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  1. #71
    Iron Will's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by RichMahogany View Post
    Thanks for pointing that out. I was talking about explosive power for a CNS standpoint more than necessarily the hips, although a heavy power clean or snatch will definitely carry over and help the deadlift go up. Out of your list, only the kettlebell swing is really explosive, and only if you do it explosively, don't you agree?
    I guess that again really depends on the trainer. I practice and train my clients explosive movement in the pull through and the hip bridge as well because of the percentages of fast twitch muscle fiber in the hamstrings as well as trying to increase the amount of fast twitch activation in the glutes.

    A good example of this was another trainer was doing pull throughs with the prowler (not sure why) he had the prowler loaded up with 200 pounds or whatever it was on there and told me that I should try using it because I would be able to get better range of motion. He proceeded to tell me I was doing my pull throughs wrong and that I'd get stronger doing it his way. By the way he was having trouble with the weight because he had been training to activate slowly. I walked over and snapped the prowler forward with no problem. He didn't really have much to say after that. It was because I've been training for speed and explosive power vs well, what ever he was training for.

  2. #72
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    Quote Originally Posted by toscamulder View Post
    I thought triple extension was a really debatable technique. Some lifters may perform better executing the snatch one way, some will the other way. Body composition plays an important role ofcourse. The sport of weightlifting seems to have changed a lot the past couple decades.
    Yeah, a little googling reveals that this is apparently controversial. I haven't found a biomechanical analysis arguing against it (just "it feels hard to turn around and get under the bar"), and as I said, I don't perform the full versions of either olympic lift, so I am really not entitled to an opinion. But to me, it seems like getting the bar moving upwards as fast and high as possible is the key to successfully completing the olympic lifts as well as their derivatives.

  3. #73
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    Quote Originally Posted by Iron Will View Post
    I guess that again really depends on the trainer. I practice and train my clients explosive movement in the pull through and the hip bridge as well because of the percentages of fast twitch muscle fiber in the hamstrings as well as trying to increase the amount of fast twitch activation in the glutes.
    Interesting stuff. My power cleans suck, so I have been considering incorporating some speed (dynamic) deadilfts in their place. The right solution is to get better at the power cleans, but these are another couple of interesting options.

    Quote Originally Posted by Iron Will View Post
    A good example of this was another trainer was doing pull throughs with the prowler (not sure why) he had the prowler loaded up with 200 pounds or whatever it was on there and told me that I should try using it because I would be able to get better range of motion. He proceeded to tell me I was doing my pull throughs wrong and that I'd get stronger doing it his way. By the way he was having trouble with the weight because he had been training to activate slowly. I walked over and snapped the prowler forward with no problem. He didn't really have much to say after that. It was because I've been training for speed and explosive power vs well, what ever he was training for.
    Yeah, we're definitely in agreement that developing power is useful to max effort strength.

  4. #74
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    Yeah the problem seems to be that every inch y go up, energy is lost which could have been used for bringing the bar up. And if you go up, it takes more time to get down ofcourse. Sounds legit, but I can't manage not to jump. Yet.
    Last edited by toscamulder; 10-02-2013 at 02:54 PM.

  5. #75
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    Quote Originally Posted by toscamulder View Post
    Yeah the problem seems to be that every inch y go up, energy is lost which could have been used for bringing the bar down. And if you go up, it takes more time to get down ofcourse. Sounds legit, but I can't manage not to jump. Yet.
    I'm guessing this is a typo. Gravity brings the bar down. It's a race for you to get under the bar before gravity can get to it. So whatever allows you to pull it highest, a/k/a jumping makes the most sense to me. Of course, the heavier the weight, the less high it will go. But what allows you to pull the most weight high enough to get under it will be the same thing that lets you pull a given weight the highest. So I vote for that. But other people are content to pull it lower because they feel it puts them in a position to get under the bar more quickly. So we have to look at the physics. The biomechanics behind the different models. And probably we'll never all agree. Damn complex multi-levered systems and all that junk.

  6. #76
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    Haha typo indeed. Up.

  7. #77
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    Quote Originally Posted by RichMahogany View Post
    Powerlifting Coach Mark Rippetoe's Weightlifting Coaching Credentials:

    Quote Originally Posted by startingstrength.com
    Rip obtained his USWF Level III certification in 1988 at the USOCs Olympic Training Center in Colorado Springs with Mike Stone, Harvey Newton, and Angel Spassov on faculty. His USAW Senior Coach certification was achieved in 1999 at the OTC with Lyn Jones, John Thrush, and Mike Conroy. He was invited, as an Olympic weightlifting coach, to the Olympic Solidarity course at the OTC in 2000. He taught both the USAW Club Coach course and the Sports Performance Coach course with Dr. Kilgore from 1999 through 2005. Rip served as the president of the North Texas Local Weightlifting Committee of USAW from 2004-2011. He coached and participated in the coaching of James Moser, Glenn Pendlay, Dr. Kilgore, Josh Wells (Junior World Team 2004) most of the national and international-level athletes on the Wichita Falls Weightlifting team, which was hosted and coached at WFAC from 1999 through 2006, as well as the collegiate weightlifting team from Midwestern State University through 2010. Rip still actively coaches the sport on a daily basis at WFAC, and the power clean and power snatch at our seminars around the country every month.
    but you probably know better...
    List of world class athletes trained by Mark Rippetoe:
    • ...
    • ...
    • ...
    • ...


    Mark Rippetoe hasn't produced any top level powerlifters, much less a top level weightlifter. He's good at selling books, and he teaches novices the importance of progression. And that's about it.

    In fact, Mark Bell barely knew who Rippetoe was when he was asked about his training methods in a video interview. You'd think that the owner of The Power Magazine (and one of the best powerlifters to have ever walked this earth) would know everything about this amazing powerlifting guru.

    Hmm, I wonder what the Chinese and Russian weightlifting coaches think of his training methods and weightlifting certificates

  8. #78
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    CrossFit match BeNeLux sunday: Lowlands Throwdown.
    https://www.youtube.com/watch?featur...&v=s9KEWS7a0BI

  9. #79
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    Quote Originally Posted by Kharnath View Post
    List of world class athletes trained by Mark Rippetoe:
    • ...
    • ...
    • ...
    • ...


    Mark Rippetoe hasn't produced any top level powerlifters, much less a top level weightlifter. He's good at selling books, and he teaches novices the importance of progression. And that's about it.

    In fact, Mark Bell barely knew who Rippetoe was when he was asked about his training methods in a video interview. You'd think that the owner of The Power Magazine (and one of the best powerlifters to have ever walked this earth) would know everything about this amazing powerlifting guru.

    Hmm, I wonder what the Chinese and Russian weightlifting coaches think of his training methods and weightlifting certificates
    I'm sorry, the list of world class athletes trained by Kharnath isn't showing up on my screen. Is it because of my company's firewall? Or did you forget to include it?

    The Chinese and Russians who squat and deadlift and out-weightlift us in every Olympics for the past 4 decades because they're stronger than us? I bet they wish Rip would stop trying to convince the USAW team to get stronger. I'm not sure what your point is there.

  10. #80
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    Quote Originally Posted by Kharnath View Post
    384 lbs deadlift @ 114 lbs bodyweight = 172 Wilk's score = advanced lifter
    610 lbs deadlift @ 319 lbs bodyweight = 154 Wilk's score = elite lifter

    Something doesn't add up. The "elite" heavyweight lifter would have to lift 680ish pounds to beat the "advanced" lightweight lifter in a deadlift competition.

    And now back to your very interesting discussion about power cleans and how powerlifting coach Mark Rippetoe teaches it...
    I've posted this quote on here before, but it seems appropriate again. Here's Rippetoe's take on those "strength standards."

    "We did them in 2006. Me and Lon pulled them out of our asses, okay? He pulled some out of my ass, I pulled some out of his ass. They are meaningless bullshit. If you are even semi-conscious you will IGNORE THEM COMPLETELY." - Mark Rippetoe
    In matters of style, swim with the current. In matters of principle, stand like a rock.

    This message has been intercepted by the NSA, the only branch of government that listens.

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