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Thread: Eating Paleo, But Don't Believe in Evolution? page 20

  1. #191
    oceangrl's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by bloodorchid View Post

    every time you see kimchi just grab a bud light and turn on some toby keith to offset the 'down with usa'ism
    Okay you now just won " funniest post ever".

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  2. #192
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    yes! what do i win?!

    please say a tiara please say a tiara please say a tiara
    beautiful
    yeah you are

    I mean there's so many ants in my eyes! And there are so many TVs, microwaves, radios... I think, I can't, I'm not 100% sure what we have here in stock.. I don't know because I can't see anything! Our prices, I hope, aren't too low!

  3. #193
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    Quote Originally Posted by bloodorchid View Post
    yes! what do i win?!

    please say a tiara please say a tiara please say a tiara
    Totally a tiara. For reals..:-$

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  4. #194
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    Quote Originally Posted by bloodorchid View Post
    i've seen pics of offspring from weiner dogs (yes that's the proper latin terminology) and golden retrievers iirc. they CAN cross, they're all dogs, but some breeds need medical intervention to give birth safely
    I personally wouldn't call that successful breeding. Or smart.

  5. #195
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    Quote Originally Posted by 0Angel0 View Post
    I missed that argument if he made it. Either way it's incorrect. We know random mutations occur. Mutations that are not simply genetic recombination, which would allow expression of recessive genes. It's not even really an explanation for why selection pressures working on said random mutations over time would have some sort of built in stopping point. If there was a stopping point why has nobody discovered it? Never mind the fact that we've actually observed changes that do split into two species.

    In my earlier post I gave an example of chromosomal mutations in a polyploid plant, Tragopogon, that lead to speciation. Polyploidy, the duplication of genes, has been a strong driver in plant evolution. He mistakenly tried to use "genetic drift", which describes a changing frequency of genes in a given population, to discredit the fact that speciation occurs at all. He is apparently unaware that genetic drift is actually a mechanism of speciation.
    Eureka is right, about some of what I've said, other things you have cherrypicked in order to make it seem like my argument is weaker than it is, but I've exhausted most of these things in my various posts strewn out in this thread. What you've described is not speciation, but you're still not understanding. Your problem is you're clearly ignoring forms of genetic science. Are you aware of the Hardy Weinberg principle? Hybridization also can cause you to lose polymorphisms because the Hardy Weinberg principle doesn't apply to gene flow and migrant polymorphisms become fixed. If all existing clusters hybridized we'd be left with only one cluster rather than many. Genuine evolution requires new genes into the gene-pool of a species. A re-assembly of what is already there is not evolution, it is a very small(micro) change in the grand scheme of things. If two variations can no longer interbreed, they have become more limited in their gene pool, and more restricted in its ability to manage its environment; hence the above theory of hybridizing clusters.

    You'll argue mutational change, but this isn't a normal variational reshuffling of the DNA code, but an actual change in one tiny item in the code information. Are you aware of how vastly complex one tiny pin of DNA coding is, yet you postulate that, defying all conventional laws of genetics and DNA, that several of these tiny variations over time will add up to one large one that would mean speciation. Do you not understand that everything you're implying is not an example of a large change? You argue that these variations in Mendelian genetics is evolution. You're wrong. To assert this means you have an absolute lack of knowledge in genetics and this subject. You assert things with such fact that you ignore not even evolutionists support this fact; Lewontin for example, which he explains that natural selection cannot occur if the species does not already have the trait, and that it operates essentially to enable the organisms to maintain their state of adaptation rather than to improve it. It does not explain evolution, nor as Rich points out, the origin of the species. This is foolish. If your theory is correct, ponder this; why are there distinct species at all? Surely, all these minor changes across species alters them enough to have one large change or no distinct species. Is this not proof of our DNA wall, which, you say has no barrier and no limits.

    What does every example you have listed have in common? Have you not looked at the genetic difference between the species you're saying have vastly changed? I would bet my money on no. With this, you ignore several theories, either intentionally, or unintentionally, and give very simplistic and horribly thought out arguments towards evolution, one key theory is ignoring the DNA limitation that allows all sorts of variation between it, and regression toward the mean. With all your vast knowledge of evolution, you've obviously ran into this theory, yes? Want to explain it? This plant and animal breeders all run into this same problem, a literal wall in DNA preventing its transcendence beyond.

    Another thing, which you ignorantly, and erroneously allude to is polyploidy; which is a variation in the numbers of chromosomes and rearrangements of chromosomal material. This isn't proof of evolution, only if you're myopic and brainwashed by Darwinian propaganda, it does not produce anything beyond the limits already established. We know normal cells are diploid, with double sets of similar chromosomes, and that reproductive cells are haploid(though you might not know this judging by your responses), with only one set. Haploid male and female cells unite in zygote to form the diploid cell. What you're referring to, found in plants but very rarely in animals, is three or more haploid chromosomes together in an organism. These breeders can produce polyploid in plants with chemicals like colchicine. Then you arrogantly assume that because this plant has now taken on many more chromosomes, and inherited traits of another plant, that it has somehow evolved into an entire different species. Nope, sorry, this did not occur, and if I weren't dealing with clearly people who have only read one book on the subject, I wouldn't even have to explain this. You're again just referring to the same genetic theories which you've routinely ignored. What about the polyploidy rodents which you ignored probably because they still clearly look like rodents just ones that have inherited undesirable traits.

    Keep on keeping on that these insignificant changes in DNA are grand altering macro changes or evolution, if you new how complicated the DNA actually was, and were aware of the barrier, you wouldn't be posting such absurd things. Don't cherrypick my posts next time, lest I put all of it in one large post that touches up on everything. You're the one being intellectually dishonest.
    Last edited by Derpamix; 11-03-2013 at 08:21 AM.
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  6. #196
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    Quote Originally Posted by Hannakb View Post
    I personally wouldn't call that successful breeding. Or smart.
    They have to, otherwise they become sterile, another key argument to my posts.
    Longing is the agony of the nearness of the distant

  7. #197
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    Caught up to the rest of 0Angel0's posts; now, in order to formulate a proper argument, I would like you to answer the following questions:

    If my genetic drift theory were wrong, and I didn't know what I was talking about, explain sudden extinction of many species without proper cause. Your variation in speed which said evolution occurred. Phylogenetics, and orthogenetics; and finally, why some organisms don't evolve at all. For Darwin, there is no species, so none of these things should be occurring. Or am I not understanding evolution still because you say I don't and want to assert your made up authority on the subject and give new terms and restrictions to deflect criticism tu quoque. You're failing badly.
    Longing is the agony of the nearness of the distant

  8. #198
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    In the past 150 years, no scientist has thought of Derp's argument against evolution using basic biology.....up until RIGHT now, on this forum, has another human thought of this and put it forth. Evolution, as of right now on MDA in 2013, is hence dead based on the devastation of that argument. Discussion over. We have all been witness to greatness, genius, and unfathomable human insight. Bow. Bow.
    "They now look to a single and splendid government of an aristocracy, founded on banking institutions, and moneyed incorporations under the guise and cloak of their favored branches of manufactures, commerce and navigation, riding and ruling over the plundered ploughman and beggared yeomanry." - Thomas Jefferson, 1826

  9. #199
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    Quote Originally Posted by TheyCallMeLazarus View Post
    Evolution, as of right now on MDA in 2013, is hence dead based on the devastation of that argument. Discussion over. We have all been witness to greatness, genius, and unfathomable human insight. Bow. Bow.
    *whew* Well, I, for one, am glad that is settled.
    somehow I manage to leave my intelligence and decorum at the door wherever I go. I doubt your journal will be an exception to that - not on the rug

    What the F&#* is a decorum? - Mr. Anthony

  10. #200
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    Quote Originally Posted by TheyCallMeLazarus View Post
    In the past 150 years, no scientist has thought of Derp's argument against evolution using basic biology.....up until RIGHT now, on this forum, has another human thought of this and put it forth. Evolution, as of right now on MDA in 2013, is hence dead based on the devastation of that argument. Discussion over. We have all been witness to greatness, genius, and unfathomable human insight. Bow. Bow.
    Look, "friend", I know that they have, and I know the responses. I have read them all. I could refute and argue with myself, and I have. What does this get? Trying to prove anything using science by its definition leaves open possibility of disproof, which, when displayed openly, gets viciously attacked by people unable to think for themselves. Or, as you so ineloquently put in a large stew of nonsense(as you usually do): b-grade pseudo-intellectuals. Though, accepting something as fact and going with consensus apparently makes you brilliant, even if this makes little sense.

    My point isn't to debate with them at the moment, it's to measure the intelligence of the atheists on this forum.
    Last edited by Derpamix; 11-03-2013 at 10:00 AM.
    Longing is the agony of the nearness of the distant

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