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Thread: What are the real weight loss benefits of going primal? page 2

  1. #11
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    There are many other factors that come into play with the CICO equation, but that doesn't mean that it's false. I recommend you check this out: The Energy Balance Equation | BodyRecomposition - The Home of Lyle McDonald

    Outside of metabolic damage, the only way to lose weight is to be in an energy deficit. How you create the energy deficit is up to personal preference. If you prefer to eat more carbs and less fat, do it. If you prefer to eat higher fat and less carbs, do it.

    I don't buy into the metabolic advantage theory of low carb diets. When protein intake is kept static, there doesn't seem to be any metabolic advantage to low carb diets.

    Ketogenic low-carbohydrate diets have no metabolic advantage over nonketogenic low-carbohydrate diets
    Similar weight loss with low- or high-carbohydrate diets.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Katie14 View Post
    With regard to weight lose, gain, or maintenance, a calorie is a calorie. If you eat at a deficit you will lose weight and if you overeat you will gain weight. It does not matter what the composition of those calories are.
    Where these calories come from do matter for weight gain/loss.

    This Diet Works: Eat More, Lose Weight - Netscape Home & Living ("A small but carefully controlled research study conducted by the Harvard School of Public Health concluded that people can eat an extra 300 calories a day when they are on a very low-carbohydrate regimen and lose just as much weight in 12 weeks as people on a standard low-fat diet, reports The Associated Press.")
    Princeton University - A sweet problem: Princeton researchers find that high-fructose corn syrup prompts considerably more weight gain ("Rats with access to high-fructose corn syrup gained significantly more weight than those with access to table sugar, even when their overall caloric intake was the same.")
    All Calories Not Created Equal, Study Suggests ("Low-Fat Eaters Burned Fewer Calories, Were More Likely to Regain Lost Weight")

    And:

    Nutrition Journal | Full text | "A calorie is a calorie" violates the second law of thermodynamics ("as a general principle, 'a calorie is a calorie' violates the second law of thermodynamics.")

  3. #13
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    Quote Originally Posted by eKatherine View Post
    Note: if, as the thread title suggests, you see the sole purpose of primal to be as a temporary weight loss diet, I think most people would agree that you needn't bother.
    Plenty of people ask about weight loss while eating Primal. The title does not suggest that the OP thinks it's a temporary weight loss diet at all. That's just you constructing a strawman.
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  4. #14
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    Quote Originally Posted by sbhikes View Post
    I think what most people do not understand is that changing your diet from CW to Primal is a sea change for anyone with metabolic syndrome. If you don't have metabolic syndrome, you just cannot understand how life-changing this can be.

    The CW sets up a person with metabolic syndrome to continue to have metabolic syndrome. After all, it causes metabolic syndrome in susceptible people. The "cure" that doctors hand out is to just keep eating the same crap but less of it. THIS DOESN'T WORK if you have metabolic syndrome. You cannot bear the hunger for long. You are still adding bad fats and too many carbohydrates to your broken system. It's not enough of a change to correct your hormonal imbalances.

    If you don't have metabolic syndrome, you just can't understand this. If you don't have metabolic syndrome, you aren't going to experience as big a change. You may experience other changes like relief of IBS, eczema, acne, asthma, arthritis or other things. Or you might not see anything different.

    So metabolically broken people change over to primal and their bodies can heal. Part of that healing is to drop a lot of the excess weight. You can finally lose weight because your body is starting to function correctly again. For some people, they turn into hunks and goddesses. For others they just get a little of the excess off and experience freedom from the other symptoms. Once you are cured of the metabolic syndrome, weight loss works the same way it works for anyone who never had metabolic syndrome: eat less/exercise more effectively.

    Get it? Can we stop with the CICO madness already?
    When you say metabolic syndrom are you talking about being very carb sensitive like craving carbs and becoming completely ravenous when blood sugar levels drop?

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    What exactly is paleo. I was under the impression that paleo was a low carb diet as well.
    Primal is a high fat-low carb version of Paleo. Paleo is moderate carbs, moderate fat.
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    Here are two sample days of me eating @ 1500 calories:

    Breakfast- 3 eggs, scrambled with bacon, mushrooms, spinach. 1/2 cup blueberres, coffee with cream
    Lunch- Chicken and asparagus, water
    Dinner- Steak, small sweet potato, butter, spinach

    OR
    Breakfast- eggwhites, low fat cheese, whole grain tortilla, salsa
    Lunch- veggie wrap with low fat cheese
    Dinner- pasta with tomatoe sauce, salad and a roll

    The above is primal, below is typical low fat. I feel like primal is WAY more nutrient dense and the focus on whole foods is really healing compared to straight up caloric restriction. It just works better to eliminate useless filler foods like grains and focus your calories on more satiating and nourishing foods.
    But you do not have to do low fat-high carb version with useless calories like tortillas. You can do a happy mix of fruit, seafood, veggies, tubers, legumes and nutritious non-processed cereals like buckwheat and millet.

    So, it will be more like:

    B: hot millet with pear
    S: apple
    L: shrimps and gazpacho
    D: bean & sweet potato chili, and a HUGE fruit plate...
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  7. #17
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    Quote Originally Posted by Pacna View Post
    This Diet Works: Eat More, Lose Weight - Netscape Home & Living ("A small but carefully controlled research study conducted by the Harvard School of Public Health concluded that people can eat an extra 300 calories a day when they are on a very low-carbohydrate regimen and lose just as much weight in 12 weeks as people on a standard low-fat diet, reports The Associated Press.")
    Didn't control for protein, therefore it's irrelevant.

    Princeton University - A sweet problem: Princeton researchers find that high-fructose corn syrup prompts considerably more weight gain ("Rats with access to high-fructose corn syrup gained significantly more weight than those with access to table sugar, even when their overall caloric intake was the same.")
    I would like to see the actual study rather than a write up reviewing the study. It doesn't detail the methods of the study and how much HFCS was used. In addition, hepatic de novo lipogenesis occurs way more often in rats than it does with humans, so comparisons of fat gain when giving excess sugar to rats should be taken with a grain of salt.

    All Calories Not Created Equal, Study Suggests ("Low-Fat Eaters Burned Fewer Calories, Were More Likely to Regain Lost Weight")
    I've read the actual study in the past. It's a decent study, but again, in the higher fat group, protein intake is 10% higher. This is significant, and would skew the results drastically.

    And:

    Nutrition Journal | Full text | "A calorie is a calorie" violates the second law of thermodynamics ("as a general principle, 'a calorie is a calorie' violates the second law of thermodynamics.")
    Again, interesting. I would recommend you check out Lyle McDonald's explanation of the question "is a calorie a calorie" as I believe he goes over this study: Is a Calorie a Calorie? | BodyRecomposition - The Home of Lyle McDonald
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    Quote Originally Posted by jakejoh10 View Post
    Plenty of people ask about weight loss while eating Primal. The title does not suggest that the OP thinks it's a temporary weight loss diet at all. That's just you constructing a strawman.
    The thread title "What are the real weight loss benefits of going primal" implies that there need to be "weight loss benefits" for primal to be worth doing. The site is also visited regularly by dieters who are looking for a fast and easy weight loss diet.

    The thread starter reads like it was written by a troll who came here to attack "primal". Why do people come here to argue that "primal" is supposed to be a rigidly paleo diet? That isn't anything that is argued anywhere. Red flag.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Katie14 View Post
    What exactly is paleo. I was under the impression that paleo was a low carb diet as well.
    boards like this are great for questions and parsing stuff out, but i really think it is YOUR responsibility to be better informed on the fundamentals -- which are right here and FREE on this site. mark does recommend a carb curve for losing or maintaining weight but primal is NOT low-carb by its nature.

    Quote Originally Posted by sbhikes View Post

    Get it? Can we stop with the CICO madness already?
    there are plenty of 20-something guys on here ( a few in particular) who insist cico is the only undeniable and irrefutable way to lose weight. before i hit my 40s i agreed. my experience over the last few years has shown me the flaws in this simplistic notion. bodies broken by years of cw nutritional advice don't turn on a dime or respond to changes the same way as a healthy ones do.
    As I ate the oysters with their strong taste of the sea and their faint metallic taste that the cold white wine washed away, leaving only the sea taste and the succulent texture, and as I drank their cold liquid from each shell and washed it down with the crisp taste of the wine, I lost the empty feeling and began to be happy and to make plans.

    Ernest Hemingway

  10. #20
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    Quote Originally Posted by eKatherine View Post
    The thread starter reads like it was written by a troll who came here to attack "primal". Why do people come here to argue that "primal" is supposed to be a rigidly paleo diet? That isn't anything that is argued anywhere. Red flag.
    Maybe it reads like that to you? I don't know, I guess I just don't assume that someone's priority is to bash the diet. Maybe the person is just looking for information, that's what people do on forums. Who are you to assume someone's motives for asking a valid question?
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