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  1. #31
    Mr.Perfidy's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Cryptocode View Post
    Mr.Perfidy,

    Do you really think it's even theoretically possible to peddle backwards in history, in this case the history of land titles, find out or determine somehow who should have owned that piece of land each time it changed ownership, and finally, back to 1776 correct the ownership title. How would you do that? If you could back peddle that far, how would you decide who should own it. And if you theoretically could, it would take a Gov't agency so large it would eat up a great lot of money.

    Some countries, such as Mexico, have tried to achieve equality by breaking up all the large tracts of land (farms and ranches) into small family farms and giving them to the people who actually did the work of farming. How well do you think that worked out?
    it's more like that people should assume ownership of the areas where they live, and workers should assume ownership of places where they work. Cut out the capital-eating owner class completely.
    "Ah, those endless forests, and their horror-haunted gloom! For what eternities have I wandered through them, a timid, hunted creature, starting at the least sound, frightened of my own shadow, keyed-up, ever alert and vigilant, ready on the instant to dash away in mad flight for my life. For I was the prey of all manner of fierce life that dwelt in the forest, and it was in ecstasies of fear that I fled before the hunting monsters."

    Jack london, "Before Adam"

  2. #32
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    So you believe in communal ownership. By any name Communism, as defined by either Marx or Lenin. However both Marx and Lenin have been proven wrong, both in theory and in practice. In other words, it doesn't work. It won't work.

    OK, suppose a community, any size you want, with no capital. How now do they get or build this business or place of work?
    "When the search for truth is confused with political advocacy, the pursuit of knowledge is reduced to the quest for power." - Alston Chase

  3. #33
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    Quote Originally Posted by Cryptocode View Post
    So you believe in communal ownership. By any name Communism, as defined by either Marx or Lenin. However both Marx and Lenin have been proven wrong, both in theory and in practice. In other words, it doesn't work. It won't work.

    OK, suppose a community, any size you want, with no capital. How now do they get or build this business or place of work?
    Communism works beautifully... in small communes, or in other words, tribes.

  4. #34
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    Quote Originally Posted by wiltondeportes View Post
    Communism works beautifully... in small communes, or in other words, tribes.
    I agree, in places where the tribal traditions are strong and serve to also prevent change or innovation. If they are agricultural they can build up enough capital (food) to carry them through the winter, and they have already build up the fixed assets (capital as storage bins or areas) to preserve it through that period of time.

    I suppose a lot of tribes exist (or existed) in areas where there was little change of season temperatures, but changes in rain and dry spells.

    It also worked well in the swiss alpine valley community that Weston Price visited. There was considerable division of labor, strong maintained traditions, and very cold winters requiring communal capital (food). Were they really tribal there? Maybe not tribal, but probably related to each other in many ways. And they were very separated from outsiders.
    "When the search for truth is confused with political advocacy, the pursuit of knowledge is reduced to the quest for power." - Alston Chase

  5. #35
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    Quote Originally Posted by Cryptocode View Post
    I agree, in places where the tribal traditions are strong and serve to also prevent change or innovation. If they are agricultural they can build up enough capital (food) to carry them through the winter, and they have already build up the fixed assets (capital as storage bins or areas) to preserve it through that period of time.

    I suppose a lot of tribes exist (or existed) in areas where there was little change of season temperatures, but changes in rain and dry spells.

    It also worked well in the swiss alpine valley community that Weston Price visited. There was considerable division of labor, strong maintained traditions, and very cold winters requiring communal capital (food). Were they really tribal there? Maybe not tribal, but probably related to each other in many ways. And they were very separated from outsiders.
    Right. I would consider those close knit societies to be pretty tribal.

    More detailed rules/laws and direct rule/law-making are best for small groups and communities. More indirect laws and indirect law-making is what's best for the largest government shell, the federal level or world level. Due to the indirectness, there must be a minimalist attitude wherever possible *but* not anywhere impossible. You need checks and balances to make the small-to-big relationship work, and you need them to make highest government shell (federal or world) somewhat decentralized to prevent monopoly within it.

    That's my idealist perspective on the situation. The parts where minimalism is impossible and elected officials coerce or just act stupidly are the uglier parts. I take the bad with the good philosophically, and when I have some solutions to do more good or less bad, I'll let you know.

    By definition, not by modern vernacular, I would be a republican federally and a democrat locally. Most people are, but they don't realize it. It's ironic because many Republicans now-a-days most strongly and proudly support fundamentally democratic things, and many Democrats most strongly and proudly support republican things.
    Last edited by wiltondeportes; 09-18-2013 at 11:40 PM.

  6. #36
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    Quote Originally Posted by Cryptocode View Post
    Is a 'bomb' good or bad? Why so?
    In a good way.... The education that you can get from reading the articles they write, seminars they host, classes thay teach are vastly different than what you get from "mainstream" economists. I have a strong libertarian streak, and I find their approach to economics refreshing.

  7. #37
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    Quote Originally Posted by ssn679doc View Post
    In a good way.... The education that you can get from reading the articles they write, seminars they host, classes thay teach are vastly different than what you get from "mainstream" economists. I have a strong libertarian streak, and I find their approach to economics refreshing.
    Anyone who has all of the answers, has none of the answers.

  8. #38
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    Quote Originally Posted by wiltondeportes View Post
    Anyone who has all of the answers, has none of the answers.
    Thanks for that vapid response.......

  9. #39
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    Quote Originally Posted by ssn679doc View Post
    Thanks for that vapid response.......
    As if saying "let's just not be aggressive with each other" or "let's just not have a government at all" weren't vapid in my other thread? I don't recall if you were in that or not... just responding to the board in general.

    It's also a pretty good rule of thumb. I've never found any source, which claims to up-end all of the establishment's thinking, to be very valid. Those kinds of people/websites have often good intentions but bad logic. Very rarely, you'll find websites that correctly up-end some of the mainstream ideas, but then you eventually find out that their best ideas are actually pretty mainstream also. Perfect example: MarksDailyApple.

    PS- I could even go for "let's be less aggressive" for some things and "let's have less government" for some things. Keyword: "some things". But the libertarians and anarchists here are such idealists that they have no ideas. Ironic considering the word origin...
    Last edited by wiltondeportes; 09-19-2013 at 12:46 AM.

  10. #40
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    Quote Originally Posted by wiltondeportes View Post
    As if saying "let's just not be aggressive with each other" or "let's just not have a government at all" weren't vapid in my other thread? I don't recall if you were in that or not... just responding to the board in general.

    It's also a pretty good rule of thumb. I've never found any source, which claims to up-end all of the establishment's thinking, to be very valid. Those kinds of people/websites have often good intentions but bad logic. Very rarely, you'll find websites that correctly up-end some of the mainstream ideas, but then you eventually find out that their best ideas are actually pretty mainstream also. Perfect example: MarksDailyApple.

    PS- I could even go for "let's be less aggressive" for some things and "let's have less government" for some things. Keyword: "some things". But the libertarians and anarchists here are such idealists that they have no ideas. Ironic considering the word origin...
    I wonder, after reading this, if you have ever read anything of substance by any of the Austrian School economists, in particular von Mises or Murray Rothbard. If you haven't read their writing, how can you claim they have no ideas?

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