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Thread: Articles on the efficacy of weight training for women? page 5

  1. #41
    eKatherine's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Neckhammer View Post
    I think he's basically talking about this

    What the female body looks like at different body fat percentages

    15% vs 15% picture particularly.

    Really I encourage my wife to lift some weights cause lean mass is healthy and it promotes metabolic fitness. No other reason needed for me.
    Actually, that's exactly what I'm referring to as well. The woman at 30% is not going to look leaner if she puts on 20 pounds of muscle while keeping her body fat layer the same. She's going to look bulky. The chart doesn't show large numbers of women who are carrying different amounts of muscle mass.

    15% is highly atypical, and has nothing to do with "average body fat".

    That's why women won't exercise hard. Because they have guys telling them they need to gain weight and increase dress size from large to XL or even larger. It's no wonder women won't listen to men who date skinny women and turn around and tell women whose goal is to stop being so fat that they should gain weight.
    Last edited by eKatherine; 04-23-2013 at 05:43 PM.

  2. #42
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    ^ I gotcha. Yeah, your right with regards to someone whose carrying that layer already. More muscle will simply make them more bulky.

  3. #43
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    Quote Originally Posted by cayla29s View Post
    No this isn't true. If two people have the same 25% BF, the one with more muscle will not look leaner in fact she will look bulkier. If we are using the 25% picture on leangains depending on the height of the person and body composition the more muscular person almost always look thicker. Just take a look at gymnast, they certainly carry quite a bit of muscle mass but if you put them at 25% BF, then they look really bulky.

    I know this to be true for myself. I have enough muscle mass for my liking. I would classify myself in the 20-22% BF and if I were 10 lbs heavier, I look really thick especially my thighs and arms. One needs to shed the excess BF in order to see muscle definition and this goes for both men and women.
    You're confusing size with definition. You can be big and defined, just like you can be slim and soft.

  4. #44
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    Quote Originally Posted by eKatherine View Post
    Actually, that's exactly what I'm referring to as well. The woman at 30% is not going to look leaner if she puts on 20 pounds of muscle while keeping her body fat layer the same. She's going to look bulky. The chart doesn't show large numbers of women who are carrying different amounts of muscle mass.
    See my post above.

    Quote Originally Posted by eKatherine View Post
    15% is highly atypical, and has nothing to do with "average body fat".

    That's why women won't exercise hard. Because they have guys telling them they need to gain weight and increase dress size from large to XL or even larger. It's no wonder women won't listen to men who date skinny women and turn around and tell women whose goal is to stop being so fat that they should gain weight.
    I'm sorry but this is just complete rubbish. The vast majority of men and women who care about looks are obsessed with "abs" and being skinny. I don't know where you're finding these all these men with skinny girlfriends that are telling overweight women to become even more overweight and just lift weights.

    You've also warped and twisted my point into something that's neither my point, nor has much to do with the discussion. I'm not saying that if a woman has a lot of body fat, all she needs to do is some deadlifts and she will look perfect. I'm also not saying that big muscles on a woman will give her six-pack abs. What I am saying is women are, generally, afraid of muscle, and that I, as one guy on a forum giving his opinion, think that muscle makes women look better and that they should stop worrying so much about being skinny and just losing body fat, and that working with heavy weights will have a positive impact on how they look and feel. That's all that I am saying.

  5. #45
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    Quote Originally Posted by quikky View Post
    See my post above.
    I did. And it is rubbish. The idea that a woman with 30% bodyfat is going to be "defined" if she puts on an unnatural amount of muscle is absurd.

    I'm sorry but this is just complete rubbish. The vast majority of men and women who care about looks are obsessed with "abs" and being skinny. I don't know where you're finding these all these men with skinny girlfriends that are telling overweight women to become even more overweight and just lift weights.
    Women are not obsessed with "abs". They don't care about them at all. They would prefer not to have theirs show. It is guys who are obsessed with abs.

    I admit I don't know whether your other half is hefty or lean. But right here you are the one who is using an example of a borderline obese woman who you think would look lots better if she remained obese but put on as much muscle as a guy would put on.

    You've also warped and twisted my point into something that's neither my point, nor has much to do with the discussion. I'm not saying that if a woman has a lot of body fat, all she needs to do is some deadlifts and she will look perfect.
    Could have fooled me. That "average" woman who you want to put on 20 pounds of muscle could have up to 31% body fat, which would make her clinically obese.

    I'm also not saying that big muscles on a woman will give her six-pack abs.
    You keep bringing up abs and women, as though you think women want 6 pack abs.

    What I am saying is women are, generally, afraid of muscle, and that I, as one guy on a forum giving his opinion, think that muscle makes women look better and that they should stop worrying so much about being skinny and just losing body fat, and that working with heavy weights will have a positive impact on how they look and feel. That's all that I am saying.
    Women are afraid of looking bulky, which could happen to the average woman if she puts on muscle without losing excess body fat, given that the average woman is overweight or even obese. They've probably experienced working out for endless hours and putting on weight. But given the choice of being lean and muscular, they'd choose that over obesity any day. If it was really a choice.

    When I was a size 2X, I don't think putting on 20 pounds of muscle would have improved my enjoyment of life. If I'd had a real option of becoming lean (20%) and muscular, I'd have jumped at it. Hey, I did, and I'm almost there.

  6. #46
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    Quote Originally Posted by eKatherine View Post
    I did. And it is rubbish. The idea that a woman with 30% bodyfat is going to be "defined" if she puts on an unnatural amount of muscle is absurd.
    You turn my arguments into your own version of them and then beat your own version. Two women of the same body fat, but one with more lean body mass will look more defined. There's a difference between "more defined" and "defined" period.

    Quote Originally Posted by eKatherine View Post
    Women are not obsessed with "abs". They don't care about them at all. They would prefer not to have theirs show. It is guys who are obsessed with abs.

    I admit I don't know whether your other half is hefty or lean. But right here you are the one who is using an example of a borderline obese woman who you think would look lots better if she remained obese but put on as much muscle as a guy would put on.
    Abs is in reference to being very lean, both sexes are obsessed with it.

    I am not using that example, you're using that example. I made my point pretty clear and it is not what you just said.

    Quote Originally Posted by eKatherine View Post
    Could have fooled me. That "average" woman who you want to put on 20 pounds of muscle could have up to 31% body fat, which would make her clinically obese.
    Once again, you keep bringing this up, and once again, you are twisting my point into the extreme, and beating your version of the extreme. I am not saying an obese woman will become lean by lifting weights and staying obese, you are saying that and arguing against it.

    Quote Originally Posted by eKatherine View Post
    Women are afraid of looking bulky, which could happen to the average woman if she puts on muscle without losing excess body fat, given that the average woman is overweight or even obese. They've probably experienced working out for endless hours and putting on weight. But given the choice of being lean and muscular, they'd choose that over obesity any day. If it was really a choice.

    When I was a size 2X, I don't think putting on 20 pounds of muscle would have improved my enjoyment of life. If I'd had a real option of becoming lean (20%) and muscular, I'd have jumped at it. Hey, I did, and I'm almost there.
    This is exactly why women are afraid of weights.

  7. #47
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    You are saying that a woman who is average in body fat (25-31%) who adds 20 pounds of muscle, a whole lot of muscle for a woman to add, is going to look leaner. That is your opinion, and it is pure conjecture that her body fat will not be mostly obscuring those attractive muscles.
    The 20lbs of muscle will likely have a better shape even if she is heavier. No, she may not look at all lean, but she will look less blobbish. It's putting shape under the fat. Not ideal, but better than no shape under the fat. I also can't imagine many women will gain 20 lbs of muscle and not also lose some fat.

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  8. #48
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    I'd rather look bulky than blobbish....

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  9. #49
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    I've been kind of out of the internet loop for a few days, but I just returned to see if I had gotten any responses. 5 pages? Wow, I'm sure that some of this is general internet bickering about something or other, but for all who provided links/ideas/insight, thank you. I'm going to actually read the thread now.

  10. #50
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    Oh wow, so it seems I opened up a whole can (or maybe like 6 cans) of worms here. I guess I should clarify that what I would really love to see happen is for both of my friends to succeed with some kind of fitness plan. One of them is pretty overweight and the other is quite obese and I worry about her health. I've seen both of them try different fitness/diet plans but never stick to anything. I have found that heavy lifting is by the far the easiest fitness routine to stick to because it requires so little time and effort. (OK, it may take a lot of effort to push big weights, but it is over pretty quick. I have found that I never dread heavy lifting workouts the way I used to dread intense cardio or some type of crossfit/p90x type "ass-kicker" workout.)
    I'd love for my friends to reap some of the health, confidence, and energy benefits that come from getting stronger, and I think they're both in the mindset of not worrying too much about what their bodies look like, but valuing being strong and capable.
    That all being said, I don't think I really considered what it means for me (ya, a man) to go to them with grand plans and internet links to stories about women like Staci (impressive, gorgeous, inspiring, but probably not attainable by most). I hadn't really considered that they may react like Leida and think that I'm trying to tell them how to be. I guess I'm trying to say that I con't care about their looks, I just want them to be healthy and enjoy life as much as possible because I love them. I'm no Adonis myself, I love to drink and my 80/20 is more like 50/50 (and even when it was 90/10 I didn't look much different), but lifting big ass weights has allowed me to feel fit and vibrant even when my diet is lacking. I just want to share that joy.
    OK, sorry. rambling ends....now!

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