Marks Daily Apple

1. 

   DiabetesCanKissMyButt
   Member

   Hi- I'm new- first week trying the primal way.

   If I choose to eat dairy, am I understanding correctly that I am supposed to choose higher fat versions instead of skim ? I am having a hard time wrapping my brain around going higher fat because of all the info hammered into me over the years to do low fat or no fat on all dairy. I am type 2 diabetic also so from a triglycerides & LDL stand-point, is it really okay for me to go for the higher varieties. OR should I eliminate dairy altogether. The dairy I eat now is usually non fat greek yogurt, low moisture part skim mozerella, and non fat milk. I don't have high tri's or LDL right now but certainly don't want that to change. Thoughts? I switched from just eating egg whites to whole eggs a few months ago and that change was hard also because of the fear of cholesterol in the yolks. Again, info that's been hammered into me as a type 2.

   Thanks for listening as I try to sort out my mixed up feelings on the matter. Any feedback you have would be great- whether you shun dairy altogether or go for higher fat options. Let me hear your story.

   T

   Posted 5 months ago #
2. 

   madMUHHH
   Member

   I don't know whether it makes any difference that you have diabetis, I'm guessing it's not.

   The whole eggs/choleserol thing is just completely wrong, there's really nothing to worry about in egg yolks, it's actually the better part of the egg. And the same goes for dairy. If you eat dairy, I'd recommend to go as raw and full-fat as possible. After all the percentage of sugar in it will also be lower than, won't it?

   Posted 5 months ago #
3. 

   Ecala
   Member

   It's been hammered into everyone. It's probably the biggest health scam in history-- the low/no fat craze.

   Don't buy into it.

   Humans EVOLVED on saturated fat. No way would the human race survive on low fat or no fat.

   There are tons of resources to read up on the benefits of a high fat diet.

   Start here
   http://westonaprice.org/knowyourfats/index.html

   Posted 5 months ago #
4. 

   Diana Renata
   Member

   The low-fat thing is really hard to get past, and it takes a while. I'm mostly over it. I think what helps is how wonderfully satisfying fatty foods are.

   Maybe try to ease into it, a little fat here and there, and gradually increase until you're at a healthy amount. I still supplement with fish oil to help fill the gaps.

   Posted 5 months ago #
5. 

   Miriam
   Member

   If you decide to stick with diary please change to the full fat preferably raw or unhomoganised and organic and of course with yoghurt buy plain and add your own fruit/nuts,whatever as not only is it better for you, it also tastes so much better and also you will be satisfied for longer due to the higher fat content.

   Non fat yoghurt seems a bizarre concept to me (and what do they put in place of the fat?) but the times I have had the lower fat yogurt it has always tasted a bit watery and weird and there is nothing better than scooping the layer of yummy cream off the top of a new container of my full fat organic yoghurt...mmmm!

   Good luck with your new primal ways, slowly but surely add a bit of fat here (and also cutting out the grains and sugar)and there and next thing you will be eat steak covered in butter with no fear.

   Posted 5 months ago #
6. 

   Daughter of Grok
   Member

   Love the fat! Love the fat! Love the fat! That one basic premise will cause you to make huge strides in your nutritional quests! It will become quite invigorating after a while when you can eat high fat foods that your friends shy away from and maintain better health.

   Posted 5 months ago #
7. 

   SerialSinner
   Member

   Fat me

   Posted 5 months ago #
8. 

   musajen
   Member

   I had a hard time accepting the higher fat thing at first, especially saturated fat. But I decided that trying it for a month wasn't going to do irreparable damage so I took a chance.

   It's amazing how much better I feel with a diet that's about 60% fat and void of vegetable oils. I don't get ravenously hungry anymore and don't have to immediately get food in my belly. My mood is much improved too.

   I'm not able to find raw milk in my area so my next best option is Farmer's All Natural Creamery, organic, vat-pasteurized, non-homogenized whole milk. It's amazing and gets a layer of cream on top of it - love scooping that off and eating it. I was never a milk drinker until I discovered this milk and I'm not ready to give it up yet. Someday maybe, but for now dairy is going to be a part of my diet.

   Posted 5 months ago #
9. 

   matt beaudreau
   Member

   If you are type II diabetic, I'd still stay away from the dairy. While everyone is correct that full fat is the way to go, you have to worry about the fact that dairy still results in an enormous insulin spike, which is obviously not ideal for a type II diabetic.

   Posted 5 months ago #
10. 

    DiabetesCanKissMyButt
    Member

    ecala, thank you for that link. Good info to start with.

    thank all of you for your thoughtful responses.

    matt, I was afraid someone was going to say this about the insulin spike :-( It's why I am debating about cutting dairy altogether. Maybe as a once in awhile thing.

    diana- I take 1 tsp of Carlsons cod liver oil once a day. It has definitely helped with blood sugar for sure. I have been thinking about coconut oil more also and need to read up on that. I actually registered here because of the info you posted on runnersworld about MDA. I love following the conversations over there - have not posted other than in the beginners forum though. Things can get pretty heated and I prefer to stay out of that.

    T

    Posted 5 months ago #
11. 

    DiabetesCanKissMyButt
    Member

    well I went ahead and bought some whole milk. I must have sat and looked at it for about 15 minutes before I actually drank it. lol. anyway I checked my blood sugar 1 hour and 2 hours after drinking it and I did not get the spike I was expecting. This morning's fasting glucose was 85. pretty darn good.

    Posted 5 months ago #
12. 

    Dollface
    Member

    Matt, is this true for butter too? is there evidence that full fat dairy causes an insulin spike? I would have thought since it had so much fat it wouldn't except for maybe milk but cheese and butter I'm suprised by this.

    Posted 5 months ago #
13. 

    Ecala
    Member

    Oh yeah, I'd be curious about the butter. Does it cause a spike? (hope not)

    Posted 5 months ago #
14. 

    Paneristi
    Member

    Used to shy away from FAT but its my best friend now.

    In fact yesterday I had some cold rump steak slices of steak topped with butter and beetroot slices...my wife thinks I've gone completely MAd ...

    Posted 5 months ago #
15. 

    matt beaudreau
    Member

    It's the actual dairy proteins that cause the spike, not the fat. Not the same hormonal response from butter or cream because it is mostly just the fat. Cheese is moderate to high depending on the type. Hope that helps

    Posted 5 months ago #
16. 

    Dollface
    Member

    Thanks matt, that does help :) I've cut out all dairy recently to experiment but I'm missing a little bit of cream and butter, for the added fat content also. I love cheese but would rather it be a treat every now and then especially if it causes an insulin spike. I'm not bothered by milk or yoghurt so that's good.

    Posted 5 months ago #
17. 

    deepthought
    Member

    @Matt: I'm interrested in the facts behind the "milk protein insulin spiking phenomena". Do you have a link or reading tip on this?
    And... cream and sour cream, would those work as milk(insulin spike) or as butter(no insulin spike)?

    Posted 5 months ago #
18. 

    Jedi
    Member

    http://bradpilon.com/?s=protein+insulin+ Brad Pilon has an interesting video on how protein causes a similar insulin spike to carbs.

    Posted 5 months ago #
19. 

    deepthought
    Member

    interresting, thanks! But I'm still sceptical to anyone who promotes the calories in- calories out thesis, wich he does a bit down on the same page.

    Posted 5 months ago #
20. 

    Jedi
    Member

    yeh, I understand your skepicism. I love his fatsing stuff and am disappointed in his general approach tro nutrition. i would like Mark to address th protein spiking insulin issue, though.

    Posted 5 months ago #
21. 

    erik.cisler
    Member

    Protein also spikes glucagon, which - as I understand it - helps release stored fat for energy.

    Posted 5 months ago #
22. 

    Jedi
    Member

    Merci Erik, this gives me some more research I can do :)

    Posted 5 months ago #
23. 

    matt beaudreau
    Member

    I will try to find some links for everyone regarding this topic. I got this specific information from a recent seminar with Robb Wolf, a nutritional biochemist, who has worked exstensively with Loren Cordain (author of The Paleo Diet). I'll see what links I can conjure up for you as well.

    Posted 5 months ago #
24. 

    Tarlach
    Member

    The human body requires a certain amount of glycerin to function (100g?). Fat cycling in cells (i.e. brain cells) requires glycerin to bond three fatty acids into triglycerides.

    If you eat enough carbs, your body gets the sugar from there. If you eat very low carb, your body will convert protein into the required glycerin.

    I don't see why animal protein would cause an unwanted spike in blood sugar. Blood sugar may go up slightly, but this is necessary for normal bodily function.

    Dairy can stall weight loss on a very low carb diet and thus may indicate a higher insulin response to milk protein.

    Posted 5 months ago #
25. 

    deepthought
    Member

    @matt. Thanks! waiting in exitement.

    Posted 5 months ago #
26. 

    quasi13
    Member

    According to this study, both whey and casein have independent affects on insulin and insulin growth factor, respectively:
    http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/19471293

    I wonder which protein sources have the least affect. Does anyone have data on that?

    Posted 5 months ago #

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