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Thread: Interested in Keto running page 2

  1. #11
    MaceyUK's Avatar
    MaceyUK is offline Senior Member
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    All aboard! For most it's probably best to train low carb and then carb up before the race. There are also some benefits to running with carbs as part of training I believe. I tried a carb run recently and noticed that my muscles couldn't deal with lactic acid build up on the hill sections....it's all very much about listening to your body and self-experimentation for me; I wouldn't want to recommend any rigid programme for any particular athlete as we all respond differently. That said training low carb takes some time and you do have to go through some pain at the start.

  2. #12
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    Thanks for your thoughts
    You suffered from lactic acid from the carbs or from not having enough

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  3. #13
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    Quote Originally Posted by MaceyUK View Post
    All aboard! For most it's probably best to train low carb and then carb up before the race. There are also some benefits to running with carbs as part of training I believe. I tried a carb run recently and noticed that my muscles couldn't deal with lactic acid build up on the hill sections....it's all very much about listening to your body and self-experimentation for me; I wouldn't want to recommend any rigid programme for any particular athlete as we all respond differently. That said training low carb takes some time and you do have to go through some pain at the start.

    Hi MaceyUK ,
    I have switchet to low carb on the first of may, so far everything is fine. Just my running is still not up to what it used to be. How long did it take you to run well on Keto?
    I am consuming about 20 net carbs a day. Is this too few carbs to train properly? I have a hilly half marathon in July and a Marathon later in the year. Right now after today's long run with a few hills thrown in I am doubting that I am doing the right thing here. My legs were heavy on the uphills. My heartrate seems to have gone up constantly. Is this normal and will it even out and improve?

  4. #14
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    My running isn't as fast as it could be either...that's just the trade off I'm afraid. Carbs are like petrol and fats are akin to diesel really. It is possible to go a half marathon carb free but I struggle with anything faster than 8 min miles and with hills. What it does do though is give you the confidence to run fast with some carbs on board knowing that you can keep going when they run out. As far as shedding body fat is concerned it is amazing. I used to do lots of miles and couldn't get rid of my abdominal fat...now I have to force myself to eat extra to keep weight on.
    I suggest you keep going but every 3rd week carb up on sweet potatoes or white rice and do some faster work, that way you get the benefits of training your metabolic pathways for both fuels and can have the confidence to do what you feel like doing without being a slave to gels etc. Our bodies respond in different ways but it's very educational to self experiment. Make sure that you are properly hydrated on low carb and take extra salt and potassium as you will need it. Bouillon is good and salty. Heartrate is hopefully your system trying to deliver more fats to the mitochondria in your muscles but could be due to pumping sludge if you are dehydrated.
    And Ray...your muscles get used to dealing with lactic acid but no carbs means no lactic acid so they lose the ability. I did some interval training this week (400m repeats)with some glycogen on board to kickstart the system again.

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    Thanks again Macey and that's what I was thinking less carbs,/ less lactic acid.
    Will coconut oil give you an energy boost during your distance events? I was curious because of it being a MCFA and is converted easily into Ketones. I use it in the morning as a kick start and as a mid meal snacks and I do notice that even on 18 hr IF I have plenty of energy to do manual labor.

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  6. #16
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    Hi Macey,

    thanks so much for your suggestions. Still so much to learn... I have the feeling that I have to relearn everything with the switch to low carb. I am on 20 g carbs a day and will add 5g every week and try to find out how many carbs I can tolerate. As I am doing some kind of exercise nearly every day, maybe my liver canīt produce glucose quickly enough and I end up running out of energy during hill runs?! Maybe my am eating way to little carbs to keep up with my workouts? I know Phinney says that you can workout on as little as 20 g of carbs, but well, I donīt seem to be getting anywhere near the level I could obtain before. And that sucks big time. I am usually running 3-4 days a week and try to get in 2-3 times Bodypump or circle training a week for strenght.
    So you are carbing up every third week to get some quality speed session in? Is this done the evening before or directly before a workout? How many g of carbs should I consume for this carb up??
    Now for the really interesting stuff... Are you eating more carbs before your long run? And would you mind letting me know how many carbs you eat per day - pretty please.

    Thank you so much for helping a newbie!

  7. #17
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    Hi Nic, I don't weigh out carbs or anything else for that matter. Some of my long runs I do with just whatever glycogen happens to be left in my muscles and some runs I deplete the day before with a 50min session on the elliptical cross trainer just so I can run without any. If I am going to get some carbs inside me I eat rice noodles in tom yum soup (with prawns and mushrooms) as I really love noodle soup! Maybe I will eat a sweet potato or a baked potato as well. This will do me fine for an hour workout maybe 7 miles with some hills or a faster session on the track. I am not very scientific about it as I believe that a large element of living paleo/primal is surprising your body and mixing it up just like our ancestors would have had to.
    When I look at what you are doing I suspect that you are pushing it too hard and overtraining. Maybe you could do a long run, low carb and stop off for a little ten minute refuel picnic before carrying on and keep yourself to ten minute miles and the next run eat a jacket potato the night before and have some yoghurt and banana before you run to observe the difference in how you feel and your pace. The human body is a long way from being a machine and you have to listen to what your body is telling you. Yesterday I was going to go out for a run and my heart wasn't in it so I listened to Daft Punk's new album and had myself a lovely dose of relaxation. Today I am really up for pushing it.....Enjoy your running and enjoy feeling how your body responds to the different challenges that you send its way

  8. #18
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    Quote Originally Posted by RayDWeger View Post
    Thanks again Macey and that's what I was thinking less carbs,/ less lactic acid.
    Will coconut oil give you an energy boost during your distance events? I was curious because of it being a MCFA and is converted easily into Ketones. I use it in the morning as a kick start and as a mid meal snacks and I do notice that even on 18 hr IF I have plenty of energy to do manual labor.

    Sent from my EVO using Marks Daily Apple Forum mobile app
    MCT from coconut oil is easily absorbed and utilised, I believe that it gets the engine running on diesel (fat). If I miss my morning shake I feel sluggish and underfed. Ketones are progressively more easily manufactured the more you persuade your cells to do without sugar. I am of the opinion that Medium chain triglycerides are really helpful in the process and I include them as a fuel source. I think of them as a halfway house between easily used glucose and less preferentially used triglycerides from adipose cells or diet.

  9. #19
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    I'm also interested in the PDF, if anyone still has it? I would appreciate it very much if someone can give me the link! because I'm running a half marathon on 1 sept, and I've been on less than 50g carbs a day for the past week or so, and following the paleo diet since January, but can't seem to get to the Keto stage where you have loads of energy and all.

    Any help is gladly appreciated!

  10. #20
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    Best way to figure out whether you're in nutritional ketosis is to purchase a Blood Ketone meter because it's more accurate than the pee stick. You can go to American Diabetes Warehouse online and get one, plus some ketone sticks at about $2.30 each (comes in a box of 10)

    I'm in the process of figuring out how many carbs will keep me between 1.0 - 3.0 (0.5-3.0 is nutritional ketosis). I've maintained a 0.7 this week on less than 10 grams. I hope I can get in a groove of 30 grams a day.

    As far as 'loads of energy', I would think of it as a steady supply of energy. Expending glycogen gives a better feeling than fatty acids, but, boy, when you're out of glycogen that better feeling evaporates. Fatty acids keep on supplying energy long after the glycogen is gone in other people.

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