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Thread: Nicotine in its isolated form page

  1. #1
    wiggles92's Avatar
    wiggles92 is offline Junior Member
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    Nicotine in its isolated form

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    Third post in 10 minutes. Oh well. This isn't particularly 'primal' but this forum seems to actually offer decent discussion. I suppose if you are willing to let go of the saturated fat/heart disease hypothesis, you are willing to treat ideas with an open mind.

    Nicotine, it seems, is itself not a culprate for any of the health concerns related to smoking. From personal research, it's just a close cousin of caffeine. If you 'smoked' all that coffee you drink, I'm guessing you would come across the same health problems as a regular smoker. Nicotine seems to have been implicated with the dangers of tobacco, when in reality it's a relatively benign substance.

    Granted, you could overdose if you wanted to. However it seems humans are pretty good at not overdoing it. I mean, think about how many people smoke 20 cigarettes a day for their entire life and never overdose as such.

    If you were smoking e cigarettes you would obviously bypass all the carcinogenic properties of inhaling smoke. As I understand it, e cigs are an entirely clean delivery system, as you are inhaling nicotine infused smoke.

    Essentially this is what I am asking-

    Is it possible that, using a safe delivery mechanism, daily nicotine consumption may offer some benefits with few downsides? I know if I asked most of the public they would essentially say cigarettes are bad, nicotine is dirty, it will kill you, addictive blah blah blah as they make their way through one too many slices of chocolate cake. I think the (deserved) stigma associated with tobacco has stifled researched into the medicinal potential of the active compounds involved.

    In the same way the public has shunned any discussion over the medicinal capacity of say, cannabis, it seems the message that tobacco is the scourge of the earth has ruled out any sane discussion of the active compounds in what is, at the end of the day, a plant. Like the much lauded green tea, with it's mega ultra super antioxidants and phytonutrients.

    To me, tobacco and tea are two sides of the same goddamn coin. So let's grow up a little and treat them as such.

    Nicotine, when treated responsibly, seems to offer similar neuroprotective benefits as caffeine. It also seems to trigger the body to burn unnecessary fat stores, which is part of the reason smokers are thinner (I know the whole dopamine short circuiting also leads to less appetite but this still seems relevant in an increasingly obese population).

    Perhaps the biggest concern is whether long term nicotine consumption could pose issues related to adrenaline, as it fires up the fight or flight mechanism. Which I suppose is why people smoke, amongst other things.

  2. #2
    Damiana's Avatar
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    If by benign you mean potentially teratogenic, then sure, nicotine is benign. Furthermore ecigarettes don't contain pure nicotine. They're unregulated and they might contain other chemicals that make them dangerous in other ways than real cigarettes. And using nicotine to get a similar reaction in your body as caffeine? Isn't that like using a gun to kill a cockroach at your feet when stepping on it would serve the purpose? Just give me my coffee.
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  3. #3
    Cryptocode's Avatar
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    I have smoked since I was 20. At least 1 pack a day, more lately 2 packs. Doctors act like this is a deadly amount. In fact back in the 50's, 1 pack was a light smoker, 2 packs was medium, 3-5 was heavy. I have smoked every day of my life since 20. I became more and more insistant upon smoking because of all the damn adds run against it, especially in CA. How dare they invade my life so. I'd read most all the tests done on smoking in the early days and it was all bollicks. False. (They were trying to prove it was the nicotine that was the bad problem.) So I quit paying any attention to the adds and the tests. 'It's just those darn d0-gooders' that want to control everyone else's life.

    A few years ago my Doctor was determined to prove I was damaging my health and gave me the stress test. Alas, I out performed an age group even younger than myself. Poor Doctor.

    So a few weeks ago I tell my doctor I've switched to herbal cigarettes. (I'm expecting a huge favorable response - he's been trying to get me to quit as long as I've known him.) The doctor is not impressed at all. I'm stunned. "Nicotine", he says, "is no problem." (I was right, those d0-gooders were wrong.) BUT, there is one thing for sure it does, it irritates the lining of the stomach and colons, therefore causing inflamation, some, and carbonized vegetation is carcinogenic. (JUst like Mark has been saying for some time.) But my cigarettes have really good filters.

    Worse yet, the herbal cigarette makers have learned from the tobacco companies and have added some sugar product to the cigarettes that is fantastically effective at making you CRAVE sugar (and more of their cigarettes). It's super effective.

    So I changed to the electronic cigarettes. These are pure nicotine (at least the ones I buy). There not nearly as satisfying as a tobacco cigarette but they're OK. And they're legal anywehre in CA as long as you stay away from dyed-in-the-wool cigarette haters.

    By next month I will be following the doctors prescription methods for quiting. And right in the nick of time there is:

    FDA announces first decisions on new tobacco products through the substantial equivalence pathway

    If nicotine has any benefits, I'm willing to give them up along with coffee. Not chocolate though.
    Last edited by Cryptocode; 06-27-2013 at 01:57 PM.
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    diene's Avatar
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    Nicotine is neuroprotective so, yes, it does have benefits. However, the neuroprotective effects of nicotine alone is not as pronounced as that of tobacco because tobacco contains other alkaloids that are also neuroprotective and act synergistically with nicotine. However, smoking tobacco also increases the risks of lung cancer. So pick your poison and your medicine.

  5. #5
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    Can it be beneficial? Sure. Is it necessary or will it be more beneficial than a stimulant such as caffeine? I don't think so. I just don't really see the point, to be honest.
    My nutrition/fitness/critical thinking blog:

  6. #6
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    Well, as a cigar smoker, I'd say it has it's place. I find it very relaxing to kick back with a stogie. There's no added chemicals, just pure tobacco leaves, and no inhaling, so just minor absorption. Do the pro's outweigh the con's? They do for me, or I wouldn't be doing it.

  7. #7
    eKatherine's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Cryptocode View Post
    I have smoked since I was 20. At least 1 pack a day, more lately 2 packs. Doctors act like this is a deadly amount. In fact back in the 50's, 1 pack was a light smoker, 2 packs was medium, 3-5 was heavy. I have smoked every day of my life since 20. I became more and more insistant upon smoking because of all the damn adds run against it, especially in CA. How dare they invade my life so. I'd read most all the tests done on smoking in the early days and it was all bollicks. False. (They were trying to prove it was the nicotine that was the bad problem.) So I quit paying any attention to the adds and the tests. 'It's just those darn d0-gooders' that want to control everyone else's life.

    A few years ago my Doctor was determined to prove I was damaging my health and gave me the stress test. Alas, I out performed an age group even younger than myself. Poor Doctor.

    So a few weeks ago I tell my doctor I've switched to herbal cigarettes. (I'm expecting a huge favorable response - he's been trying to get me to quit as long as I've known him.) The doctor is not impressed at all. I'm stunned. "Nicotine", he says, "is no problem." (I was right, those d0-gooders were wrong.) BUT, there is one thing for sure it does, it irritates the lining of the stomach and colons, therefore causing inflamation, some, and carbonized vegetation is carcinogenic. (JUst like Mark has been saying for some time.) But my cigarettes have really good filters.

    Worse yet, the herbal cigarette makers have learned from the tobacco companies and have added some sugar product to the cigarettes that is fantastically effective at making you CRAVE sugar (and more of their cigarettes). It's super effective.

    So I changed to the electronic cigarettes. These are pure nicotine (at least the ones I buy). There not nearly as satisfying as a tobacco cigarette but they're OK. And they're legal anywehre in CA as long as you stay away from dyed-in-the-wool cigarette haters.

    By next month I will be following the doctors prescription methods for quiting. And right in the nick of time there is:

    FDA announces first decisions on new tobacco products through the substantial equivalence pathway

    If nicotine has any benefits, I'm willing to give them up along with coffee. Not chocolate though.
    Many smokers do continue to smoke for the same reasons they started in the first place. They're no longer rebelling against adults as they grow older, so their rebellion is against "the establishment". Rebelliousness is part of their identity.

  8. #8
    danlyjames's Avatar
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    Some look like cigarettes, pipes, or cigars, while others are disguised as pens or other more socially acceptable items.

  9. #9
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    You may be interested to check out what Robb Wolf has to say about it - http://js2.robbwolf.com/wp/wp-conten.../Episode96.pdf (somewhere around page 7)
    It's the transcript of his podcast where he touches upon nicotine in its pure form and doesn't seem to see it as very evil...

  10. #10
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    One principle of primal living is to aspire to natural things, as per what grok would have had. As for nicotine then, it seems eggplant is the richest natural food source, and you still need 9 kg to get the equivalent of one cigarette. So I'm not convinced...

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Eggplant

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