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  1. #31
    kenn's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by 0Angel0 View Post
    You are trying to pigeon hole the term into the narrow definition your political ideology allows. It's all fine and dandy when money flows to the top. When it farily flows both ways suddently it's "wealth redistribution" and "socialism". Typical conservative never letting facts get in the way of his opinion.



    I believe she said tax rate. Very different.
    Yes, I'm the one pigeon holing it to my political ideology.............right.....

    I'm not a conservative, you assumed wrong.
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  2. #32
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    I wrote an essay where I point out that "redistribution of wealth" is thrown around as though the idea of circulating wealth away from the owners-of-means-of-production and toward anyone beyond their scrooge mcduck tower hordes is some kind of abominable thought.

    But you are obviously using it in a specific context, ie, "using the State's monopoly on violence to plunder transferable wealth and then distributing it to their many agents and collaborators."
    "Ah, those endless forests, and their horror-haunted gloom! For what eternities have I wandered through them, a timid, hunted creature, starting at the least sound, frightened of my own shadow, keyed-up, ever alert and vigilant, ready on the instant to dash away in mad flight for my life. For I was the prey of all manner of fierce life that dwelt in the forest, and it was in ecstasies of fear that I fled before the hunting monsters."

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  3. #33
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    Quote Originally Posted by 0Angel0 View Post
    When it farily flows both ways suddently it's "wealth redistribution" and "socialism".
    That's the phrase right there that I have trouble with. Fairly (I'm assuming)? Who is deciding what a "fair" amount of money that should be taken from one person and given to another, whether that money is flowing up or down?

    I agree that tax loopholes should be closed, hence my love of a flat tax with no or very few exceptions, but who is the "ruler of all things" that would decide what a "fair" amount of my paycheck should be that "flows" to some other guy?

    And before you get all cranky, I'm blue collar, not wealthy, and donate a larger than average chunk of my paycheck to charities.
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  4. #34
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    Quote Originally Posted by RitaRose View Post
    That's the phrase right there that I have trouble with. Fairly (I'm assuming)? Who is deciding what a "fair" amount of money that should be taken from one person and given to another, whether that money is flowing up or down?

    I agree that tax loopholes should be closed, hence my love of a flat tax with no or very few exceptions, but who is the "ruler of all things" that would decide what a "fair" amount of my paycheck should be that "flows" to some other guy?

    And before you get all cranky, I'm blue collar, not wealthy, and donate a larger than average chunk of my paycheck to charities.
    What is fair is for society to decide and politicians to implement. At least that how it should work in a representative democracy such as the US. Your paycheck isn't flowing to anyone individually. Your tax money goes to a collective pool that is then distributed by the politicians we elect in a manner that, ideally, benefits everyone as a whole. My personal opinion is that tax breaks for oil companies who are making record profits are grossly unfair. As is a CEO's secretary paying a higher percentage of her income in taxes than the CEO. I could go on and on.

    The concern and anger over Welfare in the US is so irrational. It makes up such a small percentage of the actual budget but is one of the things people worry about most with respect to their tax dollars. I suggest we would be better served to stop worrying about whether or not people are buying Doritos with food stamps and start worrying about the amount of waste and fraud that goes in with Defense spending. Only because Defense is what actually takes a huge chunk of our tax dollars. That and corporate subsides which don't equal defense spending but are double that spent on welfare. The "some other guy" getting most of your tax dollars isn't the person on welfare!

    Quote Originally Posted by kenn View Post
    Yes, I'm the one pigeon holing it to my political ideology.............right.....
    You are.

    I'm not a conservative, you assumed wrong.
    You may not like to call yourself a conservative but you sure do talk like one. I can understand if you took offense. I would consider being called a conservative an insult. The difference is I don't parrot their talking points.

  5. #35
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    Quote Originally Posted by fifer View Post
    Anyway this is off topic. The study itself is interesting.
    It isn't really that off topic. What does the study mean when they say "wealth re-distribution"? Unless may tax money is being mailed in the form of a check right back to me with interest paid, it is "wealth re-distribution". I have bigger than average biceps. I believe taxation is theft. What category do I fit in? Are they lumping me in with Establishment Conservative types who support taxation so long as it is a flat tax, or so long as it is to support the military industrial complex or wall street? My guess is yes.

  6. #36
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    Poor guy, big-ish arms (not scrawny, never measured them to be honest), I favor redistribution only from among the uber-wealthy money-smoking hypocrites toward education of the poor to help them escape poverty, not free handouts. What we have are skilled fishermen who refuse to teach their fellow men how to fish, and make it a cultural point not to. The poor are kept ignorant intentionally, and that is the crime. Handouts won't fix that. Knowledge will.


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  7. #37
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    Quote Originally Posted by 0Angel0 View Post
    What is fair is for society to decide and politicians to implement. At least that how it should work in a representative democracy such as the US. Your paycheck isn't flowing to anyone individually. Your tax money goes to a collective pool that is then distributed by the politicians we elect in a manner that, ideally, benefits everyone as a whole. My personal opinion is that tax breaks for oil companies who are making record profits are grossly unfair. As is a CEO's secretary paying a higher percentage of her income in taxes than the CEO. I could go on and on.

    The concern and anger over Welfare in the US is so irrational. It makes up such a small percentage of the actual budget but is one of the things people worry about most with respect to their tax dollars. I suggest we would be better served to stop worrying about whether or not people are buying Doritos with food stamps and start worrying about the amount of waste and fraud that goes in with Defense spending. Only because Defense is what actually takes a huge chunk of our tax dollars. That and corporate subsides which don't equal defense spending but are double that spent on welfare. The "some other guy" getting most of your tax dollars isn't the person on welfare!



    You are.



    You may not like to call yourself a conservative but you sure do talk like one. I can understand if you took offense. I would consider being called a conservative an insult. The difference is I don't parrot their talking points.
    You're a clever troll, however, your lies are too transparent

    Medicaid, Medicare and Food stamps account for a significant part of federal and state budgets.

    I'm a Libertarian not a conservative
    Last edited by kenn; 05-21-2013 at 07:05 AM.
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  8. #38
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    Quote Originally Posted by canio6 View Post
    If the only step is voting it is not too difficult.
    Pretty easy to vote yourself stuff and make Others pay for it, sadly.

    Side note; in Ohio under the common core standards teachers will have to teach students that entitlements are rights granted by the government to them.

    /smh
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  9. #39
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    Quote Originally Posted by kenn View Post
    Pretty easy to vote yourself stuff and make Others pay for it, sadly.

    Side note; in Ohio under the common core standards teachers will have to teach students that entitlements are rights granted by the government to them.

    /smh
    Well, they are 'entitlements'

  10. #40
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    That's the phrase right there that I have trouble with. Fairly (I'm assuming)? Who is deciding what a "fair" amount of money that should be taken from one person and given to another, whether that money is flowing up or down?
    that's an easy one...

    the ones doing the buying and selling decide on a fair exchange. LOL the most fundamental and basic principles of market exchange really elude you?
    "Ah, those endless forests, and their horror-haunted gloom! For what eternities have I wandered through them, a timid, hunted creature, starting at the least sound, frightened of my own shadow, keyed-up, ever alert and vigilant, ready on the instant to dash away in mad flight for my life. For I was the prey of all manner of fierce life that dwelt in the forest, and it was in ecstasies of fear that I fled before the hunting monsters."

    Jack london, "Before Adam"

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