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Thread: Tea/Caffeine issues- cycling caffeine. Help needed. page 2

  1. #11
    mikekola's Avatar
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    Guys,

    Thanks for all the suggestions... Well, just as I thought, there's no miracle advice on caffeine and I'll probably need to find my way, eventually. Also glad to know some other people have similar issues and I'm not crazy (probably, you never know ).

    I hate the way Yerba Mate tastes so it's not every day option for me, although I tolerate its "body effects" well. Cetrainly better than coffee.

    Other question that I may have is for former caffeine users who successfully and completely managed to quit. How precisely did you experience overall mood/energy improvement after quitting and when? What I mean is... after, say, 7 days off caffeine, can I expect further improvements after much later, like 20-60 days?
    It's just that my motivation is totally down by day 7... seeking some more motivation to stick to caffeine-free phase at least for a couple of months to have better observations.

    Extra stuff, for health-obsessed freaks: did anyone try to measure their blood sugars prior/after coffee/tea? I came across one thread on diabetic forum saying that drinking coffee elevated FBG. I also have a theory that my unusual feeling after consuming tea (which can be described as mild drowsiness) comes from BS moving not the way it should... I don't have any BS issues officially recognized by medicine, though.
    Medical research seems to be quite confusing about it as well- there is a number of studies suggesting both improved insulin sensitivity and reduced, both hypoglycemic and hyperglycemic caffeine action... not to mention population studies, each showing something different.

    Finally- bottom line question and something I really don't have idea on... What would Grok do? And would Grok really be able to brew tea-leaves ( tea was first brewed/discovered by coincidence), or, better yet, roast and ground the coffee beans?

    Michal

  2. #12
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    Other question that I may have is for former caffeine users who successfully and completely managed to quit. How precisely did you experience overall mood/energy improvement after quitting and when? What I mean is... after, say, 7 days off caffeine, can I expect further improvements after much later, like 20-60 days?
    It's been about three weeks for me, and I experienced mood/energy improvement after a week. I've had crazy energy the past two weeks--I bounce out of bed and I never hit the mid-morning and mid-afternoon slumps I used to have.

    What would Grok do? And would Grok really be able to brew tea-leaves ( tea was first brewed/discovered by coincidence), or, better yet, roast and ground the coffee beans?
    I don't think it would have taken Grok all that long to figure out that if he stuck those certain beans in the fire for a little while and then crunched on them, he had more energy. I doubt Grok would have ground/brewed coffee, but chewing on coffee beans or tea leaves (like how we chew on those chocolate-covered espresso beans) is something I can totally see him figuring out. Same as chewing on willow bark to relieve a headache.

  3. #13
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    Quote Originally Posted by mikekola View Post
    Finally- bottom line question and something I really don't have idea on... What would Grok do? And would Grok really be able to brew tea-leaves ( tea was first brewed/discovered by coincidence), or, better yet, roast and ground the coffee beans?

    Michal
    There's evidence that ancient ancestors of the Chinese were, over 20,000 years ago (before agriculture, therefore), taking the leaves of the tea tree and eating them straight as leafy green vegetables. This was a distinct advantage to them because especially those who were on night watch (to protect the tribe from dangerous predators etc.) could not only stay awake to do so, but had better reaction times when dealing with anything that threatened the sleeping members of the tribe.

    Of course, they didn't know it was caffeine in the leaf that was doing this to them, but they ate the leaf anyway because they liked the effects.

  4. #14
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    Quote Originally Posted by heatseeker View Post
    Since I discovered my histamine intolerance and cut coffee completely, I also discovered just what a profound effect the caffeine was having on me. Before I cut it, I had been a 3-4-cups-per-day drinker for like ten straight years. The first few days coming off of it were hard, but now that I'm off, I have SO MUCH more energy, I never get slumps, and I'm sure my sleep is about a billion times better. So, I'm a big believer in caffeine taking a heavy toll on your body. I think some people can have it every day without problems, but not me. I'm like an alcoholic; I can't just have a cup of coffee, I have to have five cups. Now I do one decaf Americano a week as a treat and leave it at that.

    I was never a big fan of tea, but I've gotten pretty into the concept of herbal tea because I needed hot beverage at my desk at work. I like energizing spice and herb blends, like ginger, licorice, clove, mint, etc. And I drink a lot of nettle tea, again because of the histamine thing, but it also seems to energize me quite a bit.
    When I first started a paleo style diet years ago I ditched caffeine completely. The first two weeks were miserable. My mood was lousy, I was lethargic and the headaches were almost unbearable. I slept a lot and was very unproductive with work. After about a month or so I noticed my energy levels get more stable and after even more time my energy was great. After over a year completely abstaining from caffeine I reintroduced decaf coffee (Swiss water technique) and herbal teas. They just didn't do it for me. I eventually went back to having 1 cup of coffee per day. The 1 cup per day sometimes turned into 2 cups and you all know the rest of the story. Now I try to quit coffee/tea for weeks at a time but always revert back to it. I can truly say its a drug and it is something that is hard for me to kick.

    The main reasons I love coffee is :
    1 - It's delicious!
    2 - Gives me a huge energy and mental boost
    3 - It's a good way to socialize with friends and family

    The reasons I want to stop drinking coffee:
    1 - It destroys my digestion.
    2 - Sometimes I will end up with GERD
    3 - Stains my teeth and can also give bad breath
    4 - It makes me feel like a crack head and I crave it more and more

    I don't get the same negatives with tea. Tea actually works better with my digestion. Breath is better with tea and I don't feel like I have to have tea like I do with coffee. I still get GERD with tea though. Coffee just tastes way better to me than tea. In summary, I love coffee, I continue to drink it because the pleasure and energy high outweighs the negatives even though those negatives are pretty bad for me. I will probably continue to cycle it on and off unfortunately. After reading what I just wrote it really does seem like I am a drug addict and my drug of choice is coffee
    "If man made it, don't eat it" - Jack Lallane

    People say I am on a "crazy" diet. What is so crazy about eating veggies, fruits, seafood and organ meats? Just because I don't eat whole wheat and processed food doesn't make my diet "crazy". Maybe everyone else with a SAD are the "crazy" ones for putting that junk in their system.

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    I like to take breaks from drinking coffee -- anywhere from two weeks to two months at a time. I just recently went a month without drinking it, and started to drink it again a few weeks ago. Try going at least two weeks without -- trust me, at that point, it becomes MUCH easier to go a month without, and then progress from there.

    As far as getting the energy/feeling that caffeine provides, there are a few other things you can try:

    -An intense 20 - 30 minute strength workout. You should be out of breath and sweating heavily. If you do it right, the high you get afterwards can be on par with a cup of coffee.

    -Intermittent fasting. Try having one big meal at the end of the day. It might be difficult the first few hours, but after a certain point, it can give you heaps of energy. A glass of raw green juice or lemon water would be fine, just keep it less than or around 100 calories.

    -Maca. If your hormonal levels are unbalanced, maca can help with this, and thus give you a sensation of more energy. Gelatinized maca is best. This may or may not work for you.

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    I am coffee addict myself and I am wondering if I am doing more harm then good for myself by consuming supermarket coffee.

    Would like to get opinions as well is there some mental benefits quiting coffee.

    As far as energy that caffeine provides there is other tip: try cold showers or just cold plunges in pool, lake or ocean. It feels pretty much same and has maybe even stronger effect. Not for very long though

  7. #17
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    Quote Originally Posted by Balance View Post
    In summary, I love coffee, I continue to drink it because the pleasure and energy high outweighs the negatives even though those negatives are pretty bad for me. I will probably continue to cycle it on and off unfortunately. After reading what I just wrote it really does seem like I am a drug addict and my drug of choice is coffee
    Just curious- can you really feel the "energy high" you've mentioned after on-going consumption, for, let's say, a few months? Back in the time when I used to drink weak, bagged tea I didn't feel any "rush" from green tea at all. It was rather the mild withdrawal symptoms I felt when I lowered my dose- while traveling, for example.

    Now that I cycle it, I tend not to feel any real "rush" after a week or two of drinking. The feeling I'd get would rather be "back to kind of normal from totally down".

    I do realize this is yet another argument for quitting this substance (wherever it comes from, tea or coffee) altogether. Just wondering how long I can go without it... this time. Again- planning for at least 2-3 months to fully assess the effect, but who knows.

    Michal

  8. #18
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    How precisely did you experience overall mood/energy improvement after quitting and when? What I mean is... after, say, 7 days off caffeine, can I expect further improvements after much later, like 20-60 days?
    It's just that my motivation is totally down by day 7... seeking some more motivation to stick to caffeine-free phase at least for a couple of months to have better observations.
    This is my first time giving up the tea. I never even drunk coffee till my 30'ies, but always drunk a lot of tea, black, and lately just green and brewed from leaves only. Usually first 7-10 days after I drop coffee are bad, then everything stabilizes and I feel well, sleep better. There are no significant changes later on, but I always drunk tea, even if only green tea. I usually restarted coffee on a day I got poor sleep, then got poor sleep because I had coffee, and the vicious circle of caffeine dependency kicked in.

    This time, with dropping both coffee and tea, I noticed that my sleep phase 1 extended to 6 hours from 5 hours, so I now wake up at 3 am, rather than 2 am for the first time, and I think the sleep is more restful. I think this is because while I drink water & broth during the day, I always brewed a pot of tea after supper (the healthful way, lol).

    I still chew a bit of cocoa nibs once in a while, but they seem not to have much caffeine.

    As for blood sugar, I did not measure it, but I know that initially a cup of coffee suppresses appetite for me, and then a couple hours later it comes back very strongly, which imo is indication of a sugar spike.

    Overall, I think that changes to mood and sleep are worth giving up the coffee and tea for. I intend to stick with no coffee and tea this time, even if I had to manage a day of exhaustion and heal it in a more natural way (like, sleep!)

    Prehistoric cultures chewed or brewed caffeine or other stimulants containing herbs to manage. Hoodia for example was used for chewing, coke leaves, coffee and cocoa itself and many, many more. Our ancestors experimented a lot with leaves and greens and mushrooms....
    Last edited by Leida; 09-12-2013 at 12:32 PM.
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    Quote Originally Posted by mikekola View Post
    Just curious- can you really feel the "energy high" you've mentioned after on-going consumption, for, let's say, a few months? Back in the time when I used to drink weak, bagged tea I didn't feel any "rush" from green tea at all. It was rather the mild withdrawal symptoms I felt when I lowered my dose- while traveling, for example.

    Now that I cycle it, I tend not to feel any real "rush" after a week or two of drinking. The feeling I'd get would rather be "back to kind of normal from totally down".

    I do realize this is yet another argument for quitting this substance (wherever it comes from, tea or coffee) altogether. Just wondering how long I can go without it... this time. Again- planning for at least 2-3 months to fully assess the effect, but who knows.

    Michal
    I do feel the energy kick for sure. But I make my coffee strong with a French press. You are correct though that after a few months you build up a tolerance for the caffeine and it doesn't hit you as hard. But I know one thing for sure, when I don't have coffee during my consumption phase I am pretty lethargic until I get my fix.
    "If man made it, don't eat it" - Jack Lallane

    People say I am on a "crazy" diet. What is so crazy about eating veggies, fruits, seafood and organ meats? Just because I don't eat whole wheat and processed food doesn't make my diet "crazy". Maybe everyone else with a SAD are the "crazy" ones for putting that junk in their system.

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