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Thread: Eating + Lifting to get Leaner and Stronger - Is it even possible? page 7

  1. #61
    Zach's Avatar
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    Max is doing it right. The ONLY way to gain strength and size while losing fat is to keep carbs in your diet.

  2. #62
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    Quote Originally Posted by oxide View Post
    Let me understand this. You threw out the 150 gram carb curve, and the fat came back, and your reasoning for this is that "your body doesn't want to be the lower weight." ? Oh brother, that's like those ladies who are 35 pounds overweight and proudly say "I'm a REAL woman, not a stick." The anthem of the SAD dieter.

    Yo, you didn't gain fat because you're somehow pre-ordained for it. The fat came back because you basically went back on SAD diet. Sure, it was "whole and unprocessed" SAD, but it was carby rice and potato SAD nonetheless. I guess you can lose the fat first and work on strength later. Or you can work on strength and lose the fat later. Or you can do both simultaneously, but it will be a lot slower.
    The carbs the OP added back isn't equal to a SAD diet. There is a huge difference between the two. Many very successful athletes and weight lifters use carbs. As a matter of fact it would be hard to have consistent success without enough carbs. I know from my personal N=1 that relying on gluconeogenesis to fuel your workouts is terribly stressful for the body.
    "If man made it, don't eat it" - Jack Lallane

    People say I am on a "crazy" diet. What is so crazy about eating veggies, fruits, seafood and organ meats? Just because I don't eat whole wheat and processed food doesn't make my diet "crazy". Maybe everyone else with a SAD are the "crazy" ones for putting that junk in their system.

  3. #63
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    Bah, more carb wars, but I may as well point it out. Read the steak and eggs thread. Plenty of guys reported increased lean mass in conjunction with losing fat. Now, the steak and eggs diet did include a carb refeed once a week. Thats about how I do things myself. My N=1 is I continue to get stronger while remaining approximately the same weight for the past 18 months. Really there is only two ways this happens. One is neuromuscular and the other is replacing fat with muscle (a third may be technique, but I don't do technical lifts). Being that we are talking an extended period of time neuromuscular gains are well in my past. I don't do all the standard lifts, but at 160lbs I do OHP for sets of 5 with 135, dips and chins with +70lbs on me regularly (gonna give + 90 a go next time I do em I think though).
    Last edited by Neckhammer; 09-19-2013 at 06:50 PM.

  4. #64
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    Quote Originally Posted by Neckhammer View Post
    Bah, more carb wars, but I may as well point it out. Read the steak and eggs thread. Plenty of guys reported increased lean mass in conjunction with losing fat. Now, the steak and eggs diet did include a carb refeed once a week. Thats about how I do things myself. My N=1 is I continue to get stronger while remaining approximately the same weight for the past 18 months. Really there is only two ways this happens. One is neuromuscular and the other is replacing fat with muscle (a third may be technique, but I don't do technical lifts). Being that we are talking an extended period of time neuromuscular gains are well in my past. I don't do all the standard lifts, but at 160lbs I do OHP for sets of 5 with 135, dips and chins with +70lbs on me regularly (gonna give + 90 a go next time I do em I think though).
    Definitely not trying to add fuel to any carb wars I should have clarified that my personal N=1 is unique because I was never trying to lose fat or weight. When I was doing strict paleo with 150g of carbs I got way too skinny and I didn't perform well. It is probably because I have always been very active and it didn't work for me, especially with playing a ton of full court basketball. I agree with you that the protocol that is working for the people on the steak and eggs thread can work for many people, I have friends that have done similar diets and it worked really well to lose fat.
    "If man made it, don't eat it" - Jack Lallane

    People say I am on a "crazy" diet. What is so crazy about eating veggies, fruits, seafood and organ meats? Just because I don't eat whole wheat and processed food doesn't make my diet "crazy". Maybe everyone else with a SAD are the "crazy" ones for putting that junk in their system.

  5. #65
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    I'm getting sets of 2 with +90 lately. Hoping for a triple or 2 next week. Just to give you something to try and beat.

  6. #66
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    Quote Originally Posted by RichMahogany View Post
    I'm getting sets of 2 with +90 lately. Hoping for a triple or 2 next week. Just to give you something to try and beat.
    Thats why I targeted 90

    Sucks that I'm gonna have to actually take my own gear to a gym lol.... but a mans gotta do what a mans gotta do.

  7. #67
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    Quote Originally Posted by Neckhammer View Post
    Thats why I targeted 90

    Sucks that I'm gonna have to actually take my own gear to a gym lol.... but a mans gotta do what a mans gotta do.
    Glad I'm giving you some motivation. I bet you'll beat me based on the numbers you were putting up in the "What Is Your Workout" Thread. I remember the first time I squatted 2 plates I was trying to match/beat tfarny. Whatever happened to that guy? He was an awesome poster. Somebody still has a quote of his in their signature.

  8. #68
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    ^ Yeah, dunno where he has been. The secret to superior chinups is to stop all leg work. Let them shrivel to nothing so as not to inhibit your huge lats

  9. #69
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    Quote Originally Posted by Neckhammer View Post
    ^ Yeah, dunno where he has been. The secret to superior chinups is to stop all leg work. Let them shrivel to nothing so as not to inhibit your huge lats
    Well, I cheat by taking my shoes off. But the only real muscle groups are calves and biceps. And I'm definitely in the "pathetic" category on both counts.

  10. #70
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    Too many cooks in this kitchen..

    You CAN gain strength in a caloric deficit. Will an advanced or intermediate lifter be likely to gain strength? Most likely not.

    Can a complete beginner like the OP? Absolutely

    Neural recruitment and motor efficiency play a big part in strength gains, most especially for beginners. I would fully expect significant strength gains over 3 months, PROVIDED the OP starts at a proper conservative level, and utilizes a smart nutrition recovery strategy with carb loading on workout days.

    Its been said already but OP you need to pick what is more important fat loss or muscle gain. If its fat loss FOCUS on the fat loss. Get that job done. You need to think of your strength training as an accessory to fat loss, NOT the primary goal. Dont be obsessed with the numbers, think of it as ramping up your metabolism and burning your fat.

    Once you have got your BF down to an acceptable level, you can embark on a proper strength and muscle gaining strategy.

    At the end of the day just decide what you want to do and do it. Focus on your goal and everything else will fall into place.

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