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Thread: Are Lollipops Techinically Better Nutrition Than Wheat? page 2

  1. #11
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    Whole wheat has beneficial nutrients, lolly pops do not.

    If you were to actually carry out such a study I would suggest recruiting a lot of celiac patients and assigning them to the wheat eating group. That way you could really prove you're hypothesis.


    It would be about as honest as the people who promote low carb diets by putting them up against low fat junk food diets and declaring low carb diets winners.

  2. #12
    oxide's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by God View Post
    This is how science is done these days. You start with an idea you want to push, then you craft a study to prove your idea.
    God here is correct that this IS the scientific method. It's not just how it it's done "these days." It's how it's been done in the days since ancient Greece. Observation, hypothesis, prediction based on hypothesis, experiment, observe the results yes/no, modify the hypothesis to account for observation, new prediction based on new hypothesis, experiment, etc. And yes, even supposedly neutral scientists have to "push" ideas in order to get the funding. However, any "pushed" idea still must be proven by results. Propaganda don't matter if there are experiments which disprove it.

    The problem is that it's nearly impossible to control all the conditions so you can isolate what is causing the results. You can't really tell if your experimental results were caused by your hypothesis, or by some other piece of the hypothesis you don't know about, or by a skew in the sample. Science is hard enough to do even on the molecular scale where there are fewer variables; in people-based studies it's nearly impossible.

    God, for your study, it's probably best to use the SAME set of people.* Feed them the wheat for six months, then switch them all to candy for six months. That will filter out the variations among people.

    MEANWHILE, back on the original topic. It doesn't matter if wheat has nutrition. We're already getting all the nutrients from meat and veggies. The question is whether it's better to get our sugar from sugar, or from wheat which is digested into sugar. I'm only an N=1, but I cheated like a mutha with candy for the past few months and gained maybe five pounds. Actually, every couple days, I got tired of sugar and had to back off for a couple days, then started sugar again. It was more like a carb refeed than SAD. If I stopped the candy, the weight drops fast. (this is with NO exercise). But with wheat, I never got tired of it, and couldn't lose any weight at all.

    If you're really in need of the micronutrients from wheat, just eat Ketchmer wheat germ from the jar and avoid the whole wheat berry. The endosperm is where most of the carbs are.

    -----------
    *businesses do the same thing when they track sales on a yearly basis. They track "same store" sales to filter out factors like location or customer income.
    5'0" female, 43 years old. Started Primal October 31, 2011, at a skinny fat 111.5 lbs. Low weight: 99.5 lb on a fast. Current weight: skinny-fat 106.5 lbs because of sugar cheating.

    MY PRIMAL: I (try to) follow by-the-book primal as advocated by Mark Sisson, except for whey powder and a bit of cream. I aim for 80-90 g carb/day and advocate a two-month strict adjustment for newbies. But everybody is different and other need to tweak Primal to their own needs.

  3. #13
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    Quote Originally Posted by God View Post
    Yeah, I know, this seems like another one of those hare-brained threads of mine.
    This is the truth right here.
    Female, 5'3", 49, Starting weight: 163lbs. Current weight: 135 (more or less).
    I can squat 180lbs, press 72.5lbs and deadlift 185lbs

  4. #14
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    Candy? I can't eat the stuff. It's impossible to find it without wheat, nuts, soy, peanuts and a myriad of other things that I can't/won't eat.

    Sugar cubes? I sometimes indulge
    Stumbled into Primal due to food allergies, and subsequent elimination of non-primal foods.

    Start Gluten-Free/Soy-Free: December 2012; start weight 158lbs, Ladies size 6
    Start Primal: March 2013, start weight 150lbs, Ladies size 6
    Current: 132lbs, Ladies size 2
    F/23/5'9"

    26lbs lost since cutting the crap.

  5. #15
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    Quote Originally Posted by God View Post
    Plus, your study wouldn't produce the result I want, which is to make wheat look worse than candy, which it is.
    Sorry bro, that's not how science works. You're supposed to disprove your hypothesis, and when you absolutely can't, then and only then can you say it's proven.

  6. #16
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    I don't know....

    Would you rather cut off your pinky finger or your little toe? Would you rather have your testicles slammed in a drawer or crushed by a ball pin hammer?

    Some questions are just too difficult to answer.

  7. #17
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    Quote Originally Posted by Neckhammer View Post
    I don't know....

    Would you rather cut off your pinky finger or your little toe? Would you rather have your testicles slammed in a drawer or crushed by a ball pin hammer?

    Some questions are just too difficult to answer.
    but Neckhammer,
    I can answer both of those.

    1. Toe. Otherwise I'd never be able to play the ukelele.
    2. Drawer. I mean, neither would be my strong preference, but drawer beats hammer.
    The Champagne of Beards

  8. #18
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    Quote Originally Posted by RichMahogany View Post
    but Neckhammer,
    I can answer both of those.

    1. Toe. Otherwise I'd never be able to play the ukelele.
    2. Drawer. I mean, neither would be my strong preference, but drawer beats hammer.
    #1 - a sign. Thank you.

    #2 - I don't even have testicles except as occasional visitors, and both the drawer and the hammer make me wince. You're brave to choose the drawer, because in the wrong hands (an angry ex?), the drawer would be as excruciating as the hammer. Though I guess the upside would be knowing where they were if they ended up in the drawer rather than splattered hither and yon across the universe.
    "Right is right, even if no one is doing it; wrong is wrong, even if everyone is doing it." - St. Augustine

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  9. #19
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    I wonder about this question now that I have a child and family/friends/people offer her all sorts of food ranging from bread to pastries to candies. My daughter is naturally curious about all the foods we don't have at home, and is always excited to get treats. I cannot always stop her from eating them or people from offering them because we are with people all the time. Given this, what is the least harmful choice?

    I'm more okay with dd eating simple sugars/sweets over wheat. She gets constipated after a few days of bread. The problem with most candy is there are other additives such as food coloring in them besides sugar. I try to replace those low quality candies with dark chocolate or dried fruit (or just plain fruit if she will take it).

    It's hard to find lollipops with just sugar and nothing else. Eating a lot of candy means ingesting a lot of other substances. So we are back to... just eat whole foods..
    Last edited by girlhk; 01-09-2014 at 05:49 PM.

  10. #20
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    Quote Originally Posted by girlhk View Post
    I wonder about this question now that I have a child and family/friends/people offer her all sorts of food ranging from bread to pastries to candies. My daughter is naturally curious about all the foods we don't have at home, and is always excited to get treats. I cannot always stop her from eating them or people from offering them because we are with people all the time. Given this, what is the least harmful choice?

    I'm more okay with dd eating simple sugars/sweets over wheat. She gets constipated after a few days of bread. The problem with most candy is there are other additives such as food coloring in them besides sugar. I try to replace those low quality candies with dark chocolate or dried fruit (or just plain fruit if she will take it).
    This is good. It addresses the fact that we all live in a world with people who don't think the way we think.

    I think if you keep a "clean" home, your daughter will do fine. Sweets are alluring, but ultimately, when I think of the foods I'd hate to live without, almost no desserts or sweets make the list.

    One day, your daughter will have to face the world without you at her side. I would bet donuts to dollars, that even if she strays for awhile, eventually, she'll come back to what she grew up with. So, if you make that healthy, fun, tasty food, that will be what she loves. Those childhood memories of what Mom fed us, unless they are Ore-Ida potato poopies, will last a lifetime as good memories and will be go-to foods.
    "Right is right, even if no one is doing it; wrong is wrong, even if everyone is doing it." - St. Augustine

    B*tch-lite

    Who says back fat is a bad thing? Maybe on a hairy guy at the beach, but not on a crab.

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