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Thread: On the contrary... page

  1. #1
    monkspeed's Avatar
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    On the contrary...

    Hi all,

    I want to pick your brains if I may?

    This forum is a part of Mark Sisson's website right?
    Mark Sisson is the creator of The Primal Blueprint correct?
    The primal blueprint is a list of idioms to help people lead a healthier fuller life yes?

    Are you still with me? Hang on I'm getting there!

    TPB idea at its core is a low carbohydrate diet, and against chronic cardio yes?

    OK good. Why are some of you here advocating the complete opposite? I have read about someone advising a 600g carb diet, others advising jogging 5 times a week, one woman beating on men that walk on a treadmill and god knows what else.

    Why?

    Would you not feel better conversing with others of similar interests as your own?

    For example if I went onto a Honda Civic forum and proclaimed that they were no good and everyone should buy a VW, I'd be desecrated within 30 seconds. I'd probably receive an instant permaban for trying to stir up trouble no?

    Please understand that I am not trying to make trouble here, merely to understand where some of you are coming from.

    Talk to me people! All intelligent replies considered.

    My PB & Workout Log

  2. #2
    dilberryhoundog's Avatar
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    The MDA forum is like a music festival, a few headline acts but lots of other little gems to find also.

    A CW health board is like going to an international band's touring show, basically a whole bunch of peeps worshipping the same boring crap.

    Nearly everyone here did primal at some point. Just some morphed out of it but stuck around. It's all good. It's still an Internet forum tho, so there is still some antics going on.

    Difference of opinion = great


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  3. #3
    Zach's Avatar
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    Agree with Dberry, everyone here has done Primal at some point so their opinions are valid no matter what they advocate. This forum is one of the biggest health forums on the internet, its more fun to have discussions, disagree and learn then to just agree on everything all the time.

  4. #4
    namelesswonder's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by monkspeed View Post
    TPB idea at its core is a low carbohydrate diet, and against chronic cardio yes?
    Re: low carb diet, that is an argument that has been rehashed here many times. Yes and no. It depends on your definitions of low carb. Compared to the SAD, sure. But not "low" in that it's inadequate. Also depends on individual needs. On chronic cardio, you are correct.

    Why are some of you here advocating the complete opposite? I have read about someone advising a 600g carb diet, others advising jogging 5 times a week, one woman beating on men that walk on a treadmill and god knows what else.
    Have never seen exercise suggestions like that here.

    In regards to food, because not everyone here follows Mark Sisson's Primal Blueprint. To the letter, or at all.

    Would you not feel better conversing with others of similar interests as your own?
    That can get boring. Why resist diversity?

    For example if I went onto a Honda Civic forum and proclaimed that they were no good and everyone should buy a VW, I'd be desecrated within 30 seconds. I'd probably receive an instant permaban for trying to stir up trouble no?
    Well, this isn't that forum, obviously. It's public and basically entirely open to anyone who wishes to post with regards to forum rules. That does not include anything about having to follow a particular diet, way of eating, or way of living. Banning someone for disagreeing is pretty silly, IMO. I like having dissenters around, as long as they're respectful and willing to debate civilly. I think people learn a lot by having some contrast around, both about their own choices & potential new ways of thinking.
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  5. #5
    Leida's Avatar
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    If you have studied Sisson's posts, you will see that low carb version is the starting point version prior to the introduction of the exercise other than SM. To people who exercise more vigorously, Sisson recommends increase in carbohydrates. Sisson is also not against joyful cardio. And, to be fair, Sisson also wrote against ketogenic diets long-term or with higher training loads. Finally, Sisson supports self-experimentation.

    I always found it ironic that VLC is being married with the active primal lifestyle, when VLC is the best for the sedentary weight loss.

    The core of primal is self-experimentation and deviation from the more narrowly defined Paleo diet. (I mean, you want to see narrow, turn to Cordain). The premise is that of eating non-toxic natural foods prepared in the ways that enhance the nutritional value. That may include nearly everything actually. I remember one of Mark's blogs where he speaks that avoiding grains and legumes is a shortcut, rather than dogma, because preparing grains and legumes is time-consuming. All and all, avoiding commercial processed food, damaging oils and wheat is to me 99% of success. The rest is open to debate and individual experience.

    Deviations from the carb curve or PB workouts are people making the core ideas work for their lifestyle and individual body requirements. This is not to be feared. Most of us cannot emulate Sisson's leisure Californian lifestyle and athletic ability.
    Last edited by Leida; 09-30-2013 at 09:59 AM.
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  6. #6
    paleodog's Avatar
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    It's a forum. Take what you like and leave the rest. The things posted are as varied as the people who post them. One could drive oneself crazy trying to make sense of it all. Take what fits you and discard all else.

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    Greg Rx's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by monkspeed View Post
    Hi all,

    I want to pick your brains if I may?

    This forum is a part of Mark Sisson's website right?
    Mark Sisson is the creator of The Primal Blueprint correct?
    The primal blueprint is a list of idioms to help people lead a healthier fuller life yes?

    Are you still with me? Hang on I'm getting there!

    TPB idea at its core is a low carbohydrate diet, and against chronic cardio yes?

    OK good. Why are some of you here advocating the complete opposite? I have read about someone advising a 600g carb diet, others advising jogging 5 times a week, one woman beating on men that walk on a treadmill and god knows what else.

    Why?

    Would you not feel better conversing with others of similar interests as your own?

    For example if I went onto a Honda Civic forum and proclaimed that they were no good and everyone should buy a VW, I'd be desecrated within 30 seconds. I'd probably receive an instant permaban for trying to stir up trouble no?

    Please understand that I am not trying to make trouble here, merely to understand where some of you are coming from.

    Talk to me people! All intelligent replies considered.

    My PB & Workout Log
    My thoughts exactly. It seems that 2/3 of the posts on the forum are athletes or low BMI folks who think Mark could not possibly be talking to them.
    The other 1/3 are seriously over weight and need to stick with the plan. And yes those people are quite sedentary. If you tell them to eat less and exercise more, you are setting them up for failure, same as CW. If an obese person tries to lose weight on 100 or even 50gm of carbohydrates, they will give up in frustration of hunger and cravings. But stay vlc and high fat until you lose 10 or 15% of your body fat, then you can experiment with adding carbs and exercise to the mix. Weight loss and the ability to occasionally go 24 hours between meals, are signs of repaired hormonal signaling. Snacking, alcohol, and stress will totally undermine this process. Mark's plan accomplishes this but doesn't explain it very well. Drs Kruse and Mercola do a much better job.
    As others have posted, they all started Primal but moved away after their success. I wish they would have the courtesy to allow the rest of us the same opportunity.
    Last edited by Greg Rx; 09-30-2013 at 01:18 PM.

  8. #8
    Greg Rx's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by paleodog View Post
    It's a forum. Take what you like and leave the rest. The things posted are as varied as the people who post them. One could drive oneself crazy trying to make sense of it all. Take what fits you and discard all else.
    The problem is, someone ask for advise and two or three posters, all supporting the same misinformation,take over the conversion, as if it was in the book.
    Primal/Paleo is based on the fact that not all calories are equal and to dispute that, on this forum, is just disrespectful.

  9. #9
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    Quote Originally Posted by Greg Rx View Post
    The problem is, someone ask for advise and two or three posters, all supporting the same misinformation,take over the conversion, as if it was in the book.
    Primal/Paleo is based on the fact that not all calories are equal and to dispute that, on this forum, is just disrespectful.
    It can be frustrating. Lots of the more experienced posters have recommended newbies stay away from the debates and stick to the Primal 101 information from the top of the page until they get their feet under them, so to speak. Good advice considering all the issues mentioned above.

  10. #10
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    Quote Originally Posted by Greg Rx View Post
    The problem is, someone ask for advise and two or three posters, all supporting the same misinformation,take over the conversion, as if it was in the book.
    Primal/Paleo is based on the fact that not all calories are equal and to dispute that, on this forum, is just disrespectful.
    Disrespectful to who? I don't agree with the people that I believe you are referencing, but I still think they're entitled to post whenever and wherever they want in the forums without restriction, in accordance to the forum rules. If folks see something that they disagree with, they can feel free to chime in on what they believe is correct. When someone gets angry, that's when we get yet another thread of people battling back and forth and it's really such a huge waste of energy. If the people here who are not Primal or think it's a bad idea haven't gotten that by now AND are sticking around, the wars will not make a difference in their views.
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