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Thread: Thoughtd on this article about Sugar page 25

  1. #241
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    Quote Originally Posted by JoanieL View Post
    So, in my mind, people blame Primal, when they should be blaming themselves for not really trying Primal, but following a bunch of opinions on a forum. Who knows, Peat, Atkins, whatever, might be the same way. [snip]

    Eat lots of plants, animals, and bugs. Move, lift, get sun, play, think, avoid poison, etc. That doesn't sound a prescription for an unhealthy life.
    This is my read as well. I liked primal precisely because it did NOT seem terribly restrictive and it allowed for a lot of variety and individual interpretation. Marks blog is the same way. So I've never gotten the people who blame mark for being fruit because since when has fruit been against the rules?

    @leida. I don't believe their is a one true way because we are all different, some do better with more fruit less fat, some do better with the opposite. Some of it is seasonal. Berries and light things in summer when it's hot and heavy meaty stuff in winter. Etc

  2. #242
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    Quote Originally Posted by Leida View Post
    yes, which shows that a fear of food is counterproductive, including the fear of sugar. Normal relationship with food is a non-antagonizing and instinctive relationship. Yes?
    I don't eat sugar because I have no use for it in my kitchen but I don't fear it. The only food I fear is gluten as I have celiac and I care about my health. I would have included man made trans fat but I don't eat processed crap so it doesn't enter my home and I don't do restaurant food.

    And I ate a good amount of CHOs with my wild sockeye salad stuffed red pepper this morning. Namely leftover roasted sweet potato and a med to large size Granny Smith sliced and topped with cinnamon. Plus a green tea.

    That offered me far more micronutrients than any amount of sugar could have.

  3. #243
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    Quote Originally Posted by dilberryhoundog View Post
    As one of the resident fence sitters (I'm not in either carb camp) of MDA welcome aboard angel and cookie. I hope you guys stick around. I probably won't agree with all that you's say but who gives a shit right?

    It's pleasing to see some of the high carb stalwarts copping a bit of what they dish out and don't they squirm when they do.

    As a fence sitter I often engage peeps of both camps in friendly banter and questioning. From the low carb camp I usually get "thankyou's" and "worth considering". From the high carb camp I usually get "LC carb troll, eff off" even tho I eat more carbs than most of them half the time.


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  4. #244
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    And I ate a good amount of CHOs with my wild sockeye salad stuffed red pepper this morning. Namely leftover roasted sweet potato and a med to large size Granny Smith sliced and topped with cinnamon. Plus a green tea.

    That offered me far more micronutrients than any amount of sugar could have.
    But you have eaten sugar. Apples and sweet potatoes both have it.

    This is my read as well. I liked primal precisely because it did NOT seem terribly restrictive and it allowed for a lot of variety and individual interpretation. Marks blog is the same way. So I've never gotten the people who blame mark for being fruit because since when has fruit been against the rules?
    Since Mark stated that one should only eat fruit very rarely, in very small quantities and preferably berries. If you look into his posts, it's all there. Look at his food pyramid published on September 16th. Fruit are restricted to moderation foods, as 'local, organically grown berries or pitted fruit'. That's hardly a piece of fruit with every meal, and local restriction basically leaves someone like me with absolutely nothing but berries in the summer and what few apples I can pick off my very young tree. No watermelons in the summer, no grapefruits or oranges, no cherries... etc. What not to eat outright forbids grains and legumes. The note on the bottom also prohibit all commercial dairy save for cream and butter.
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  5. #245
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    Quote Originally Posted by Leida View Post
    But you have eaten sugar. Apples and sweet potatoes both have it.



    Since Mark stated that one should only eat fruit very rarely, in very small quantities and preferably berries. If you look into his posts, it's all there. Look at his food pyramid published on September 16th. Fruit are restricted to moderation foods, as 'local, organically grown berries or pitted fruit'. What not to eat outright forbids grains and legumes. The note on the bottom also prohibit all commercial dairy save for cream and butter.
    Yes I've eaten naturally occurring sugar found in my whole foods this morning.

    When I said I don't eat sugar I guess it wasn't clear. I should have said I don't eat sugar found in bulk bins, packages or bags etc.

    Sorry to have confused you.

  6. #246
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    Quote Originally Posted by Leida View Post
    But you have eaten sugar. Apples and sweet potatoes both have it.



    Since Mark stated that one should only eat fruit very rarely, in very small quantities and preferably berries. If you look into his posts, it's all there. Look at his food pyramid published on September 16th. Fruit are restricted to moderation foods, as 'local, organically grown berries or pitted fruit'. That's hardly a piece of fruit with every meal, and local restriction basically leaves someone like me with absolutely nothing but berries in the summer and what few apples I can pick off my very young tree. No watermelons in the summer, no grapefruits or oranges, no cherries... etc. What not to eat outright forbids grains and legumes. The note on the bottom also prohibit all commercial dairy save for cream and butter.
    Mark also said that if you do a decent amount of exercise you should eat more carbs (ie from fruits and veggies) then he goes and recommends every body do a decent amount of exercise. Did he just imply that we should all eat spuds and apples?


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  7. #247
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    Quote Originally Posted by Leida View Post
    Well, do you see a single fruit in his menu? There is the mention of 'occasional' blueberries after supper. And in his descriptions, he often refers to eating a 'handful' of berries (~ 1/2 to 1 cup depending on your palm size) and not every day. Any of his posts on fruit will warn you against eating fruit. The carb curb postulates that 50-100 g carbs to lose weight, with one fruit being ~30 g carbs.... it takes 3 to take you into the gaining zone if you also eat any veggies or liver.... There is also not a single starch in his menu.... (Though, interestingly, there is sugar)

    If I try Mark's menu you posted, I will be hungry and miserably sick, a 'zone of misery' and need to rise fat from 50-60% higher, to 70%+ to break past the carb flu....



    Oh, yes, that's what I thought it was about, till it runs against the carb curve and a far too long list of poisons, many of which are actually foods that make me well.
    I didn't mean to imply that everyone would be happy at exactly those macros. But as a guide, it doesn't suck. Personally, I'd rather have a piece of fruit than his glass of wine in that sample. (The tomato in his salad is fruit.) The carb curve should have been written as a percentage of total calories rather than in grams, imo. Because someone who eats 3000 calories to maintain can certainly handle more carbs in grams than someone who eats 1500. But even that should be a guide.

    I think the point is that most (not all) carbs when compared with animal products are pretty flimsy in nutrition. So, if you get 75% of your calories from carbs, and you're not overweight, you're probably cheating yourself out of valuable nutrients. Pure fat isn't the answer either as far as nutrients. Hence the blueprint model rather than: you must eat two from column A and three from columns B and C.

    And if legumes and wheat make you feel good and avoiding them doesn't, then you should eat them. I picked Primal over Paleo, not even about the fat issue, but because I don't necessarily agree that dairy is bad. That doesn't mean I think Paleo is bad. It's just not something I could do forever.
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  8. #248
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    Quote Originally Posted by dilberryhoundog View Post
    Mark also said that if you do a decent amount of exercise you should eat more carbs (ie from fruits and veggies) then he goes and recommends every body do a decent amount of exercise. Did he just imply that we should all eat spuds and apples?
    I think activity increases CHO tolerance. I get a great deal of regular activity with jogging, sprints, walking, hiking, stairwell workouts, strength train etc.

  9. #249
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    Quote Originally Posted by JoanieL View Post
    Personally, I'd rather have a piece of fruit than his glass of wine in that sample. (The tomato in his salad is fruit.)
    Me too.

  10. #250
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    Very good. So, you enjoy sugar in fruit and tubers, and in moderation, however, you are inclined to banish folks who add a teaspoon of sugar to their water, because it was stripped of other nutrients. I see the use of refined sugar by the Peats folks as a supplement rather than indulgence. I know that there is experimental evidence that small amount of sugar in water prohibits appetite because it is devoid of nutrients and discernible flavor. There are people who add pure oils in their supplementation. I feel that these small deviations are well within the personal mechanisms and do not warrant negativity and antagonism.
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