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Thread: Do excess carbs turn to fat, even within calorie limits? page 4

  1. #31
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    Quote Originally Posted by eKatherine View Post
    What actually happens is that if you were to consume a large amount of carbs at a sitting (a situation often known as a "meal"), the glucose rises in the bloodstream. It does not stay at an elevated level indefinitely until your energy use requires it, uses it up, and brings it down to FBS level again. Your system will harvest the excess and put it into storage (fat) for when it may be needed at a later time (famine).
    You need huuuge amounts of carbs for that to happen, se my other postings above, - de-novo-lipogenesis almost never happens under normal circumstances...

  2. #32
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    Quote Originally Posted by Alfi56 View Post
    Hi,

    I'm a new member and this is my first post. I've been reading around on Mark's Daily Apple and online, but all the information is just overwhelming, and I still can't find a definite answer to my question. I eat about 25% of my calories from carbs, so but sometimes I want to indulge in a high-carb, high-glycemic pastry or sweet. I'm wondering, I know having a lot of carbs at once can spike insulin and cause excess carbs to store as fat, but when I have a cheat day but still eat within my calorie limits, I know I won't gain weight but will I still gain fat? Or is fat gain just calorie in, calorie out?

    I don't want to be restrictive and I'm wondering if I can include some carby indulgences once in a while. Please don't recommend eating a paleo dessert instead or something like that; sometimes I'm just craving a biscotti and I want a biscotti, but I want to know if that will affect my body composition.
    Excess calories turn into excess weight 100% of the time. If you're overeating protein, carbs or fat, some of each will be stored as lean mass and fat. In my experience:

    1.) Excess protein is least likely to be stored as fat and most likely stored as lean tissue. High protein diets will make you gain "weight" as quickly in excess as other diets, but they are the least "fattening."

    2.) Excess carbohydrate immediately post-workout is stored almost all as muscle up to around a 25-30% surplus. The more you increase, the more you start to store fat. Moderate overeating post-workout is beneficial but stuffing yourself til you're ill never seems to be ideal. Excess carbohydrate when sedentary can be fattening.

    3.) Excess dietary fat at anytime is more likely to be stored as fat than excess carbohydrate in similar situations. Fat is less anabolic than carbohydrate. Saturated fats are superior than unsaturated fats because they better support thyroid function and boost testosterone - overeating red meat, coconut and dairy is superior to overeating chicken, pork, nuts and obviously unsaturated oils. Those bodybuilders tend to consume lots of steak, eggs and dairy for a reason, even if they don't quite know why.

    4.) Consuming an excess of fat AND carbohydrate in unison stores mostly as fat.

    When I know a large meal is coming up and I know I'm going to overeat, I try to overeat lean proteins and fruits/starches. This will at least take advantage of free glycogen stores, and since carbs and protein elevate the metabolic rate, overconsuming significantly will have less of an effect than fat. If I know the foods will be particularly fatty, like a breakfast buffet (eggs, bacon, sausage) or a Brazilian steakhouse where I really go to town, I try and avoid carbohydrate and stick to strictly protein and fat to at least keep me in a "burn" state while my metabolism is elevated from huge amounts of salt and protein.

    If this makes sense, ice cream and chocolate cake are both great for gaining "weight," but ice cream is less fattening and is a supremely anabolic food. However, lean steak and steamed or baked potatoes in equal calories will crush them both. Ice cream makes me gain weight very quickly. I was consuming ice cream several times a week to get stronger, and my benchpress shot up to 250x3 at 160 lbs. I stopped consuming it due to fat gain, but I got freaking strong as hell. I cut it out completely and I dropped to 145 lbs currently, but 250 lbs once is a serious struggle now. It is uncomfortable for me to consume lean meats, fruits and starches in the same quantity I could consume ice cream. There is always room for ice cream! I'll consume it again in the fall when the shirt stays on all the time and I want to gain more mass.

    Finally, if I know I'm going to overconsume, I always make sure to lift heavy and hard shortly beforehand to minimize damage.

    Hope this helps.
    Last edited by ChocoTaco369; 06-03-2013 at 10:31 AM.
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  3. #33
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    Quote Originally Posted by Gorbag View Post
    Yep, unless that you eat more than 700 - 900 gram of carbs per day for an average person
    The average person gets fat with "just" 300g per day. Actually I used to be 22% BMI with less than 300g (and doing 4 to 5 hours of gym per week).

    Now I eat 50g of carbs per day (and 140g of fat), doing 2 hours of gym per week, and I am featuring a stunning 9% BMI. I am not the only one here who can confirm how easily carbs are stored and on the contrary, how good it feels to be on fats.

    Just curious: let's say you eat 600 grams of carbs per day, which you claim to be safe. Where are those sugars all the time?

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    Quote Originally Posted by primal_alex View Post
    The average person gets fat with "just" 300g per day. Actually I used to be 22% BMI with less than 300g (and doing 4 to 5 hours of gym per week).?
    What's your point? You can gain fat on 50 grams of carbs as well if in a calorie surplus, but the fat stored on your body comes from dietary fat, except under some rather extreme circumstances...

    Quote Originally Posted by primal_alex View Post
    Just curious: let's say you eat 600 grams of carbs per day, which you claim to be safe. Where are those sugars all the time?
    And where have I claimed that to be "safe"? Try to read my postings above again! You will gain fat in a calorie surplus, true story...

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    Quote Originally Posted by sbhikes View Post
    Real fruitarians become emaciated. They also have chronic diarrhea and have to eat all the time. Even if they eat lots of nuts and avocados, they normally struggle to keep pure.
    I am not sure if chronic diarrhea hypothesis is true. I take a few days frutarian-break once in a while and i notice the opposite effect. My toilet times during those days are the best ever!
    Few but ripe.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Gorbag View Post
    What's your point? You can gain fat on 50 grams of carbs as well if in a calorie surplus, but the fat stored on your body comes from dietary fat, except under some rather extreme circumstances...



    And where have I claimed that to be "safe"? Try to read my postings above again! You will gain fat in a calorie surplus, true story...
    So is Mark wrong in his low-carb stance (when he posits that excess carbs tend to get stored as fat)? I, too, feel much better when adding starch and fruit to my diet, and can't wrap my head around Mark's belief that anything above 50g carbs per day will lead to "insidious weight gain" for anyone who doesn't run marathons.

    Two years ago, I was a calorie-counter getting at least 50% of my calories from carbs, and I was just as lean as I am today (on high-fat primal, albeit a frequently-hungry high-fat primal)

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    Quote Originally Posted by primal_alex View Post
    The average person gets fat with "just" 300g per day. Actually I used to be 22% BMI with less than 300g (and doing 4 to 5 hours of gym per week).
    300g of carbs a day is only 1,200 calories. The average person would starve to death consuming 300g of carbs a day.

    Now, bulk it with excess protein and fat and now you have an issue.

    It is entirely caloric. The Carbohydrate Curve is a lie. It doesn't exist. If lowering carbs helps you lose weight, it's only because you've made your food so unpalatable you no longer want to eat enough of it to make maintain your weight. Removing carbs removes food reward, so you eat less. Removing fat will do the same thing if not intensify the fat loss.
    Don't put your trust in anyone on this forum, including me. You are the key to your own success.

  8. #38
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    Quote Originally Posted by PrimalStudent View Post
    So is Mark wrong in his low-carb stance (when he posits that excess carbs tend to get stored as fat)? I, too, feel much better when adding starch and fruit to my diet, and can't wrap my head around Mark's belief that anything above 50g carbs per day will lead to "insidious weight gain" for anyone who doesn't run marathons.
    When you eat carbs, the fat you consume along with it is stored as fat - assuming you're eating a caloric excess, which is far more likely when you mix fat AND carbs since it triggers your brain to crave more food. Carbohydrate is very rarely stored as fat, and protein is even rarer. If you are gaining fat, it is almost always dietary fat being stored. The body doesn't store carbs as fat very well, but consuming carbs will slow fat burning, so any excess fat you consume sticks to your ribs more easily. If you're going to consume lots of carbs, it's best to keep fat low and vice versa to keep your brain from intensifying cravings.
    Don't put your trust in anyone on this forum, including me. You are the key to your own success.

  9. #39
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    Quote Originally Posted by PrimalStudent View Post
    So is Mark wrong in his low-carb stance (when he posits that excess carbs tend to get stored as fat)? I, too, feel much better when adding starch and fruit to my diet, and can't wrap my head around Mark's belief that anything above 50g carbs per day will lead to "insidious weight gain" for anyone who doesn't run marathons.
    There may be good reasons to go low carbs for a while on a diet since it blunt cravings for many people and make dieters eat less, but the statement; "excess carbs tend to get stored as fat" is incorrect as it stands, yes, what matters for weight loss is primarily whether you are in a calorie deficit or not. Dietary fat is the macronutrient that almost always ends up on your body, if in a calorie surplus...

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    Quote Originally Posted by primal_alex View Post
    Now I eat 50g of carbs per day (and 140g of fat), doing 2 hours of gym per week, and I am featuring a stunning 9% BMI.
    1. Your overall calorie intake when you are taking 50g carbs is probably much lower than when you were taking 300g (i doubt they were all "clean carbs"). Largely due to satiety effect of fat/protein that is replacing your lost carb.

    2. Being primal means you are eating toxin free and generally high quality foods. Therefore you "feel" better. Nothing to do with carb intake per se. I get the same feeling of well being during the days when i am eating only fruits.
    Few but ripe.

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