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  1. #131
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    Quote Originally Posted by wiltondeportes View Post
    I eat meat because it IS barbarous! Ha!
    Meh.
    I don't find it so at all.
    I've killed and butchered lots of animals, both domestic and game, and I find that for the most part the people who think it's somehow something either awful or gloriously 'barbarous' are people who have never participated in such things in any way other than in their imagination.

    It just is.
    It's no more than any other normal function of life.
    “You have your way. I have my way. As for the right way, the correct way, and the only way, it does not exist.”
    ~Friedrich Nietzsche
    And that's why I'm here eating HFLC Primal/Paleo.


  2. #132
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    Quote Originally Posted by cori93437 View Post
    I grew up on a farm so that I was always intimately involved in the lives and deaths of the animals we ate.
    I did not find those practices either savagely cruel or exceedingly brutal, or primitive and uncivilized in any way.

    We cared for the animals well while they lived. We dispatch them humanely.
    We lived cultured, modern, civilized lives before, during, and after our farm chores.

    There is no basis for the barbarous statement.
    That's how you view it, but some people believe animals have the same natural rights as humans. I do see husbandry as a form of slavery. I don't particularly think there's anything special about human life; we're the most destructive creatures to ever roam the planet. We won the evolutionary lottery. We aren't entitled to anything more than other life, we just have the capacity and thumbs to take it even if it's not being offered.
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  3. #133
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    You're using barbarous to mean something different than it's definition.

    Once I read your previous post I realized that... it's helpful to know that people are making up their own definition for words prior to these things... it prevents confusion.
    That's sort of why words have definitions to begin with.
    The way you use barbarous is not what barbarous means.

    The way I used barbarous is the correct usage.

    And opinions and all.
    I think everything you posted there is just ridiculous.
    I don't buy into that stuff at all.
    It doesn't mean humans are 'entitled', it just means we are capable. And in the world that's how it works.
    I don't see any point in moralizing it.
    Moralizing food is silly and romantic IMO.
    “You have your way. I have my way. As for the right way, the correct way, and the only way, it does not exist.”
    ~Friedrich Nietzsche
    And that's why I'm here eating HFLC Primal/Paleo.


  4. #134
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    Quote Originally Posted by cori93437 View Post
    You're using barbarous to mean something different than it's definition.

    Once I read your previous post I realized that... it's helpful to know that people are making up their own definition for words prior to these things... it prevents confusion.
    That's sort of why words have definitions to begin with.
    The way you use barbarous is not what barbarous means.

    The way I used barbarous is the correct usage.

    And opinions and all.
    I think everything you posted there is just ridiculous.
    I don't buy into that stuff at all.
    It doesn't mean humans are 'entitled', it just means we are capable. And in the world that's how it works.
    I don't see any point in moralizing it.
    Moralizing food is silly and romantic IMO.
    I define barbarous as cruel and uncivilized, it's literal definition. A philosophy of non-aggression would dictate that taking the life of another who did not threaten you is an act of cruelty and arguably beneath the highly evolved brain; uncivilized. You would have to subscribe to this philosophy to agree. Clearly you do not. I also see the reasoning of how slaughtering animals for food is a primitive act. I can see a time in the future where it is unnecessary and considered obsolete, some have arrived at that conclusion now. At one point human slavery was widely accepted and rationalized; in my opinion I think it's possible that one day humans could extend that compassion to other species.

    I have already admitted my hypocrisy on this issue, but I will not concede that my idealistic principles are flawed. I do not believe I have anymore of a right to life than another just because evolution has equipped me with the capability to dominate and take advantage of lesser creatures. One might argue with these evolutionary advantages that it our moral obligation to protect the ones who are not capable of such reasoning by simply not engaging in unprovoked acts of aggression. That is not my feeling on the matter, but I do understand and admire the philosophy.
    Last edited by j3nn; 06-17-2013 at 03:04 AM.
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  5. #135
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    Quote Originally Posted by YogaBare View Post
    Yeah, just look at some of these dumb ass vegetarians...

    Albert Einstein
    Leonardo Da Vinci
    Srinivasa Ramanujan
    Gandhi
    Vincent Van Gogh
    Thomas Edison
    Pythagoras
    Mark Twain
    Franz Kafka

    On another note, this is one of the funniest sites I've seen: Vegetarians are Evil - Official Homepage
    I love that site...thanks for sharing.....Drinking Soy can apparently stop men developing an interest in girls due to massive hormone levels......A lot of it seems "tongue in cheek" but there has to be some sensible science there somewhere!

  6. #136
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    Quote Originally Posted by j3nn View Post
    I define barbarous as cruel and uncivilized, it's literal definition. A philosophy of non-aggression would dictate that taking the life of another who did not threaten you is an act of cruelty and arguably beneath the highly evolved brain; uncivilized. You would have to subscribe to this philosophy to agree. Clearly you do not. I also see the reasoning of how slaughtering animals for food is a primitive act. I can see a time in the future where it is unnecessary and considered obsolete, some have arrived at that conclusion now. At one point human slavery was widely accepted and rationalized; in my opinion I think it's possible that one day humans could extend that compassion to other species.

    I have already admitted my hypocrisy on this issue, but I will not concede that my idealistic principles are flawed. I do not believe I have anymore of a right to life than another just because evolution has equipped me with the capability to dominate and take advantage of lesser creatures. One might argue with these evolutionary advantages that it our moral obligation to protect the ones who are not capable of such reasoning by simply not engaging in unprovoked acts of aggression. That is not my feeling on the matter, but I do understand and admire the philosophy.
    I'm a hedonistic amoralist and scientific skeptic.... So between those two thought patterns, nothing tells me that eating meat is wrong. Show me how we're destroying the world with our meat consumption, or show me how I'm destroying myself. Otherwise, piss off.

  7. #137
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    Quote Originally Posted by kiks View Post
    Interesting thought you bring up...Why do you say there is no evil in nature? Then is there no good? But what about positive and negative forces/charges in nature...these opposing forces exist...why isn't good and evil an opposing force of sorts...where do we draw the line?
    But there isn't good and evil. There's negative and positive and grey areas and it's all individual. If you're afraid your child will be harmed by someone, you'll do anything you can to avoid that happening. You may call the police, spread the word or assault them, depending on what effect each will have and what options are available to you. If you hurt them in any way and they are innocent, are you evil? What if they WANTED to hurt your child, but would have been incapable of it? A lion needs to kill a zebra to live, yet the zebra must die. A life for a life. But that particular zebra didn't need to die. Maybe it was young, or a mother. Maybe zebras are dying out and that zebra's death meant the end of hope for them. Is the lion evil?
    If you view something as "evil" you're taking it personally. Things can only be bad from your own perspective, be it because they affect you or because you've taken a stance. But there is nothing, nothing at all, that is ultimately evil. It's why we need to invent implausible monsters for our horror stories/films: we need something unpredictable, remorseless, cruel, aggressive and that causes harm for no reason. We can't take that from nature: such a life-form isn't real.

    "Evil" is such extreme terminology. If you do something bad, it's because you felt you needed to do it in order to obtain something good. You did it because you either perceived it not to be bad or to be the lesser evil than whatever would happen if you didn't do it. Not because you are bad to the core and want to cause harm.
    --
    Perfection is entirely individual. Any philosophy or pursuit that encourages individuality has merit in that it frees people. Any that encourages shackles only has merit in that it shows you how wrong and desperate the human mind can get in its pursuit of truth.

    --
    I get blunter and more narcissistic by the day.
    I'd apologize, but...

  8. #138
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    Quote Originally Posted by wiltondeportes View Post
    I'm a hedonistic amoralist and scientific skeptic.... So between those two thought patterns, nothing tells me that eating meat is wrong. Show me how we're destroying the world with our meat consumption, or show me how I'm destroying myself. Otherwise, piss off.
    Your hostility Is unwarranted. I eat meat the same as you do, you just feel better and righteous about how it comes to be. It's impossible to convince someone a philosophy of non-aggression toward all living creatures if they are not open to it. I don't believe we are destroying the world by eating meat, nor destroying ourselves per se. I just feel compassion toward all living creatures that sense pain and fear. My own selfishness overrides my compassion for animals, but I still feel bad about it and would be open to alternatives that don't involve deliberately taking their lives. I haven't found better alternatives, so I eat the meat with a guilty conscience because I know no animal has voluntarily put itself on my plate.
    Last edited by j3nn; 06-17-2013 at 05:21 AM.
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  9. #139
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    Quote Originally Posted by Kochin View Post
    "Evil" is such extreme terminology. If you do something bad, it's because you felt you needed to do it in order to obtain something good. You did it because you either perceived it not to be bad or to be the lesser evil than whatever would happen if you didn't do it. Not because you are bad to the core and want to cause harm.
    I think this is a slippery slope that can be used to justify really horrific acts of aggression towards others. Stealing some food because you're hungry is not in the same league as murdering millions of innocent people because you believe you are doing the right thing. There are universal rights and wrongs and I think that it's a waste of an intelligent species like human beings to not make those distinctions.
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  10. #140
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    Quote Originally Posted by j3nn View Post
    Your hostility Is unwarranted. I eat meat the same as you do, you just feel better and righteous about how it comes to be. It's impossible to convince someone a philosophy of non-aggression toward all living creatures if they are not open to it. I don't believe we are destroying the world by eating meat, nor destroying ourselves per se. I just feel compassion toward all living creatures that sense pain and fear. My own selfishness overrides my compassion for animals, but I still feel bad about it and would be open to alternatives that don't involve deliberately taking their lives. I haven't found better alternatives, so I eat the meat with a guilty conscience because I know no animal has voluntarily put itself on my plate.
    I actually couldn't care less if you ate meat. I'm more antagonistic against a morslist's view of it. You admitted that there's no logical reason to not eat meat. So why I ask do you see it as bad? Your compassion is naive. One can be compassionate of life while eating it. I hate superficial morals because they make people do stupid things.

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