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Thread: Magic Pills, Food Villains and the Avoidance of Personal Responsibility page 2

  1. #11
    canio6's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Neckhammer View Post
    Ah, now this thread is so much more bearable.....
    you should argue in more threads.

  2. #12
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    Neckhammer is online now Senior Member
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    Quote Originally Posted by canio6 View Post
    you should argue in more threads.
    Dude, you just can't look at that and be mad..... Even choco totally loves me right now

  3. #13
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    There's only one problem with this article: it's wrong.

    "The REAL primary driver of obesity and illness is human behavior."

    Actually, the majority of obesity is due to genetic factors.

    Behav Genet. 1997 Jul;27(4):325-51.
    Genetic and environmental factors in relative body weight and human adiposity.
    Maes HH, Neale MC, Eaves LJ.
    https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/9519560

    "Genetic factors explained 67% of the variance in males and females."

    (More discussion and supporting evidence here: Whole Health Source: The Genetics of Obesity, Part I )

    Also note this entertaining paper:

    Segregation of a Latent High Adiposity Phenotype in Families with a History of Type 2 Diabetes Mellitus Implicates Rare Obesity-Susceptibility Genetic Variants with Large Effects in Diabetes-Related Obesity
    Arthur B. Jenkins, Marijka Batterham, Dorit Samocha-Bonet, Katherine Tonks, Jerry R. Greenfield, Lesley V. Campbell
    PLOS ONE: Segregation of a Latent High Adiposity Phenotype in Families with a History of Type 2 Diabetes Mellitus Implicates Rare Obesity-Susceptibility Genetic Variants with Large Effects in Diabetes-Related Obesity

    "We recently reported significantly greater weight gain in non-diabetic healthy subjects with a 1st degree family history (FH+) of type 2 diabetes mellitus (T2DM) than in a matched control group without such history (FH−) during voluntary overfeeding, implying co-inheritance of susceptibilities to T2DM and obesity."
    ...
    "The segregation of Adiposity in T2DM-affected families is consistent with dominant expression of rare risk variants with major effects, which are expressed in over half of FH+ and which can account for most T2DM-associated obesity in our population."

    This does not mean that people bear no responsibility for their decisions! What it does mean is that the same decisions will lead to wildly varying results...

    ...and that while a small amount of willpower may be all YOU require to keep yourself healthy, others may have to do much more in order to achieve far less. They might even have to do things you've never had to consider, like dramatically restricting the type and composition of the foods they eat.

    In summary: Congratulations, ChocoTaco. You've successfully chosen a set of parents that allows you to remain slim with little effort. However, you might want to be cautious about giving advice to those with less foresight.

    JS

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    Quote Originally Posted by Neckhammer View Post

    "The REAL primary driver of obesity and illness is human BELIEFS.... as beliefs dictate behavior.... and behavior dictates results"
    I like this version too

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    Quote Originally Posted by Neckhammer View Post








    Ah, now this thread is so much more bearable.....
    Neckhammer for the win!

  6. #16
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    Quote Originally Posted by magnolia1973 View Post
    And I hate the focus on "weight loss". Muscle gain is awesome.
    +1

    Quote Originally Posted by J. Stanton View Post
    There's only one problem with this article: it's wrong.

    "The REAL primary driver of obesity and illness is human behavior."

    Actually, the majority of obesity is due to genetic factors.
    Solid post, JS. But I don't think it will be well received:
    Quote Originally Posted by ChocoTaco369 View Post
    let's get one thing clear: I don't ask questions on MDA. That's not why I come here. I come here to answer questions people have. Whether or not you listen to me is of no consequence to me. You have absolutely nothing to offer me. If you don't want my advice, don't take it.
    Last edited by magicmerl; 08-25-2013 at 08:39 PM.
    Disclaimer: I eat 'meat and vegetables' ala Primal, although I don't agree with the carb curve. I like Perfect Health Diet and WAPF Lactofermentation a lot.

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    5,000 Cal Fat <> 5,000 Cal Carbs
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    Quote Originally Posted by J. Stanton View Post

    This does not mean that people bear no responsibility for their decisions! What it does mean is that the same decisions will lead to wildly varying results...

    ...and that while a small amount of willpower may be all YOU require to keep yourself healthy, others may have to do much more in order to achieve far less. They might even have to do things you've never had to consider, like dramatically restricting the type and composition of the foods they eat.S
    Yeah. no shit.

    Some people have to work harder to achieve the results that come naturally to others. Just because are more predisposed to becoming overweight easily doesn't mean "genetic factors' are the reason behind why they are fat.
    I don't know why you're just assuming he remains slim with little effort, I've seen him gain weight eating "primal". I'm sure he could become obese if he ate and drank whatever he felt like and didn't exercise.

  8. #18
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    Quote Originally Posted by J. Stanton View Post
    In summary: Congratulations, ChocoTaco. You've successfully chosen a set of parents that allows you to remain slim with little effort. However, you might want to be cautious about giving advice to those with less foresight.
    Actually, genetically, I'm predisposed to fat gain and very little muscle. I have awful genetics. I'm short, stocky, have lanky arms, no shoulders and stubs for legs. I wouldn't want to curse anyone with my genetics. I bet I work a lot harder than you to stay slim. Most people are against hard work. Because it's hard.

    The "gene" excuse. Everyone regardless of genetics has the capability to be strong and lean. Genetics have very little to do with it and are just a scapegoat. 67% of families are overweight, and overweight parents brainwash habits that create overweight children that grow up to be overweight parents. Lather, rinse, repeat.

    The problem with your entire post: it's wrong.
    Don't put your trust in anyone on this forum, including me. You are the key to your own success.

  9. #19
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    I disagree with you, Choco. Therefore, I am wrong - according to you and the local sugar-addict army. Funny how I exercise less now than I ever used to, and stuff myself silly more often than not, and that fifty pounds just isn't coming back. On very low carb with occasional refeeds at that. It's okay, you can keep your fingers in your ears and yell "la la la" as long as you need to. I understand how difficult it is to be faced with alternate data that challenge what you think you know. It's even harder for you because you think your views are "mature" and "evolved beyond" the low-carb paradigm. As if there is some kind of chart we are standing against and you are the tallest.


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  10. #20
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    Quote Originally Posted by Knifegill View Post
    I disagree with you, Choco. Therefore, I am wrong - according to you and the local sugar-addict army. Funny how I exercise less now than I ever used to, and stuff myself silly more often than not, and that fifty pounds just isn't coming back. On very low carb with occasional refeeds at that. It's okay, you can keep your fingers in your ears and yell "la la la" as long as you need to. I understand how difficult it is to be faced with alternate data that challenge what you think you know. It's even harder for you because you think your views are "mature" and "evolved beyond" the low-carb paradigm. As if there is some kind of chart we are standing against and you are the tallest.
    See, this is what I'm talking about. The passive-aggressiveness of the arguments and the outright lying is hard to stomach.

    Apparently I am part of the local "sugar-addict" army. Nevermind that I eat very little sugar, average around 175g of carbohydrate a day nearly entirely from potatoes, sweet potatoes and seasonal fruit. I'm a sugar addict because I understand CICO, don't believe in insulin fairy tales and advise against exclusionary dieting. Lying about what I eat to make a point is a fallacy, not an argument.

    The 50 lbs don't come back because you eat a lot less calories today than you did before when you were much more overweight. There is no science behind low carbohydrate dieting showing it is magic. Only that it reduces food reward and spontaneous calorie reduction. You reduced the CI- part of the equation. That's all it is.

    And for the record, I'd rather be a sugar addict than a fat addict. It's far less fattening
    Don't put your trust in anyone on this forum, including me. You are the key to your own success.

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