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  1. #201
    Leida's Avatar
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    You know, I am sorry. I just wrote an angry post, but I should not get angry at you. You are trying to help and you still believe there is a spoon. Maybe you will keep believing, and more happy you will be for that.

    I tried all that stuff you are suggesting and went nowhere far. I believe the truth is that there is no spoon.

    So, I am trying to live and eat happy, according to my tastes and preferences, and adapt to the idea that I will always be 'not fat' (or maybe even outright fat few years down the road). Maybe it's not a bad thing.
    Last edited by Leida; 06-14-2013 at 08:53 AM.
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  2. #202
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    dilberryhoundog is offline Senior Member
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    no worries, stick with the fruit then. Just get in and mix up what ever you can, change your daily meat intake, same for vegges, have a meat + fruit day throw in a Vegge + fruit day, do a just fruit day, mix them up too, don't have to do em on a set shedule, just do em when ever comfy.
    Stay clear of anything that gives you inflammation like your nightshades etc but keep in mind that as your metabolism gets more robust and antifragile from other sources, the inflammation will probably start to subside from those trigger foods and you'll eventually be able to incorporate them into your variations as well. What ever you can change up dietary wise is good.

    Please please please, what ever you do, just don't eat the same stuff every day, day upon day, even if its the tiniest variation, its better than aiming for stringent consistency, which will only lead to, or further exacerbate, chronic stress and metabolic atrophy.

    Edit: leida you changed your post above, puts mine out of context, its no worries, i'm just adding this for posterity.
    Last edited by dilberryhoundog; 06-15-2013 at 05:52 AM.
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  3. #203
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    Hey dilberryhound, maybe you should start a new thread about this theory of yours. Then people who are interested could maybe try it and talk about it. It will be like the potato thread, the ADF thread, and the SLD thread.

    Do you think your theory could be modified to work with ADF (alternate day fasting or Johnson's up day down day diet). That's what I'm doing right now. You basically alternate between high-calorie and low-calorie days. On low-calorie days, you eat 500 calories or less. On high-calorie days, well, it depends. You start out not counting, eat as much as you want. If you stall, then you might restrict to some extent. It works well for many people who can't stick to a constant moderate-calorie diet. I think the ADF model applies your theory of varying stressors. Instead of chronically stressing your body (and mind) with a stupid 1200-1600 calorie diet (what an average woman would have to eat at if she wants to lose weight), you alternate between extremes. It works way better for me because I can't psychologically deal with eating 1200-1600 calories a day, every day. It makes me feel constantly deprived. I much prefer eating very little (some down days, I eat less than 100 calories; others, I'll eat maybe 300) one day, then eating a lot the next. I think I might modify your protocol to work with ADF. I don't want to stop ADF because it's working for me, but I think it might work better if I incorporated some of your tips.

    Anyway, you should start a new thread on this. I think I'll start incorporating some of your tips next week.

  4. #204
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    Okay, nevermind. I just looked at your blog, and I see that you've already started a thread. I even recall reading that thread but must not have read very carefully. Well, in the beginning of April, which is when you started it, I was not yet ready to start restricting again, which explains why I didn't read it carefully. I will revive that thread once I start incorporating some of your tips next week.

  5. #205
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    DH, thank you so much for all that info! It's really cool of you to take the time to write it all out. It actually sounds very similar to "The fast metabolism diet" which I was going to try once I got back from vacation. But yours sounds a little easier, and I second Diene's suggestion that you start a thread on it (I know there's already one but a fresh start might be good). I'll be the first on the bandwagon!

    Leida, I think this should be called "The burn out thread" <3 I know how you feel: defeated. I'm just so exhausted by this dieting thing that changing anything feels like a huge amount of work. Saying that, I have just given up rice, as I know it bloats me.

    Do you mind me asking - how long have you been dieting for? It was 13 years for me (with an ED on the side). Not surprising it eventually took its toll.
    "I think the basic anti-aging diet is also the best diet for prevention and treatment of diabetes, scleroderma, and the various "connective tissue diseases." This would emphasize high protein, low unsaturated fats, low iron, and high antioxidant consumption, with a moderate or low starch consumption.

    In practice, this means that a major part of the diet should be milk, cheese, eggs, shellfish, fruits and coconut oil, with vitamin E and salt as the safest supplements."

    - Ray Peat

  6. #206
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    My first memory of restricted food intake was about 10-12 yo, when my mom forcefully removed my plate and my cousin tried to sneak some food to me, but I refused.

    Mom put me on my first diet when I was 16, and came to the expedition chubby after staying with grandma for a month. After that it was always portion control. My first week-long fast was at 18 when mom considered me sufficiently grown up to sustain a fast. I did 1 day per week fast throughout the BSc in the University, and tried to control my food intake & workout from e-Diets CW and Buns of Steel in my twenties to paleo and heavy lifting in my now almost forties.

    That's ages 16 through the age 38 = 22 years, minus about 3-4 years trying to conceive and after child-birth.

    The only time I felt pretty happy with my body was after a long boring month with mom at age 22 in Crimea when we ate primarily fruit and veggies bought daily (and stringently) at the market and hiked/swim and roughed it out in the leased horrid room(s). I was 110 lbs when I came back, and mom thought I can carefully drop another 5 lbs or so to get a solid "A-" body. Of course that did not work, since I did have access to food, so I rolled back to "B-B-" by her scale.

    And, yeah, I truly feel that I tried everything save for raw foods (raw meats) and veganism.
    Last edited by Leida; 06-14-2013 at 09:35 AM.
    My Journal: http://www.marksdailyapple.com/forum/thread57916.html
    When I let go of what I am, I become what I might be.

  7. #207
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    dilberryhoundog Would you summarize the resulting actions of your theory to varying your food and macros often? I do that a bit currently but it is interesting the way you lay out the ideas behind it. Some days for lunch at work I will eat leftovers of groundbeed with butternut squash.. and the next day I might eat 400g of carbs from bananas and dates.

    I also think this fits into more logical primal. As if primal ate high fat on a daily basis.. makes no sense to me. If a primative tribe came across a field of tubers and pollen.. guess what they might not eat for weeks.. fat and much protein.
    Last edited by statikcat; 06-14-2013 at 09:50 AM.

  8. #208
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    Leida--I think your overly self-critical attitude about your body possibly came from your mom. It seems like she was very critical of your body when you were young.

  9. #209
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    Quote Originally Posted by diene View Post
    Leida--I think your overly self-critical attitude about your body possibly came from your mom. It seems like she was very critical of your body when you were young.
    Yeah, this makes much more sense now. Leida, your mother emotionally abused you and totally f*cked up your sense of selfworth and body image. For the love of god let it go. (Yes, I know, much easier said than done, but seriously).

  10. #210
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    Quote Originally Posted by Leida View Post
    My first memory of restricted food intake was about 10-12 yo, when my mom forcefully removed my plate and my cousin tried to sneak some food to me, but I refused.

    Mom put me on my first diet when I was 16, and came to the expedition chubby after staying with grandma for a month. After that it was always portion control. My first week-long fast was at 18 when mom considered me sufficiently grown up to sustain a fast. I did 1 day per week fast throughout the BSc in the University, and tried to control my food intake & workout from e-Diets CW and Buns of Steel in my twenties to paleo and heavy lifting in my now almost forties.

    That's ages 16 through the age 38 = 22 years, minus about 3-4 years trying to conceive and after child-birth.

    The only time I felt pretty happy with my body was after a long boring month with mom at age 22 in Crimea when we ate primarily fruit and veggies bought daily (and stringently) at the market and hiked/swim and roughed it out in the leased horrid room(s). I was 110 lbs when I came back, and mom thought I can carefully drop another 5 lbs or so to get a solid "A-" body. Of course that did not work, since I did have access to food, so I rolled back to "B-B-" by her scale.

    And, yeah, I truly feel that I tried everything save for raw foods (raw meats) and veganism.
    It takes a long time to undo a life time of programming. When I step back and look at how I look at myself it's really horrific. I have major body dysmorphia. I was looking in the mirror this morning, and all I saw was a body that is an American size 16 (I'm a 6-8). It's totally fucked up. I constantly find myself looking at kids of 14 and being jealous of their figures. I blame the world for making me like this, but it's something deeper within me.

    Luckily I'm kind of reaching a point where I can see the insanity of these thoughts. It doesn't mean they aren't there, but I'm getting more clarity on them. Now I at least recognise that it's ridiculous for a 31 year old woman to want to have the figure of a teenager. It's helping me as well to recognise that at least I have recovered from an ED, and it doesn't rule my life anymore, though the thoughts still exist.

    Leida, can you think of anything that you've overcome in the procress of the last few months, that make the weight gain worthwhile?
    "I think the basic anti-aging diet is also the best diet for prevention and treatment of diabetes, scleroderma, and the various "connective tissue diseases." This would emphasize high protein, low unsaturated fats, low iron, and high antioxidant consumption, with a moderate or low starch consumption.

    In practice, this means that a major part of the diet should be milk, cheese, eggs, shellfish, fruits and coconut oil, with vitamin E and salt as the safest supplements."

    - Ray Peat

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