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Thread: Rippetoe's New Article - Must Read If You Have Strength Questions page 9

  1. #81
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    Quote Originally Posted by RichMahogany View Post

    How did person A manage to get so strong? Was he raised by Chimpanzees and he grew up brachiating through the trees? Or did he challenge his CNS via progressive overload?
    Gentlemen... I believe we have a breakthrough...

    (the real answer is, he got strong by doing inverted deadlifts, because only the bar can get you strong)
    I used to seriously post here, now I prefer to troll.

  2. #82
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    Quote Originally Posted by iniQuity View Post
    According to the internet, the 500 pound bencher has a bigger dick. That we know for sure.
    Indeed! Years ago I assisted in doing some unusual tests on weightlifters, among them top powerlifters. I remember that especially the powerlifters sucked in chinups, and none of them managed to do a one arm chinup, even if they according to themselves are "the strongest pullers on the planet."

  3. #83
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    Quote Originally Posted by iniQuity View Post
    Why are you avoiding the question? Don't change the hypothetical. Just say that a guy that can't DL 200 with fat gripz is weaker than the guy that can. Just say it. I need this victory. I need to win. Give me the win. Do it. 1, 2, 3, say it.
    The guy who can DL 200# with Fat Gripz is likely stronger. Because he can probably DL 300 without the Fat Gripz.

    Quote Originally Posted by iniQuity View Post
    I didn't read the articles, but I'm going to say fine, they must train with bar-bells but it would be suicide to step onto the competition itself without having properly practiced the movements, which are in and of themselves, very taxing "lifts."
    Yeah duh. Nobody ever claimed that being strong alone is enough to make you successful in any sport. Of course you have to be able to perform the movements/lifts/whatever.

    None of this refutes the argument that the optimal way to get as strong as possible as efficiently as possible is to progressively overload full-ROM, compound movements, like the squat, deadlift, and press. And the best tool yet invented to progressively overload full-ROM compound movements like the squat, deadlift, and press is the barbell.

  4. #84
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    Quote Originally Posted by RichMahogany View Post
    None of this refutes the argument that the optimal way to get as strong as possible as efficiently as possible is to progressively overload full-ROM, compound movements, like the squat, deadlift, and press. And the best tool yet invented to progressively overload full-ROM compound movements like the squat, deadlift, and press is the barbell.
    See, I don't think anybody is trying to refute that at all. I certainly am not.

    I do think gymnastic upper body development is superior to what can be accomplished with barbells. We could argue that one if you want. We're on the same team for the lower body.

    I just noticed you also mentioned the press. Ah well.
    I used to seriously post here, now I prefer to troll.

  5. #85
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    Quote Originally Posted by iniQuity View Post
    See, I don't think anybody is trying to refute that at all. I certainly am not.

    I do think gymnastic upper body development is superior to what can be accomplished with barbells. We could argue that one if you want. We're on the same team for the lower body.

    I just noticed you also mentioned the press. Ah well.
    The standing press isn't solely an upper body movement though. It incorporates all the muscles that stabilize the trunk, to a large extent, and the legs in an isometric fashion, to a much smaller extent. Still qualifies as a full body lift in my book.

    And even Rip's novice programming includes chinups. He's also stated that dips are a borderline "main" exercise (as opposed to an accessory exercise). Personally, I program my weighted chin-/pull-ups and dips according to the same framework as my squats, deadlifts, presses, and bench presses.

    The point of the Rippetoe article was that strength is useful, general, and best created by sticking to progressively increasing your ability to perform the basic, main, compound lifts, and programming them correctly, not "tricking" or "confusing" your muscles by doing squats one week, bulgarian split squats the next, bosu ball goblet squats the next, and seated leg press the next.

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    I'm reading this via my phone, so instead of typing up another response I'll just say I agree with everything Rich said.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Gorbag View Post
    Indeed! Years ago I assisted in doing some unusual tests on weightlifters, among them top powerlifters. I remember that especially the powerlifters sucked in chinups, and none of them managed to do a one arm chinup, even if they according to themselves are "the strongest pullers on the planet."
    You know pull/chin-up strength is relative to bodyweight, right? A 200lb person that can do 10 pull-ups is stronger than a 150lb person that can do 10, even though it's the same number of reps. The powerlifters still have more pulling strength. However, I'd you compete in the heaviest weight classes, you will be quite heavy. I mean doing chin-ups when toy weigh 280lb is no easy feat.

    Better comparison would be if you tied a rope around a pulley with weight on the other end, and see who could pull more weight below their chin. I'd bet my money on the fat powerlifter.

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    Quote Originally Posted by quikky View Post
    Yeah, and since doing compound barbell lifts trains all the major muscle mass on the body, the strength gained has direct carryover to life.
    No, only an indirect potential for a carryover to real life situations if you have grown relevant muscle fibers! If you can stimulate and grow the same muscle fibers with other movement you get the same potential carryover to life. Another thing is that heavy barbell compound for some people may be the most optimal muscle stimulus, but not for everybody. Personally my lower back get far more impact than my quadriceps when doing squats, so if I want to get more stimulus of lower thighs, I must do leg press instead.

    I also disagree with Rippetoe about "assistant movements" like dumbbell curls or laterals, they don't need to be easy isolation movements, but can be relative heavy compound exercises as well! Ever tried heavy overload dumbbell cheating curls, using the whole body? Pick some 80 or 90 pounds dumbbells and do alternate standing curls with a supinated grip moving your hips explosive to get up the weight and slow down on the eccentric. When you can’t do any more reps, change to a hammer position and do cheating hammer-curl for at least 10 more reps! This exercise is a movement that works pretty much the whole body, and you can progress up to the really heavy dumbbells 150 -200 pound if you like, and you may feel sore in your whole body the day after…

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    A guy that can squat 300 pounds will have no trouble doing pistol squats. A guy that only does pistol squats will probably need an ambulance if he tries to do a 300 pound squat. Being stronger makes everything you do easier.
    Some of you may die, but that is a risk I'm willing to take.

  10. #90
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    Quote Originally Posted by quikky View Post
    You know pull/chin-up strength is relative to bodyweight, right?
    I can tell you for sure that also a 150 pound powerlifter sucks in doing one armed chins from a dead position, if he have not trained especially for doing just that. It only confirms that "strength" is spesific and that we compares apples and oranges by comparing the "strength" of a gymnast and the "strength" of a weigthlifter...

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