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Thread: Need Type 2 Diabetes Primal Help!

  1. #1
    Join Date
    Jul 2012
    Location
    Texas
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    42

    Need Type 2 Diabetes Primal Help!

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    Hi All. I'm a newbie, & my Husband was just diagnosed w/ type 2 diabetes. I'm almost done reading The Primal Blueprint, & have run into possible advice conflict. If I understand it correctly, Mark's discussion of I.F. (intermittent fasting) seems to include diabetics. But, in Practical Paleo, Diane Sanfilippo says to avoid fasting or going longer than 4-5 hours w/out food until blood sugar is regulated (p.142). Please help on this point & Anything about starting Primal for diabetics. I know that the "Sweet Spot" is 50-100, but should we aim for lower than that, & use ketostix to be sure he is solidly in ketosis rather than @ the sweet spot's edge of ketosis? (Many years ago, my Husband went on a ketosis diet, & it was the only way he has ever been able to lose a significant amount of weight & also not be hungry). He is very motivated about going primal, & his job is so stressful/ long hours, that he is relying on me to provide the info on what to do (which I am happy to do). His #'s are all terrible, including very low HDL (~25), Small particulate HDL, & he wants to go from ~ 265 lbs. to ~ 185. He is on script niacin & a statin (so I give him 300 mg/day of ubiquinol, fish oil, & more vitamins/ supplements than most people would go along with). He loves to Mountain Bike, which doesn't happen often in our Texas Summer heat. The challenge for me is cooking primally with 2 older sons in the house who are sugarholics regardless of what I "preach" to them. (One has severe depression & is unemployed, the other has Asperger's syndrome. So, stress is high for my Husband & I even without the diabetes). I'm scared, & SO appreciate any & all help you have to offer! Thanks!!

  2. #2
    Join Date
    Apr 2013
    Location
    UK
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    783
    I'm diabetic - i went the 4 meal a day route; if i fast my blood glucose drops then i get a fast rise and stay elevated. i can do it now but that's 3 and a bit months in. use ketostix or a blood meter-blood meters are best but sticks are expensive
    When I'd had enough of the grain and starched based 'diabetic eating for health' diet (eating for health, my ass!) my weight was 242.5 lbs. On starting primal- 18th April 2013 weight : 238.1.
    27th July 2013. weight after 100 days 136.9 weight lost 101.2lb ; that's 105.6lbs since I stopped the 'diabetic eating for health'
    new journal http://www.marksdailyapple.com/forum...ml#post1264082

  3. #3
    Join Date
    Jun 2011
    Location
    Raleigh, NC
    Posts
    1,480
    Have you read Dr. Bernstein's Diabetes Solution? It is a book for diabetics that goes very well with primal.
    Dr. Bernstein's Diabetes Solution: The Complete Guide to Achieving Normal Blood Sugars: Richard K. Bernstein: 9780316182690: Amazon.com: Books


    And then a personal obsession- the high stress lifestyle is a disaster, but as a business owner and student I live it too. I go a treadmill desk. It is been very awesome awesome awesome and I highly recommend it for someone in your husband's / my situation. Here is the kind I got:
    Treadmill Desk & Standing Desks: Workout at Work with a TreadDesk
    In God we trust; all others must bring data. W. Edwards Deming
    Blogging at http://loafingcactus.com

  4. #4
    otzi's Avatar
    otzi Guest
    Mrs. Frog - I was in the exact same boat as your hubby. Here's what I recommend, and what worked for me at first:

    Completely (and I mean completely!) eliminate all commercial fried foods, all forms of wheat, all forms of flour, all forms of processed sugar, all forms of processed seed/vegetable oils. Eat lots and lots of fruit, vegetables, and meat. Don't count carbs, except those from wheat, flour, and snacks (this is easy--ZERO). He can eat sugary fruit, potatoes, rice, bananas, and other carby foods--just don't need to go overboard. If you want to count those carbs, keep it under 100-150. No need for him to go ketogenic to recover from metabolic syndrome, in fact, just the opposite. Some good plant carbs are needed to keep him with some semblance of insulin sensitivity.

    He should eat 2-3 times a day and not snack AT ALL between meals. If he is hungry, he should eat more at meal-time. Constant grazing is a sure way to T2D. Cheese and nuts are OK, but during meals! Not in between.

    I suspect he has done Atkins-style LC/keto before and lost weight&rebounded. What makes you think it will work this time? He needs to just eliminate completely and forevermore the processed crap, the fast-food, the snacking, and drinking of calories.

    Drink only water, tea, coffee. Eat only real food. Going to McDonald's and eating 2 Quarter-pounder meat patties while throwing away the buns and french fries is not part of the plan! Buying grass-fed or local beef burger and cooking it at home is much better.

    Start eating liver once a week or so, learn to make bone broth, eat a big-ass salad every day.

    Once your husband cuts out all the processed stuff and starts eating real food, he will experience a rapid decline in weight and his health markers (choleserol, trigs, bp, and glucose) will all start to normalize.


    After a few months, he will probably experience a stall in weightloss, this is when IF'ing and carb manipulation comes into play. By that time he will have at least started doing pushups, squats and pullups. If you guys watch TV at night, challenge him to 25 pushups during every commercial break.

    Being 100 pounds overweight with T2D is not the end of the world--for me it was the start, because I finally quit trying to 'Atkins' off my flab and stopped listening to my idiot doctor who kept saying 'eat chicken and whole-grain bread...'

    If he eats as I have said for 3-4 months, he will probably be off all his meds and feeling better than he knew possible!

  5. #5
    otzi's Avatar
    otzi Guest
    One more thing: if he doesn't have a glucose tester, get one. He should be sticking his finger all day long until he finds out what his real glucose level is and how badly it is spiking. Also, has he had an A1C test or just a couple of high FBG readings? Docs are notorious for calling people T2D with a single FBG of 130. Any idea what his FBG (or A1C) is? How are his postprandials?

  6. #6
    Join Date
    Mar 2012
    Location
    FL
    Posts
    15
    My husband is T2D... and he's been able to reduce his insulin to nearly nothing on our prescribed restricted-carb and Primal diet. He's not on any oral meds for diabetes at all. Since I know about this only as a bystander, I won't offer any advice; you need to get that from a qualified healthcare provider, or at least from someone who has been there in greater depth than I have!

    However. On the subject of meters. The gold standard for glucose and ketones is blood glucose and ketones. The urine strips may/may not be accurate enough for monitoring. Since I'm following a restricted-carb diet (the same one our endocrinologist put my husband and all his diabetic patients on, even though I'm not diabetic), I bought a meter which will measure blood ketones. It was free - and as far as I know you can still get them. It's called a "NovaMax Plus." I ordered mine right from their website. It comes with only 2 ketone strips (and they're pricey to buy afterwards!), but you get I think 10 or more glucose strips in the initial package, and those aren't any more expensive than the strips for any other meter. The difference is, most (if not all?) of the other meters don't offer the ketone option.

    If you're planning on getting a meter for monitoring (and I agree with the other poster here who encouraged that), you may as well have the one that tests for both.
    The problem with people these days is they've forgotten we're really just animals.

    We did not create the web of life; we are but a strand in it.
    ~ Chief Seattle


    We do not have souls. We ARE souls. We have bodies.
    ~ C. S. Lewis

  7. #7
    Join Date
    Jul 2012
    Location
    Texas
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    Have ordered the meter you mentioned, thanks! Can you tell me the carb limit the Endocrinologist gave your Husband? Also, did he go into ketosis & if so, how did he deal w/ "carb flu"? My Husband has been in carb flu state for over 3 weeks, feels terrible. We received the same garbage ADA advice that most people get, w/ carbs that are too high, so I'm not sure how to find what I would call a truly qualified h.c. provider on this. Thanks for your help, & any further ideas.

  8. #8
    Join Date
    Jul 2012
    Location
    Texas
    Posts
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    Thanks! I'm ~ 2/3 through Bernstein's book, it's great! Love the TreadDesk idea. My Husband is interrupted @ computer & in meetings too much to use one (Joys of being a manager), but have forwarded the TredDesk info to many people I know. Great idea! Any other tips, I'm listening! Big issue is over 3 wks of skirting edge of ketosis, & he feels terrible. He's not eating fruits, nuts, grains, starches... & Still rarely in or past trace ketosis. (I feel so bad for him).

  9. #9
    Join Date
    Jul 2012
    Location
    Texas
    Posts
    42
    Otzi, Thanks. Am waiting for Novamax Plus meter to arrive, so don't know daily glucose or postprandials yet. He has been off of most Junk eating for a long time (No McDonalds ...). Ditched his last junk food hold-outs (toast @ breakfast & chips most evenings) ~ a month ago, so No grains or rice now. We eat mostly organic, & beef is organic grass fed. We do a lot of salmon, organic eggs & big-ass salads (w/ ~12 different organic lettuces), avocados, broccoli, raw spinach, some raw yellow squash, mushrooms, onions... So, he is getting some very healthy carbs from veggies, healthy fats, but he cut out all fruit & nuts since he's Still just skirting edge of ketosis for over 3 weeks, & feels like crap. Can't figure out why he's not in full ketosis, where he will start to burn fat. It's not that ketosis state didn't work for him in the past, he just got complacent & fell out of it. I vaguely understand Atkins, but have never read his books. If I understand correctly, Atkins was o.k w/ meat & fat from Any source, which I disagree with, since the fatty acid profile... is completely different, compared to organic, pasture fed animals. Is this why you don't go for Atkins? I'm thinking the biggest need for him is more exercise. He loves to Mountain Bike, & as our Texas heat improves, he can do it more often. He's on our indoor stationary bike some nights, which is good for cardio, but I think he needs more Heavy muscle work, like lifting weights, push ups... like you mentioned. We're very limited on space, so I think I need to clear out the living room & replace the coffee table w/ our old weight bench! Thanks for your input, would love to hear more!

  10. #10
    Join Date
    Jul 2012
    Location
    Texas
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    CarbDodger, Your weight loss is amazing! You have been such a big help & I enjoy jour journal. Thanks.

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