Saturated Fats debunking your concerns – Paleolithic humans ate a lot of saturated fats since animal fats in their internal organs and fat reserves are mostly made of it. (our fat reserves are also made out of saturated fats – so… whener you force your body to take out and burn fat… OMG! that would mean weight loss causes heart disease, and to think I was planning on gradually releasing 30lbs of saturated fats into my system – that would have probably killed me I’m sure of it!
True, Grok may have died at an average age of 35, but it wasn’t from a heart attack – by that logic, meat-eating cheetahs would also be dropping dead from heart attacks – those guys don’t watch their saturated fat intake nearly enough.
Don’t believe me? Inuit tribes have been following the Primal/Caveman diet ever since they settled the Arctic. (apparently, gently heated seal blood tea tastes really good mixed with some raw seal flab, which can also be used as a cooking oil and lamp oil) They had no heart problems – until they began adopting Western-style grain/sugar diets…
How did that Atkins guy die? Probably from following a low-carb diet that wasn’t strict enough with avoiding man-made trans fats, out-of-season and processed foods while ignoring a balanced intake of polyunsaturated fats… and does the Atkins diet even encourage proper, healthy forms of exercise such as occasional sprints to flex those arterial heart valve muscles?
Wait a minute…. a simple search reveals that Dr. Atkins did not even die of a heart attack like you say – he died in a similar way our healthy high-fat eating ancestors might have : slipped and fell on ice, got head trauma and died.
@mm: There has been debate as to whether Atkins actually had some heart problems, but even if he did, who says it had to be because of his diet? He may have cut carbs, but who’s also to say that the meat he ate was healthy? (I don’t think sausages and bacon, for example, or good with all their chemicals and salt. It’s just not natural meat as one would find in nature).
Also, ‘average’ lifespan statistics are misleading. I think our modern lifespan is so high due to low birth mortality rates.. Grok’s babies may have died early, skewing our interpretation on how old they may have actually lived. Just a thought.
some people do fine with just fruits, veggies, nuts and seeds. look up 80 / 10 / 10
from reading up on it, it seems really healthy except for two things.
1. they tend to report a reduced libido.that makes me wonder what else is going on hormonally.
2. theyre all really skinny! i dont know if its hormonal, lack of protein or what, but ive never seen a skinnier bunch. Its great if thats what you want or if you dont care. they dont seem to suffer for it either, but it does make me wonder whats going on there.
For my Sustainability class my group is supposed to brainstorms ways we can cut back on food consumption on campus (ASU). One proposition will be to cut outs grains and sugars from campus. consuming only nutrient-dense food will derive undistorted satiation, and ultimately require less calories.
“if your average unhealthy person were to ask for the top three things to avoid in order to get healthy, I would tell them to stop smoking, to stop drinking their calories (as soda or juice), and to stop eating grains.”
You wouldn’t have no added or processed sugar as a top 3?
Which of Mark’s Top 3 would you have replaced with your suggestion?
Well the more I think about it, my suggestion, no sugar, pretty much covers the no soda suggestion, so I guess that one.
You?
I like the way Mark presented his Top 3 because many people think they’re eating healthy even while they’re drinking juice. While some foods with added sugars may at least provide a tiny bit of nutrition, sugary drinks are really at the bottom of that list.
While the avid readers of MDA already know this, I think it would be more helpful to newbies who still follow CW.
There are plenty of unhealthy people who don’t smoke.
agreed but the statement was if I had to tell people three things to a healthier lifestyle. No one was suggesting that just because you don’t smoke it means your healthy.
“If you’re not a smoker, don’t start” — how’s that — {:~)
Any number of things could make it into the top 3 on any given day. Of course it depends on the audience, too. As Kristin J touched on above, for your average guy or gal on the street just cutting out soda would be a major step in the right direction. But, yes, of course, processed sugar is right up there (and soda sort of covers or implies that).
Sugar is a grain! Right? So no grains covers it.
Well, no, it depends on where the sugar comes from. If it’s from corn syrup or sorghum, then OK. Sugarcane’s a whole different critter.
I think it’d have to be a top four suggestions. Because sugar, no matter where it comes from, is more and more implicated in metabolic syndrome and diabetes due to its fructose content. It also operates as an antinutrient.
lmao no sugar is NOT a grain..
I only drink diet (but a lot of it). Am I going to die for different reasons?
probably from a brain tumor or a neurological disease. Look up sweet misery
You can not change your genetic makeup. Plain and simple. Show me the SCIENCE to back it up, I’ll show you the SCIENCE that you can not! If you could we would not have any health problems.
Where did Mark ever say that you could change your genetic makeup? He’s talking about OPTIMIZING what you have – which means not eating things that we weren’t meant to eat, such as grains.
Context, dear. Read for context.
You can change your genetic makeup. It’s called epigenetics.
http://www.time.com/time/magazine/article/0,9171,1952313,00.html
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Epigenetics
The human metabolism changes all the time. Or more specifically, what your body does with food is much more variable than the ancient signals and cravings that drive eating patterns before you put anything in your mouth. It’s too simplistic to say we would have no health problems if we could change things.
The body changes its own makeup with epigenetics, but we can take it even a step further with current genetic engineering. One example is the glow in the dark bunny with fluorescent jellyfish genes: http://www.ekac.org/gfpbunny.html#gfpbunnyanchor
Some people treat paleo as a narrative habit for good health but don’t overlook other help from science, while others treat paleo as a religion that must not be questioned.
Hey Mark – quick question. What’s worse in your opinion, grains or sugar? Can one rely compare?
Grains cause a much higher insulin spike than sugar would. Grains like sugar are carbs. Grains such as wheat, trump sugar.
I’m not sure if Primal Blueprint dieters believe in the glycemic index, because it is something produced by contemporary science, but it ranks all carbohydrate foods based on how fast they digest and absorb, which relates to how much insulin will be produced. I believe Nezzy is way off base; sugar will spike blood sugar and insulin quite quickly because it is a simple carbohydrate (high on the glycemic index) while whole grains will cause a slower rise in insulin. There’s more about it here: http://www.glycemicindex.com/ . I’d be interested to hear what a PBer has to say about this, since fruits are on the glycemic too.
The glycemic index is nonsense (see http://www.phlaunt.com/diabetes/22168291.php). There’s no scientific basis for it whatsoever.
As for sugar vs. grains – in the long run, there’s no difference. Carbs are carbs – ALL carbs turn into sugar when your body processes them. Carbs are NOT GOOD for you. Grains and sugar – there’s no difference. They’re both bad. They both spike insulin and blood sugar levels. Avoid them both.
Griff,
If what you say, that “all carbs are carbs and are bad for you,” then you wouldn’t be able to eat the salad and fruits that the PB is so full of – they are mostly carbohydrate, but high in fiber and so digest more slowly and are easier on the pancreas as it produces insulin. The glycemic index is based in science – there are almost 4,000 articles that mention it in pubmed alone (and yes, I know some of them are probably swayed by funding from certain sources, but strongly doubt that every single one is). It is true that a PB-like diet can help control diabetes, and this is because it is low in simple carbohydrates like processed grains and added sugars. An insulin “spike” happens because simple sugars move to the blood faster, and it is true that x amount of sugar and x amount of a whole grain will take the same amount of insulin to cover, but the whole grain will not cause the insulin to be released as quickly and is therefore easier for the pancreas to deliver. I would be interested to hear your response to this concept.
Also, that link didn’t work for me – do you have an alternate?
Sarah,
I only eat leafy greens and other non-starchy carb vegetables. That means I rarely (if ever) eat fruit – it’s too high in sugar and it spikes me the same as candy does. I’m a type II diabetic, and my sugars remain under control only when I avoid starchy and sugary foods – including fruit and grains. I rarely ingest more than 50 grams of carbs (total, including fiber grams) per day.
The glycemic index is nonsense. Try using the glycemic index test with ten different people, and you’ll get ten wildly different responses to the same food. If the glycemic index was correct, those ten different responses would fall within a small margin of variation. They don’t. Every time you test another group of ten people, you get another set of ten wildly different results. The glycemic hypothesis does not stand up to evidence, because it’s not repeatable (and therefore not reliable). Therefore, it’s NOT scientific.
Also, it doesn’t matter how slowly or how quickly a carb turns into sugar in the body – it still turns into sugar and it still stimulates an insulin response. As long as there’s sugar in the bloodstream, the insulin response will continue to happen. Longer time periods for sugar release are actually MORE harmful in some ways.
The glycemic index is bunk. The main idea behind the Primal Blueprint is to minimize having insulin running around in your body; it’s toxic to your system. The glycemic index ignores this very important fact. For more on this, get the original “Protein Power” book by Drs. Michael and Mary Dan Eades, and read the section on insulin. You’ll be shocked.
The reason the link didn’t work is because the MDA comment form included the parenthesis on the end of the link for some reason. It doesn’t belong there. Go to your browser after you click on the link and delete the parenthesis at the end of the link, and then it should work fine.
Thanks for your thoughtful and open response – I can tell you’re really passionate about this stuff, and have read a lot. The website you sent almost leaves me with more questions than before…
I think we agree on several points (you, I and the article):
-Americans eat too many carbs, especially refined ones and added sugars
-Americans don’t think of their diet as the first place to look to address health concerns – I wish more would follow in your steps and look at what they eat before popping pills
-Insulin has two purposes – to help us use, and to store, energy
-The idea of tracking your own blood glucose levels after meals is great, just might be expensive and hard to access
Some things you and the article mention lead me to more questions, however – I can get on board with not wanting too much insulin circulating for too long, but I don’t think you can go so far as to dub it “toxic.” Our bodies don’t make substances that are toxic; we just force them to make too much of some things based on our lifestyles. Our bodies need LDL cholesterol and triglycerides; the problem that comes is when they are too high or out of ratio. The article makes this point well, “No matter what anyone tells you about the healthfulness of a food, you can check it out yourself.” And I think – the more I read and learn – that this message is more important than any: some people just respond differently to different foods. Perhaps the variability blood glucose in the groups tested on the glycemic index (and I will have to take a closer look at the research before I concede that it is total “bunk”) means that eating low works for some people, but not others (for whatever reason; I am sure that genetics and probably activity level play in here).
The last thing I’ll say that I think the author of the article doesn’t explain very well is why, if he doesn’t believe that sugar and grains are any different, “I would be the last person to argue that a diet rich in whole grains is worse for you than one made up mostly of Sugar Frosted Flakes and french fries.” He goes on to say “the fewer the carbohydrates eaten, the better the health outcome,” which implies that 0 would be the optimum amount of carbs to consume – even you would disagree with this (?) I think, since you said you try to stick around 50g/day. The author of the article, too, points out that people with diabetes process foods differently (I am curious to know, but you don’t have to feel obligated to share, what your diet was like before switching to PB).
I grew up eating a lot of red meat from cows fed a mixture of grain and grass, vegetables from the garden, and grains. Because I never experienced ill health on this diet – quite the opposite – and because it works for me, I do not intend to give up grains. But I am assessing the source and amount more than I used to, and the conclusion I come to more and more is that any food that is highly processed (white bread, hotdogs, vegetables canned with lots of salt) is what should be avoided, not any one group in particular. I’ll also share that I have a “traditional” (perhaps you would say conventional) nutrition education, and I know that while some people with the same background tend to be close minded and parrot what they learn, I am trying to consider the idea that one diet doesn’t fit all and make sure I’m familiar with lots of different diet options – especially ones that do have scientific evidence in support, like the PB.
Thanks for any other input you may have.
Sarah, here’s as much of a response as I can give to you at this point:
First, when they can test the “glycemic index” on a range of people in variable levels of age, gender, health, and fitness and show that it still predicts blood sugar responses consistently and accurately (within a small range), then I’ll believe that it’s scientific. Until then, it’s just babble and not even worth looking at twice. This is a fundamental scientific flaw in the hypothesis, and those 4,000 articles you mention probably ALL overlook it. The raw number of articles published doesn’t mean the theory is supported.
Many people who do PB do it entirely carnivorously and have for years. It’s a fact, much hidden by modern medicine, that you can get along just fine with no dietary carbohydrates at all. Our bodies produce carbohydrates from protein all the time; it’s called gluconeogenesis.
About insulin – it *is* toxic to the body. Horribly so. I’ve unfortunately lent my copy of Protein Power to a friend, so I can’t cite the specifics here, but the Eades have demonstrated over thirty years of ongoing medical practice that high insulin levels are the real culprit in almost all “diseases of civilization,” including high blood pressure, heart disease, and stroke. You will need to check their book (called “Protein Power”) out from the library and read up on this, but insulin absolutely is toxic to the body and the first goal is to minimize insulin production in order to minimize the damage your body gets from high and prolonged insulin levels. I can and do dub it “toxic.” Our bodies make all kinds of substances that are toxic (waste products, anyone?); so please don’t kid yourself about that.
I’m a diabetic, so I MUST track my glucose levels, and frankly anyone who’s dumb enough to eat processed carbohydrates should be doing it too, because they’re on the short road to type II diabetes. It’s only a matter of time – this is not an “if,” it’s a “when.”
I need to correct a serious misconception you have about me: I do not try to “stick around 50g/day” of carbs. I do my best never to EXCEED 50g/day of carbs, and I usually manage to stay below 30g/day of carbs. A day when I have no carbs is a good day for my blood sugar. And you are incorrect when you think that I would disagree with the idea that 0g/day is optimal. I completely agree with that idea.
Before PB, my diet was the Standard American Diet. Lots of “healthy whole grains,” pasta, rice, minimal fat, lots of low-fat processed crap – all that stuff that all the “conventionally educated in nutrition” folks said would get my diabetes and weigh under control (they were wrong – only PB has done that). Not a lot of sugar – I don’t like sweets and never have – but carbs up the ying-yang. And I was sick as a dog all the time. Cutting out wheat and other starchy/sugary carbs from my diet created a 180-degree turnaround for me. You can believe it or not as you like, but I guarantee you that you will feel better and live longer if you do the same.
Conventional nutrition is based on a series of scientific fallacies and and a few outright lies about weight, fat, and cholesterol. Therefore, your “education” is not an education. You’ve simply been sold a bill of goods. You want my input? Read the Primal Blueprint, the Eades’ books, and Gary Taubes’ book “Good Calories, Bad Calories.” Soak up the scientific evidence. Then make the informed choice. I did, and I’m healthier than I’ve been since I was a pre-teen.
I won’t be responding here on this post anymore because responding to the comment thread is getting unwieldy. Join the MDA forums here, and post to them, and learn. I’m not the only knowledgeable one – I’m just one of the louder folks here. I look forward to seeing you posting and asking questions there. Take care now.
Well Griff, I think you lost me. 0 carbs? A meat-only diet? It sounds like your views are even more extreme than others on this site. Maybe you think you’re just being direct, but your tone borders on condescending at times – I only point that out because you seem to be trying to convince people that what you’re saying is right – you catch more flies with honey, you know? (But think of all the carbs!) I’m still going to try to check out those books, but a more easily offended person might just write off what you say. Fingers crossed for better research to come out so people like us aren’t stuck debating on blogs!
Is no one going to raise the benefit of Stevia? I haven’t used sugar in about 20 years. While there is diabetes in my family, and some arthritis, I am 58 and have no health issues — somewhat high cholesterol, but high “good” cholesterol, but being post menopausal, my body changes and weight gains are from different sources. I eat organic, fruits and veg., minimal red meat (but “rare” when I do, chicken, fish, rarely eat pork in any form, and I am slightly lactose-intolerant. I use all-natural supplements almost daily, and I exercise (aerobic and anaerobic). I don’t fing my diet restrictive, I use herbs and spices ALOT (Cumin and Tumeric, Cinnamon and Nutmeg ALOT), and hot spices. No soda – ever. So, long story- short — balance with your diet is a good thing, experiment with things to keep it interesting, mix up your exercise to keep from becoming boring (mind and body), use YOGA, BREATHING, and TAI CHI techniques regularly. Common Sense goes a long way.
Mark. THANK YOU for your knowledge and time! I have read many paleolithic books. All of the info here is free! It astonishes me that the misinformed stumble here and judge without first reading or doing. Being a paleolithic advocate is sometimes a lonely place. I am among the ones seeking info, not debate.. I am a 47 year old women who is going through menopause and losing weight. I am told that I look 15 years younger than my age and asked what my secret is. Still when I try to explain paleo, I get the DEER IN THE HEADLIGHT look. I have NOT the strength to debate, so I say, GOOGLE Marks daily apple. Everything you need to know is there.
Thank you Mark
This is a perfect reminder- esp with the holidays fast approaching. While I might enjoy a wee bit of quinoa or hummus now and then, my consumption has dropped dramtically over the last 9 months since I’ve been on the PB. Grains really don’t appeal to me any more, thankfully. Excellent post!
Why cut out hummus? It’s not a grain as far as I know.
It would be nice to get a clarification on this since as an Israeli cutting hummus out of my diet would be very close to impossible.
-Rafi
Beans are a no-no on the PB- I just threw them in there since some grains & beans are 20% for me!
There’s no reason to cut out legumes, but they are high in sugar (they’re carby). I’m a vegetarian so I eat legumes on days I don’t eat eggs to get my protein in. Also hummus is the sort of thing where a serving is a tablespoon, so you’re not even really eating that much hummus (or shouldn’t be).
They are a bean…legume. Not allowed on PB dirt
Isn’t quinoa a seed?
Quinoa is a chenopod plant, commonly misrepresented as a grain. It has seeds, yes, but it also has leaves.
Cordain has a great lecture on how grains (and lectins, of course), are linked to multiple sclerosis. It’s scientific but rather easy to understand.
http://www.youtube.com/user/miladskaya#g/c/7227FC56E6473A9B
Here is a good reason for eating grains, they taste good. Stop worrying about your diet and enjoy your life. Give vegetarianism a chance.
Grain-based foods do taste and smell good, I agree. But hardly a good reason to eat them regularly. Gonna have to do better than that.
This post (Grain Relapse) is perfect timing, as I have been slipping into daily consumption again. Back on the wagon now!
G=G (can’t even bring myself to spell it out), glad you brought this up. That was to be one of my other major points under “no good reasons to eat grains.” They taste terrible. The only way to make grains even reasonably palatable is by adding sugars, spices, salt, cream, yeast, jams, spreads or sauces. What’s the point to that, other than adding cheap calories that easily convert to glucose? Just eat real food. Name a grain that tastes anything other than bland when its eaten all by itself. Beige glop any way you cut it.
BTW, I did give vegetarianism a try 30 years ago and it make me sick and weak. That’s why I host this site.
Could you please let us all avid readers know the vegetarian experiment as a separate post? I’d love to hear it
I agree. One of the things I realized after switching to Primal was that those cookies, cakes, biscuits, whatever might taste good, but I could never take a pinch of flour and eat it. EW! Definitely a disconnect there.
Almond flour on the other hand…mmm.
maybe you became sick and weak from vegetarianism because you are mentally sick and weak? And don’t you think that eating dead animal carcasses is bit cave-man like?
There are plenty of RAW protein sources that are far more digestible than dead meat. i.e.: hemp, chlorella, spirulina, organic cage-free eggs, etc.. etc.. etc..
I have been a veggie for years and am stronger than you will ever dream of being.
btw, what is so indigestible about spouted hulless oats?
The “cave-man like” thing is the whole POINT, Jay. Our genes didn’t evolve just because our minds did. They still expect the same things that Grok ate – meat, animal fat, and the occasional non-starchy vegetable. We did not evolve to eat grains and we are still not evolved to eat grains, regardless of what you think.
While you read “The Vegetarian Myth,” I’ll have a rare steak, thanks.
I wanted to go vegan. At one point I believed the health arguments because I didn’t know any better. It made me fatter and sicker. You can’t live on just green plants because they don’t contain enough calories and you’d have to do nothing but eat all day. You need an energy-dense source of food. If you’re vegan, that has to be grains.
The tendency for type 2 diabetes runs in my family, and I was already showing outward signs of metabolic syndrome. I lasted maybe two or three months on a vegan diet because it was making me fatter and sicker.
By the way, you can’t separate the mental from the physical, because the brain is a bodily organ just like your heart or stomach. If vegetarianism makes people mentally sick and weak that’s hardly anything to recommend it.
I have a way better time digesting minimally-cooked meat than I do seeds or algae or bacteria (spirullina is blue-green bacteria). And I would rather eat things that are easily obtained through low-tech means than be dependent on the factory food system for a bunch of germs in a capsule.
Sprouts are a whole nother matter from unsprouted seed. In that case you’re eating a plant, not a grain anymore.
Got any more insulting questions? Try this: keep them to yourself.
Wow, those posts before me are both pretty ridiculous. First, I’d like to address the gem of a statement that ‘our genes didn’t evolve just because our minds did,’ because it betrays some ignorance of how evolution works, and scientific illiteracy is a pet peeve of mine.
Alright, then: genes changing and mutating is what causes evolution. So, if you are saying that something evolved or that some part of something evolved like you say that our minds did, it is only because we evolved because our genes have changed.
Vegetarianism can only make you weak and sick if you are not eating the right things. If you get enough protein, which is very easy to accomplish by eating beans or a variety of other foods, enough vitamins, which again is simple since most fruits and veggies are loaded with them, and enough minerals.
The biggest mineral being iron, which is not as bioavailable to us from plant sources, meaning that for every gram of iron we eat from plants we will absorb less than we would if we ate the same amount from an animal source. This isn’t a huge problem, however, since there are plenty of vegetables, mostly the dark green leafy kinds, that have iron in them.
So, if you take nothing else from this and just skim through, know that almost everything this blogger writes is probably wrong. I’ve only read this one post, but it is full of misinformation. Just do yourself a favor and do a little research about what he is saying before you take it to heart. Just because he blogs doesn’t mean he is qualified to give the kinds of advice that he does.
Sorry to question your superiority there Jay-Jay but Im betting the kid’s college fund Mark would kick your veggie ass in any thing that required physical effort or ability. Why don’t you start your own blog buddy? I have learned you have to search out a matter to find the truth. If you depend on the media saturation and well known sources for your information you are up the river without a paddle or a canoe for that matter….by the way : Yes that is a waterfall up ahead.
i’m sure you get this all the time. but i think that your eating recommendations are silly.
there are so many things wrong with the suggestion that cereal grains should be eliminated from the human diet altogether that its hard to know where to begin.
first of all..human society as it is today could not possibly survive without grains. billions of people depend on them for survival BECAUSE they are high in calories.
calories are what people require to do work. now granted, grains are not exquisitely high in nutrients, but they are not designed to be.
but whatevs…attempt to recreate the imaginary scenario of supposed caveman days.
Clearly your new here, dr. dune. Take a look around the site before you call my recommendations silly.
High in calories doesn’t mean good for you. When you start to look at the science behind the Primal diet (not as a weight-loss diet but as What You Eat), you will see that it’s much more beneficial for the human body than the Standard American Diet.
My cholesterol has gone down, my blood sugar has gone down, my weight has gone down, my arthritis and migraines have disappeared – because I stopped eating grains. You can deny it all you like but there’s a huge wealth of information out there for people who aren’t blinded by the conventional beliefs in this area. I hope you take your blinders off.
Mark isn’t trying to suggest a diet that billions of people can sustain… hes suggesting a diet that is ultimately healthy. This isn’t social studies class, this is nutrition.
New to your site! Love it! Am a 45 year old female and spent the last two years recovering my multiple health issues: Systemic Candida, CFS, Fibromyalgia, weak heart, severe arrhythmias, seizures, mitral valve prolapse, endomitriosis, fibroids, NMH, low blood pressure, severe arthritis in my lower back and hips, CI, kidney stones and more. Through holistic health, I am now well!!! Been on a “caveman diet” since October 2008… no grains!!!! I’ve lost 54 pounds and look and feel better than I did in HS. Decided to “take my life back” when I collapsed two years ago and looked death straight in the face. If I can do it, anyone can!
I don’t really see the counter-argument of ‘grains don’t taste good’ as valid, as its totally up to the taste of the person. I love plain rice, and don’t find it bland, though most people do.
Saying that, everything else you’ve said seems fine
I have been thinking lately that grains were to be avoided and wanted to know why and your website has been really helpful. I agree with your ideas about this and will continue learning about this–as I much on my popcorn. But then you have to go and advocate eating meat! Are you serious? I agree that nothing tastes better than a good steak or hamburger at the right time and I do feel better at times after I indulge, but to suggest it is healthy is just plain absurd Nutritionists who advocate eating meat will tell you that there are two important nutrients that are supplied best by meat: certain B vitamins and iron. But ask yourself why do you think that is the case? Certain B vitamins are produced by decaying, rotting flesh. In other words, it is not inherent in the meat itself, but a byproduct of the fermenting, decaying process. And that is why well-trained nutritionists advocate meat eating? Really? The other nutrient is iron which common sense will tell you it is coming from the blood. So in other words, let’s skip the meat and just drink their blood, and that would be more nutrient dense, wouldn’t it? Plus, the obvious truth is that when a medical provider gets some of your blood on their little finger, they are scared and want to do all kinds of tests on your blood. Yet, the same meat eating provider thinks nothing of later dining on a nice juicy steak, thinking nothing of all of the infectious diseases that the cow or calf was exposed to in an effort to keep the costs down. If you really think they are tested for all likely (let alone all) diseases, you must also think that the Red Cross tests for all likely infections when you give blood–and not just the ones that are required by some regulation in effect at that time–then you are just too naive to host a website on nutrition.
How can you “enjoy your life” if your diet is plaguing your overall health and vitality? (By the way, this is coming from a vegetarian. A grainless vegetarian.)
Hey Emily, I have a vegetarian friend who is curious about eating Primally but does NOT want to start eating meat. Any advice for her?
While I’m sure Mark has plenty, I’ll give you my take. The obvious one is to emphasize vegetables and cut out grains. Cutting out grains is definitely the most important and often the most difficult for vegetarians. Refined grains should definitely go first, followed by wheat/bread products, and then whole grains (oats, quinoa, buckwheat, etc.)
Mark’s “big ass salad” works for vegetarians, too. Omit the meat and replace with avocado or raw nuts and use an oil or nut based dressing (I make my own). Basically, center your meals around vegetables (not starchy vegetables), especially nutrient-dense leafy greens, and add things like organic eggs and raw nuts and seeds. Eggs from your local farmer’s market are not only more humane but exceptionally more delicious than organic store-bought eggs. I don’t do much dairy, but I think the best choice is organic plain greek yogurt.
Raw vegetables and raw nuts are great, easy primal/vegetarian snacks. And while Mark has had some qualms with the Raw Vegan diet, a ton of it is primal-friendly and obviously vegetarian. It involves making protein and fat rich foods out of raw nuts, seeds, herbs, and oils. It’s worth looking into.
Hope that was some help!
As a vegetarian, I’m curious about what works for you, Emily, too. I agree with basing one’s diet around vegetables, but do you just accept a lower-protein diet than meat-eating primalists, or do you compensate otherwise?
My two cents, as a grain-free pescatarian, is that centering my meals around veggies, nuts, fruit, and fish, and throwing in legumes, other seafood, and organic eggs & dairy on occasion works great. I probably eat less protein than meat-eaters, but I do have hemp protein shakes for breakfast and don’t worry too much about it since I eat a lot of fish and nuts.
what is indigestible about spouted hulless oats, and btw, quinoa is not a grain but a seed and is highly digestible if sprouted.
Good call. And cocaine addicts enjoy the drug-induced euphoria. Same with Heroin users. Addicts crave the junk their addicted to, just as I used to crave bread and pizza crust and breakfast cereal (made from whole grains and minimal added sugar no less) when I was addicted to them. Now that I’ve cured my addiction, I don’t find those “foods” appealing any more. AND I feel so much better than when they were a part of my diet that it is unthinkable to me to even imagining a return to those “foods.” I used to get such bad gas from consuming grains that I used to look at my schedule to check when the next appointment for someone to come to my office was just to make sure I didn’t create an embarrassing situation-if you know what I mean. Same with my commutes by car. If I knew in advance that I had to pick up someone that day, I’d hold it in so to speak (which is quite uncomfortable on a 30+ minute commute!). Since going Primal, I’m now liberated from that grain-induced problem!
Ha, now that you mention it, I notice that I never have bad gas anymore, whereas it used to be bad enough that I’d have “exit strategies” for work or school because holding it in was so painful.
Alas, I still crave grains – specifically bread. But wheat makes me feel bloated and strangely sleepy when I gorge, so it’s not TOO hard to avoid anymore. Thank goodness I never liked rice or corn in the first place, though.
Icarus, I used to have that bloated and sleepy thing going on about 2 hrs after I ate anything with wheat. It got much worse before I figured out I have a sensitivity to gluten. Stop eating wheat, rye, barley (sorry, no beer anymore!) and you’ll feel a lot better.
Yeah you’re right! I don’t get bad gas anymore. At ALL. It used to be the worst part of a coast-to-coast flight was holding it in for 6 hours, but since I went primal, I rarely even have gas, and when I do it doesn’t clear a room.
What, you can’t go fart in the toilets on the plane?
Grains do not taste good. Save for piping hot bread out of the oven, most grains need flavor enhancement from sweeteners like sugar or sucralose or fats like butter or olive oil to be palatable. Does anybody eat just pasta without sauce or unsweetened cereal without milk? Nope. On the other hand, meat, fruit, and some vegetables can be enjoyed plain.
I love the consistency, smell and taste of bread. And I do enjoy what it brings to a sandwich (grilled cheese!). However I also realize what that stuff is doing to my body, and I have striven to eliminate all grains from my diet. However I allow myself the occasional pizza or one piece of toast with my eggs. Usually rarely, but lately more and more. And I have felt the difference, and am even more resolved to kick the grain/carb habit. This site helps so much in this effort. Like an alcoholic, I know I am never immune from falling off the wagon.
I love eating pasta, oalmeal, quinoa, etc, plain. I find this article very interesting but let’s stick to actual facts; taste is an entirely subjective thing.
Kiore, somehow I can’t believe you like that crap plain when there are so many other healthy, tasty choices. Remind me never to eat at your house
Grains do not taste “good” per se, but my problem was that I could never just eat one bowl of rice (or whatever) to feel sated. I think this is partly because of the sensory deprivation of eating plain grain. I had to eat more of it to have a sustained sensory experience. Not so with meat. A while back I read some research on the connection between binge eating (which is a problem with me if I am eating a grain-based diet) and ADD (which I happen to have). Apparently one symptom of ADD in girls/women is binge eating. My personal experience is that I feel and think my best when I eat primally and stay on top of my medication schedule. And ditto with the “no bloating and gas”.
For the record, I am not the same guy as Dr. Dune. That said, I believe that insulin creates a feeling of “need” to consume more food when given a high carb meal. Based on what I have read about fruits and other carbs from eons past was they tasted like @#$%. They were very low in sugar and either very tart or slightly bitter depending on the food in question.
I have no doubt if bad tasting fruits were the only thing around, someone would eat it if they had to to survive. If you needed it to survive and had serious cravings for more, you might stomach eating more no matter how bad it tasted, so it follows that if genetic evolution provides an answer to a need, then that is partially why insulin acts in the way in does. This aspect of insulin is probably quite useless in the modern age given the abundance of carbs available today and our ways of making them tasty with ease.
Insulin puts the glucose liberated away in tissues for storage. If glucose were a primary fuel there ought to be minimal harm from having high levels in the blood stream (if Nature is reasonable, which is not to say it always is). This is far from the case. High glucose levels can be deadly and are not healthy. Insulin storage leads to crashes where you either have to suffer from the lack of fuel until a crisis erupts, or you eat more. Either way the release of glucose back into the bloodstream results in the re-release of even more insulin, even though the body is, temporarily at least, starving for fuel. Makes me think of the body working at cross purposes.
I think the body “accounts” for calories on a different basis. I am reminded of accounting where phrases like “last in, first out”are used. Emergency fuels, like I believe carbs to be, are used first as they represent a source of energy that was once consumed only in extremis for thousands of years, and thus the preferred fatty acids were to be held in as much as possible to ride the storm out until a return to animal protein and fat could take place.
I like the analogy of fuel for the car. I have a limited budget so I have to keep costs down, but I also have performance needs. If I had a cheap source of premium gasoline that was recommended for my car that I could store in an underground tank, I would use that whenever I could. If the source became limited or the price went up, I would immediately switch to using regular and suffer from performance issues, and hold my supply of premium in tanks only to be used again if prices came down, became available in abundance, or when even regular became scarce. Someone not knowing my reasons might conclude I love regular and hate using premium.
I think this is why we have been led to believe carbs are superior, because of witnessing a phenomenon of biology that exists to save us from starvation if meat and fat became scarce or unavailable for a time.
OTOH I think ancient primates had at least partially evolved to using carbs since the brain does indeed like to use carbs when available. It can go with less during lean times, but it does like them a lot. That is not to say the body likes grains over other sources of carbohydrate though. Sorry for the length of the post.
I know several people who eat just pasta, or just rice. I don’t, just pointing that out.
I just stumbled upon this article but would like to mention that some of my favorite things to eat are pasta without sauce, oatmeal without sugar (well, I like to eat it dry, straight out of the container — goes great with water…I’m so weird), and unsweetened cereal without milk. And plain bread. And plain rice.
(Not to say I don’t love fruits and vegetables and nuts and meat!)
This stuff is really interesting though. Definitely worth considering, although unfortunately I’m so busy and my budget is so limited that I fear I’d have to wait to try anything like this. In the meantime maybe I’ll be able to slowly nudge my way toward something a bit healthier.
So you cook your meat with just water or you eat it raw?
Meat tastes good. Give omnivorism a chance!
Hey, that’s great news — I think I’ll start drinking a gallon of scotch a week again, because I like the taste — thanks! :~)
Have you read the recently published book by Lierre Keith, “The Vegetarian Myth?”
She was a vegan for 20 years. Destroyed her health and the book makes a devastating case against vegetarianism, not only on health grounds, but environmental as well.
Yep, she’s both a radical environmentalist and feminist, and she shows vividly how destructive agriculture is to the planet, and how beneficial free-ranging animals are to the environment.
You might want to check it out.
It’s amazing that some of us wacky lefties actually do use our brains, huh?
I’m going to go have a nice medium-rare steak now, thanks.
I am surprised you did not have a coronary with the number of steaks you ate in this thread alone.
Maybe that should make you think about the fallacies you’ve been swallowing from the doctor and other people who don’t actually know what they’re talking about, then, shouldn’t it? Not only have I not had a coronary, I know I’m never going to.
However, I am going to go have another steak – and no coronary, thanks. You can have that with your all-grain bread and soy protein diet… or you could wake up and smell the bacon.
A good point you made about how little traditional doctors know about the subject. I think the fact that the average MD is dead by 58 is plenty reason not to look to them as a well-spring of health related wisdom.
BTW Your free to have another steak now.
Did you knowingly follow up “stop worrying about your diet and enjoy life” with, “Give Vegetarianism a chance”. You literally just said, don’t worry about your diet, instead change you diet. I personally just stumbled onto this site so if you have a similar post about why vegetarianism is unhealthy id love to know about it.
i liked this post, i have tried paleo in the past and started losing weight and feeling better immediatley. i stopped however because i still wasn’t convinced i should eat meat( i was a vegetarian from 13-about18) you have to think about grains/beans/dairy..these foods can NOT be eaten in the wild! to eat grains one needs to build a fire step one, and as far as i know we are the only creature who has figured that one out…step two you need a vessel to boil water clay/stone/metal/glass i don’t know but you need to make something that will hold the water and not melt on the fire,step 3 go out and search the land for grains/beans they are hard as rocks and ya they don’t want to be eaten!! i wonder how we figured out how to cook these hard inedible seeds? something most people don’t think about, but think about how much effort goes into making grains and beans edible, while meat veggies fruit and eggs even honey can all be eaten raw wild readily available nutrition! as far as taste goes, plain grains all by themselves are not very tasty they are PLAIN not gross just plain. anyway, i’m glad i came across this article very inspriring
Do you really think there aren’t any animals that eat grains and/or beans? Just because they’re hard to get to doesn’t mean something won’t try; in fact, I’d probably assume the opposite of that. The harder something is to eat, the more animals are trying to eat it. That’s why it evolved to be so difficult to get to.
i never said that actually..i think that animals including us take nutrition wherever we can get it! i was just making an observation that we are the only creatures that cook something into becoming edible which can make you wonder if we should eat it or not. now what you just said about something being harder to eat makes it evolve into becoming harder to eat is silly, seeds are very important to plants because they are the future of their species all seeds are difficult to eat because of this reason…i am still a vegetarian on most days but will occasionally have meat i eat lots of grains and beans and i loooooooove bread. i’m not sure if we should eat grains and beans or not which is why i tried the paleo for about a week. the one thing i noticed was how easily meat is digested while the grains gave me heartburn and seemed to sit in my stomach for hours
Actually dairy can be eaten raw! There is a growing movement of folks who are demanding access to clean, safe, locally produced, organic raw milk and raw milk products. In many states it is legal to buy/sell raw milk. Some people who cannot tolerate store-bought milk can tolerate raw. There is, however, something to be said about the notion that cow milk was made for baby cows (and goat milk for kids, etc.). I must say that I feel immensely better after having eliminated dairy from my diet.
Beans and grains can be sprouted and eaten with water alone. I agree with what you are saying mostly, just wanted to add that.
Great stuff Mark. Once again had to forward this great post to all my family members!
I have now heard all of the above from people – usually while they stuff their mouths with cake or cookies. I guess the irony of “what about fiber” and lack of vitamins and minerals was lost on them…
“humans arent meant to eat grains” which is why every known civilization bases their diet off of some type of grain or starch.You cant name one that doesnt. Grains arent unhealthy , taste is subjective, and “primal” cultures today eat grains, dairy ect. and none of them do hiit or lift weights.
The Maasai Tribe. There’s one
and this proves that?
Inuit didn’t until they were partially assimilated – and grain-eating Inuits are extremely unhealthy – obese, prone to diabetes and heart attacks which their hunted-meat-only eating counterparts don’t suffer from.
The reason why non-nomadic civilizations base their diets in grains is because there came a point where humans became too overpopulated to live as nomadic hunters and growing grains thousands of years ago fed more people with less land. (the amount of land territory it takes from roaming hunter-gatherers is high compared to the land it takes to both grow grains and keep domesticated livestock)
Another reason why they used grains and livestock instead of only living off of livestock and vegetable crops is because grains can be stored in times of famine and can be traded as primitive currency to collect taxes and pay workers’ wages.
The fact that grains are unhealthy and a high-grain, high-carb sugar-based metabolism can mess up the health of even the most well-adapted grain-eater either didn’t become apparent enough to cause alarm or it wasn’t important enough when weighed in with the other benefits grains gave civilizations at that time. (So what if you die younger and are a little more unhealthy? At least when a crop-killing drought or animal-killing disease comes you’ll have grain reserves to keep your village/city alive and quench civil unrest)
civilization evolved because grains allowed population to increase and allowed stratification of society… just because grains are needed to sustain a population doesn’t mean they’re healthy. after the adoption of agriculture, life expectancy DECREASED, along with average height, free time, and probably a whole bunch of other things i can’t think of right now. that’s the whole point, eating like a caveman, sans grains, is healthier
You don’t know what cavemen ate. There’s even evidence that they ate grains as prior to the agricultural revolution.
Talking about primal cultures, I wondered what you guys think about the book of Weston A. Price, who studied a number of “primitive” cultures. Many of these groups did eat grains (rye, barley, etc.) or other carbohydrate rich vegetables. See his book:
http://www.journeytoforever.org/farm_library/price/pricetoc.html
Could it be that the health problem is mainly wheat and not all grains? And that only people that need to watch their weight may want to try the effect of eliminating more carbohydrates?
So if i eat a bowl of oatmeal, im basically going to die a slow horrible death. Got it.
I read the book and it makes a lot of sense but this is getting crazy. I’ve read people debating the carb count in TOMATOES?!?!?!
I didn’t get that message, the one about the slow horrible death. There’s ample proof that grains were not meant to be digested by humans. You can take it or leave it, but there are a lot of people that I know personally that were just as skeptical as you seem until they went without for a month.
You should try it if you haven’t already. I mean what is 30 days in an avg. lifespan of 77 years?
Not sure about the tomato thing. I haven’t known this site to ever be concerned with counting carbs, just eating healthier carbs.
Healthier carbs should be the first concern. Counting is secondary. Depending on your goals, you may need/want to reduce your carb input. I’ve used the Zone diet in the past to help me portion my macronutrient intake. Helpful, but I would suggest to anyone thinking about the Zone to only treat it as a guideline, and not as a full-on diet prescription. I found all the measuring and meal timing to be too burdensome. The general Primal rules are much better.
I’m with you, Tim, on how carb counting can get ridiculous. That is why, unless you are regimenting your diet for the sake of weight loss, I don’t recommend people do it (and even then not all the time).
Glad you liked the book.
http://www.marksdailyapple.com/dont-let-the-perfect-be-the-enemy-of-the-good/
http://www.marksdailyapple.com/dear-mark-8020-revisited/
http://www.marksdailyapple.com/will-momentary-compromises-derail-your-efforts/
Uh, so what???? lol
Nice rebuttal.
Carb counting is a Low CARB thing, not a paleo thing. It is really only important for diabetics or people who are so carb sensitive that eating fruit makes them ravenously hungry for all carbs, grains, fruits, sugars and other starches.
CARbs in a tomato…
That is basically people who have ruined their metabolism with grains and sugars. Tomatoes are fruit, and they have to take those into account if they are trying to keep their carb intake below a safe (for them) level). This concern is not related to paleo eating except that the diets are similar and they have recipes that they can glean to each other.
As a diabetic, it is in my best interest to carb count EVERYTHING, including tomatoes, which are actually a fruit and quite high in sugar. I might have two tablespoons of chopped tomatoes with a salad, but no more than that because my blood sugar goes through the roof if I do.
Oatmeal’s got one of the highest amounts of phytates of any grain so, long story short, yes.
Now, I love oatmeal (at least, with sweetener in it). In fact it was one of my staple foods in my vegan phase. I was already short on essential minerals and I think the oats just made it worse.
Hi Mark -
Just finishing your book today.
In regards to grains, I’d appreciate your opinion on this product, which I have as part of a morning smoothy:
http://www.ultimatelife.com/CatalogMealBenefits.htm
It is primarily greens, not grains — but it does have millet in it.
Thanks,
Paul
What’s your opinion on soaking grains first, Weston A. Price Foundation style?
Or sprouted grains. I’m curious also.
I tried sprouted bread this weekend, and as Mark pointed out above, it’s very tasty…when slathered with a generous helping of golden-yellow pastured butter.
Taste aside, I think if you don’t have a sensitivity to gluten, then soaked/sprouted/fermented grains overcome some of the main health detriments associated with grains and listed above; that is, they preserve nutrients (unlike polished grains) while getting rid of *most* antinutrients (unlike those “healthy” whole grains.)
But they’re still a bit carby – one slice of toast will run you 14g of carbs, and seriously, who eats one friggin’ slice of toast at a time? That’s 28 carbs for breakfast or a sandwhich, which, while probably much better than white bread, is probably still best used in moderation, like good milk. (Pastured butter, on the other hand, imo can and should be used in nearly everything…)
I’m not Mark, but I think WAPF guidelines for grains are extremely important for folks in poverty who can’t afford a lot of meat and/or don’t have the storage space for perishable whole foods. These folks are going to be heavily dependent on grain, and presoaking that grain in an acidic medium will render it a lot safer.
Very timely for me as well. Thank you. I’ve been struggling a bit lately in figuring out what’s good and bad for my individual system, and this is a great reminder of why I should never ever consider grains. Even if they taste good, they’re not worth it!
I posted this on Twitter, but might as well just place it here…
I think it’s a wise idea to avoid the grains, but when there are two people involved and only one of them is decidedly primal, sometimes the primal person has to make concessions.
In my house, dinner is whatever my wife puts on the table when she cooks. I’m extremely blessed that she is fairly on-board with primal foods, but there are times where we will have pasta or home made pizza… maybe a couple times a month. I think it’s a small sacrifice for me to make in order for her to not feel the burden of *my* dietary convictions when she doesn’t 100% believe in it. It’s a worthwhile sacrifice. Considering how much she and I have both changed our eating habits for the better, I can’t be happier. I don’t want to spend too much emotional effort nit-picking because in comparison, it’s only one small piece of a much bigger puzzle.
That’s what the 80/20 rule is for
If eating the occasional pizza is all it takes for you both to eat healthy the rest of the time, you’re doing quite well.
Absolutley! I have a family of 5 including my mother at home. No one else is “on-board” It makes everything a little more complicated. And you have to weigh your relationships into the mix. I think fundmentalism in any form isn’t a good thing. I still kept grains in the morning for a few weeks, but cut them out completly. I feel better then I ever have in my life! I don’t have interest in making exceptions, except for rare occassions. Beleiveing i am a food addict..cutting out grains and refind sugar is essential! So glad to have found PB and crossfit too!
Good point on the importance of making concessions. My fiance is very nonprimal, and sadly nothing I have been saying or doing has made a dent on his outlook (OK, so he switched from regular to diet coke, sigh). I do all of the cooking, and the primal way of cooking is further made difficult by the fact that he does not eat most veggies, nor many varieties of meat (oh and NO seafood of any kind). Anyway, we try the best we can — I’ll usually make him a potato side that I won’t eat, and buy low-carb tortillas for his beloved chicken fajitas. Thank god he loves steak almost as much as I do.
I was really stressed out in the beginning, but now realize it isn’t worth it since that isn’t helping anyone — if/when he is willing to make a change, I will be thrilled. For now, we do what we can to avoid going to bed angry
Thanks for the insight. I wish I could find myself a decidly primal/paleo-crossfittingesque-wonder-girl to avoid having to make those kinda sacrifices. Pretty damn rare amongst student life though… “ZOMG FREE DOMINOS AT FRESHERS!!”
So where do you go to school?
Haha! very smart!
I almost answered that without even realising.
Make him cook his own darn food.
You’re right. I should give it an honest go for 30 days and see how i feel. Right now i only eat oats for the most part anyway-so hopefully it isn’t too hard.
Sorry for the vague post by the way, i was in a hurry.
Tim – I miss oatmeal, too. I was thinking I might try heating up some almond flour in heavy cream and throwing a few berries in. Who says hot cereal has to be oats?
I miss oatmeal the most.
A couple times a winter I soak my cracked groats and cook them in a slow cooker.
Yummy. But I need a carbo-nap soon after.
I read groats as goats… Funny image
slow cooked cracked goats, mmmmmmmm….
Timely. I ordered a low-carb six dollar burger (per your recommendation) at lunch and they mistakenly gave me a regular six dollar burger. I was going to go ahead and eat the bun, then read this. It’s now sitting in the garbage.
hey marc. could you post some of the great science papers you have written on paleo and grains. thanks man.
Great article Mark,
I’m confused though, what makes the fiber from fruits and veggies desirable?
While I agree with most of the post, Mark fails to include the reasoning behind the article about the benefits of fiber: “It’s a bit of a paradox, but what we are saying is an injury at the cell level can promote health of the GI tract as a whole.”
Only including the words “rupturing”, “banging”, and “tearing” is an emotional appeal that exploits the traditionally negative connotations of these words. I thought dispelling, not reinforcing, traditional conventions was the goal of this site.
Nate, I’m just quoting verbatim the article in Science Daily (and linking it directly so anyone can read it). And yes I AM dispelling CW in that paragraph, since I am clearly questioning the rationale of the those terms (dispelling) as they could possibly apply to good gut health.
Well isn’t banging and tearing muscle fibers through hard lifting what gets them (and us) to grow stronger?
Intestinal lining isn’t muscle fiber. You absorb a lot of substances through it and it interfaces with your immune system so this is not something to play around with.
I have Crohn’s Disease and one of the things they told me is to avoid high-fiber (and high-G.I.) meals when I have Crohn’s inflammation – when I’d forget this, my intestinal immune system made sure to remind me, sometimes in not-so-subtle ways
My husband and I quit eating ALL grains this past March to reduce my triglycerides and improve my husband blood sugar level, and I received the unexpected result of having huge amounts of inflammation leaving my body more flexible than it had been since I was a small child! I am still amazed and thankful each and every day! Unless there are unexpected circumstances, I seriously do not see myself EVER eating grains again, especially wheat. Thanks for the site Mark!
That’s exactly my story. Quit grains, most especially wheat, and my inflammation dropped significantly. It dropped to the point where I don’t have to take meds anymore for IBS and I don’t have chronic foot pain. I now use my foot as a guide for inflammation levels. My body is functioning (and looking) SO MUCH BETTER without grains.
Mark et al.
Forgive for writing this, but I must pose a question.
Mark mentions cereal grains, and other things like spelt, millet, etc. However, are things like brown rice “less bad” for you? I would say it cant be any worse for you than a processed grain like flour.
Please divulge.
The term “cereal” means ALL grains, including rice and corn. It is a term used to describe the seed of any member of the grass family. That is, grains.
if we’re avioding cereal grains, i.e. all seeds of the grass family are we avoiding Asparagus also?
You eat asparagus seeds? Weird. I didn’t know they were edible.
Forgot to mention that Corn and Rice are in the grass family.
Thanks for laying this all out. Keep preaching also it needs to be repeated. I’m coming around on this – have cut way back on them and I’m leaner and feel better generally. But it’s tough in this ADM-centric world of ours it’s tough
If I eat grains only one day, the next day is a digestive disaster.
Any young person who doesn’t yet have IBS, or the like, take heed now. Don’t wait till you develop these conditions.
Wish this site had been around 20 years ago!
Rachel Allen- I second this!! I ate grains most of my life with no symptoms (I’m now 38) and just recently developed IBS. After giving up grains (and beans, sugar & almost all dairy) 2 months ago, I have eliminated my symptoms!
I, too, wish this site had been around 20 years ago!
)
Excellent Post and VERY important. I developed Crohn’s at 23 and put on all kinds of drugs. I’ve since quit grains and the drugs and have had my inflammation levels drop significantly and I literally have no markings that would show that I have Crohn’s anymore.
Don’t wait to quit grains, quit them now especially if you are of European descent. GI will doctors will say diet has nothing to do with it. They are either liars or very misinformed. Diet is EVERYTHING.
Yes, I love how GI docs will tell you that diet has nothing to do with diseases of the GI tract.
Heartburn too, is diet related. If it is true hyperacidity, eliminating grains can cure it.
Sadly, many people with heartburn are actually hypochloridic, meaning lacking stomach acid. They are put on PPIs which only exacerbate the problem.
That is strange that your GI docs act this way – at the hospital when they realized I had crohn’s and not appendicitis (the large baseball-sized absessed fistula going from my guts to my kidney may have been a clue), they gave me a printout with a small table of high, moderate and low fiber/G.I. foods and suggested to eat low fiber/G.I. during flare-ups (G.I. being a euphemism for carbs).
My GI doc emphasizes stress over diet but I’m pretty sure that’s becasue it’s much easier to detect which foods damage your intestines and which do not whereas stress is more omnipresent and harder to gauge.
Of all doctors I’d think GI docs would be the most pro-primal, anti-grain docs out there, even with their limited nutritional training.
Excellant article Mark. I have been turnded on to the Paleo way of eating since reading Neanderthin. I have never felt better after giving up my grains. Potatoes were harder to give up since I am Irish. LOL.
I love your website and your articles are very well written. Here is another site that give more of the bad effects of grains, potatoes, milk, etc.
http://www.earth360.com/diet_paleodiet_balzer.html
I never was a big grain-eater or grain-lover, so scaling back consumption to zero was easy.
Then again… by cutting them out, I discovered just how many grains I had actually been consuming via mindless noshing. A few crackers here, a few chips there…
Once I made the decision to pass them by, I found I was regularly stopping myself from grabbing grain junk because “Oh yeah, I won’t eat that anymore”.
Cutting out snacking by 90% and ditching those sugars/starches/grains made a huge difference in my weight and body composition, even with no change in exercise habits. I am a solid 15 lbs less than what SAD had fixed as my low “do-not-cross weight threshhold”, and yet no cravings.
My body/mind isn’t going wacko trying to revert to its “normal” weight. This **is** my normal weight! It’s so easy it’s unreal. Usually by now – heading into winter – I had always been afflicted with chronic cardio burnout and massive carb cravings. You know, to get back to a supposed “set point” [only to have to lose the flab again the following summer].
Now I have plenty of room in my diet for fats I could never enjoy in the past, plus some new ones I find absolutely delightful (coconut, macadamia oil). That means I am eating foods that I am supposed to be eating to keep everything working properly. I feel great and am now looking forward to focusing on a better exercise scheme, instead of wanting/needing to get away from it all. (I am 5’5″ and 115#)
Grains, it wasn’t even nice knowing ya…
Thanks for the solution to the maize, Mark.
OMG! 115# at 5’5 …you’re my new motivator.
Been around 150# (height 5’5) since high school..I’m now 22.
I was max 130 prior to reducing grains – (5’4″ AND A HALF thankyouverymuch
weighed in at 118 yesterday and am still losing weight. You can do it! I feel SO much better in general, now.
WHAT? Really? Ugh.. Im so ill informed on everything food-wise. I will never go veg or vegan but I can ditch grains no problem.. I need to start from square one. I guess this sites a good start..
I feel so guilty reading this over a bowl of pasta. Tomorrow, a salad is a must.
Don’t eat lettuce in your salad….lettuce “doesn’t want to be eaten”….
I’m often amazed at how some people have been primal for so long, yet they fall off the wagon still.
I’m going to write about this on my site.
Honestly I think that some of us are more “addicted” than others. Even though there is a huge burn-out and long-term effects there is pleasure involved initially in eating grains for many people.
It’s like being a drug addict in a society where it’s frowned upon if you’re NOT using it…