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Thread: Backing Up on Paleo page 7

  1. #61
    cori93437's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Timthetaco View Post
    I must have been dreaming all those times I read about women losing their period on this very forum. But it's not low carb's fault, they just weren't eating enough, despite the profound satiating effect of ketosis. They should have just eaten beyond the point of satiation.
    No, it is not low carbs fault.

    It's caloric restriction/eating below BMR for too longs fault. And that can happen on any diet.
    I've known more women who've lost their periods on CW HCLF and very low cal. I've seen women/girls doing that to themselves since I was in high school 25 years ago. I promise you none of them had ever heard of Low Carb. They were just eating extremely little in the way of food/calories.

    Low carb and the satiation it provides is simply a tool that people can use to help them moderate their caloric intake, but they still need to be mindful of the effect that eating too little can have.
    It distresses me to sometimes see people in the mindset that losing weight faster is better, which invariably means lower cal than they could do if they would accept a slow steady weight loss in the more normal range of 1-2 lb a week. And also the mindset that they need constant linear weight loss for large amounts of weight... say they want to lose 60lbs in 6months. Maybe they can, but it's just not a healthy goal IMO. But I've certainly seen people who push, and push, at such things with constant restriction. Or even try for months and months on end to budge those last 5 vanity lbs with constant caloric restriction + increased training.

    Again, not the fault of "low carb". It is completely possible to play with the carb level you eat to get both satiation and an appropriate number of calories, and abundant vegetables per day.
    The fact that some people go to extremes... is just that. Some people.
    Some people will go to extremes on any diet.

    Low carb offers other benefits to other people for specific reasons as well, but that is not what is being discussed just here, and/or already has been(brain issues), so I'm not going to bring it up.

    In case anyone is interested switching to HFLC actually helped my period become regular again after several years of it being completely random and skipping months. I also no longer have PMS when it shows up, nor cramps.
    I suspect my hormones have improved quite a bit.
    So there are obviously different results.
    Last edited by cori93437; 05-04-2013 at 10:50 AM.
    “You have your way. I have my way. As for the right way, the correct way, and the only way, it does not exist.”
    ~Friedrich Nietzsche
    And that's why I'm here eating HFLC Primal/Paleo.


  2. #62
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    Quote Originally Posted by Timthetaco View Post
    I don't know, Katherine, I don't make a habit of counting the people I see struggling with low carb. I'm not compiling a database. You can live in your comfortable paleo bubble all you want, but that's not going to change the fact that lots of people struggle on "the diet we evolved to eat". Guess who wrote this:
    A woman named Stephanie Ruper, who I never heard of. Was I supposed to have? Am I supposed to be psychic?

    If you want to think I live in a bubble because I don't jump up and down and point fingers each month when I see one woman mention she is underweight and has lost her period, that's your opinion. I think a lot of guys totally lose perspective when they are on this site.

    Yep, my own personal powers of observation tell me that I really have only been seeing about 1 woman a month mention this, and it's usually in the context of "my pre-existing eating disorders" or "my longterm problems with amennorrhea". My powers of deduction tell me that would be about 12 women a year, providing of course each monthly post is by a unique poster, which isn't always the case.

    That is not significant, especially since your classifying all of these posters as "struggling with low carb" is something you have chosen to do on your own in order to increase the count that are having difficulty because you think they ought to be.

  3. #63
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    Quote Originally Posted by cori93437 View Post
    It's caloric restriction/eating below BMR for too longs fault. And that can happen on any diet.

    Again, not the fault of "low carb". It is completely possible to play with the carb level you eat to get both satiation and an appropriate number of calories, and abundant vegetables per day.
    The fact that some people go to extremes... is just that. Some people.
    Some people will go to extremes on any diet.
    It can happen easier on VLC. Like I said, it has a profound effect on satiation to the point where some people have to eat exactly zero times a day to maintain their energy. I find the defense of ketosis in this context very ironic. If you had a friend that was eating a low calorie vegan diet and lost her period, you would do anything in your power to convince her to change her way of eating so she could be healthy again. But just because it's low carb, and everybody knows low carb is super healthy, there's no possible way the only variable missing from the equation is glucose. You just need to eat more! ... even though you don't want to.

    Also, I'm interested to know whether low carb slows down your metabolism as an adaptive strategy which improves longevity, or if it speeds up the metabolism and allows people to lose weight faster, giving them a "metabolic advantage." You can't have it both ways. Sorry if I constantly deride the way of eating that allowed you to regain your health, but the dogmatic approach to dieting I see around here can prevent others from regaining theirs.

  4. #64
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    Quote Originally Posted by Timthetaco View Post
    ...the dogmatic approach to dieting I see around here can prevent others from regaining theirs.
    The dogmatic approach you propose is not all that much different from an eating disorder. The idea that there are thousands of people on the forum, mostly women, who are obsessed with eating a carb-free diet and are trying to force everyone to do it too is just bizarre.

  5. #65
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    Quote Originally Posted by eKatherine View Post
    That is not significant, especially since your classifying all of these posters as "struggling with low carb" is something you have chosen to do on your own in order to increase the count that are having difficulty because you think they ought to be.
    There's that bubble I was talking about. Ever heard of Matt Stone, Anthony Colpo, or Evelyn Kocur? Three people who have extensive experience helping sick and eating disordered low carb dieters live healthy lives again.

    I feel no need to defend low carb with the zeal of a hardcore vegan. I recognize its utility in some circumstances, and I also recognize its downfalls.

  6. #66
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    Quote Originally Posted by Timthetaco View Post
    It can happen easier on VLC. Like I said, it has a profound effect on satiation to the point where some people have to eat exactly zero times a day to maintain their energy. I find the defense of ketosis in this context very ironic. If you had a friend that was eating a low calorie vegan diet and lost her period, you would do anything in your power to convince her to change her way of eating so she could be healthy again. But just because it's low carb, and everybody knows low carb is super healthy, there's no possible way the only variable missing from the equation is glucose. You just need to eat more! ... even though you don't want to.

    Also, I'm interested to know whether low carb slows down your metabolism as an adaptive strategy which improves longevity, or if it speeds up the metabolism and allows people to lose weight faster, giving them a "metabolic advantage." You can't have it both ways. Sorry if I constantly deride the way of eating that allowed you to regain your health, but the dogmatic approach to dieting I see around here can prevent others from regaining theirs.
    If I had a friend on any diet that was using that diet in a way that was harmful I would try to counsel them toward changes. Period. (no pun intented)

    I do not have any notions of HFLC being a magic bullet.
    It's a tool.
    I do not think it "speeds up metabolism" nor "slows down metabolism" it's simply an adaptation that is a benefit to humans in certain situations. And it provides the brain with relief if there are certain medical issues.

    I'm anything but dogmatic. Different diets work for different people just like different medications a doctor gives can react very differently in two different people.
    “You have your way. I have my way. As for the right way, the correct way, and the only way, it does not exist.”
    ~Friedrich Nietzsche
    And that's why I'm here eating HFLC Primal/Paleo.


  7. #67
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    Quote Originally Posted by eKatherine View Post
    The dogmatic approach you propose is not all that much different from an eating disorder. The idea that there are thousands of people on the forum, mostly women, who are obsessed with eating a carb-free diet and are trying to force everyone to do it too is just bizarre.
    I would never imply that there are women on here obsessed with eating a no-carb diet. Ask all those women in the Nutritional Ketosis challenge threads. Nobody's coercing anyone into eating a low carb diet, but look in all the threads of people struggling and count the posts that recommend adding starch to their diet. It's the absolute last recommendation most people make, and sometimes it's never recommended. You don't need carbs, you just have candida. Wait, adrenal fatigue. No, are you fasting? You should fast, and take phosphatidylserine! Why? I dunno. Just don't eat carbs.

  8. #68
    eKatherine's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Timthetaco View Post
    There's that bubble I was talking about. Ever heard of Matt Stone, Anthony Colpo, or Evelyn Kocur? Three people who have extensive experience helping sick and eating disordered low carb dieters live healthy lives again.
    I could no doubt come up with dozens of names of experts in their fields who you have never heard of, thus proving beyond a doubt that you lead a shallow, narrow life.

    It must make you feel really, really good to be better informed than 99.999999% of the population. I bet you're the life of the party, telling everybody to stop listening to their bodies and eat what you tell them to, or else.

  9. #69
    cori93437's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Timthetaco View Post
    There's that bubble I was talking about. Ever heard of Matt Stone, Anthony Colpo, or Evelyn Kocur? Three people who have extensive experience helping sick and eating disordered low carb dieters live healthy lives again.

    I feel no need to defend low carb with the zeal of a hardcore vegan. I recognize its utility in some circumstances, and I also recognize its downfalls.
    Yep, heard of them... but I eat HFLC because it works for me.
    (And I have blood work done frequently to check markers that Choco is always saying will be out of whack. They are always fine)
    My health is fine. And I really don't promote it, except to say... why bash it?
    Different strikes for different folks.

    Quote Originally Posted by Timthetaco View Post
    I would never imply that there are women on here obsessed with eating a no-carb diet. Ask all those women in the Nutritional Ketosis challenge threads. Nobody's coercing anyone into eating a low carb diet, but look in all the threads of people struggling and count the posts that recommend adding starch to their diet. It's the absolute last recommendation most people make, and sometimes it's never recommended. You don't need carbs, you just have candida. Wait, adrenal fatigue. No, are you fasting? You should fast, and take phosphatidylserine! Why? I dunno. Just don't eat carbs.
    I think you have become myopic.
    In most of the threads I open one of the first suggestions is always "eat some potatoes" or "eat some carbs"
    Heck, I've said it.
    I've even directed women OUT if the "Ketosis" threads.
    As have other members of those threads.
    So...
    It's not really what you think it is.
    And everyone in those threads is told that they need to maintain their calories... not just eat a lot of fat and then "eat only when hungry". The basis of those threads is tracking your inputs carefully so that you don't run into trouble.
    Still. It doesn't work for everyone.
    No one ever said it does.
    “You have your way. I have my way. As for the right way, the correct way, and the only way, it does not exist.”
    ~Friedrich Nietzsche
    And that's why I'm here eating HFLC Primal/Paleo.


  10. #70
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    [QUOTE=Timthetaco;1180512] Ever heard of Matt Stone, Anthony Colpo, or Evelyn Kocur? Three people who have extensive experience helping sick and eating disordered low carb dieters live healthy lives again.

    I do not know these people but I will be googling them ASAP. I am one of those LC'ers who went that direction in order to contain disordered eating. I am physically healthy, but man, I want to be emotionally healed. Thanks for dropping the reference amidst the debating....

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