Interpret my CDSA Results? Leaky Gut and CFS
Hey guys my name is Eric Im currently 25 years old and have been dealing with serious food sensitivity / allergy /CFS for the past 2 years. Prior to this, i had zero problems and was able to eat anything i wanted.
So ive been working with an alternative clinic by me so i could get a CDSA done as my GP wouldnt order one for me. However, the doctors on staff are terrible and ive decided to no longer work with them. Luckily i got my test results back and i was hoping maybe you guys could take a look and let me know what you think. Im not entirely sure how one fixes something like this..
I have undigested Meat and Vegetable fibers in my stool. Meat fibers listed as "outside" were marked as "rare" and Vegetable fibers marked as "inside" were also marked as "rare".
As for Absorption:
Triglycerides were in the reference range.
Long Chain Fatty Acids were way outside the range scoring 32.6 with the range being 1.3 - 23.7
Cholesterol was also outside the range
Phospholipids again, outside the range.
Fecal fat was way outside the range as well.
My thoughts are that im not digesting very well. Im going to start supplementing with digestive enzymes and HCL to help my digestion and absorption but i think the real problem lies in my gut.
So all of my metabolic markers were inside the range aside from Beta-Glucuronidase being WAY outside of the range. I will get into this further but it more or less explains A LOT OF my symptoms.
This is where i need your guys help:
For beneficial bacteria, both Lactobacillus species and Bifidobacterium were listed as "non growing" With only the Escherichia coli listed as "4+" which is apparently where it should be.
Under additional bacteria, i had 2 types of bacteria listed as Non-Pathogen but then i have a +4 in Bacillus Species listed as "Possible Pathogen"
Just for an FYI, i am totally clear of Candida, which is a huge sigh of relief for me.
So here is where things start making sense. I have had symptoms of high estrogen and my sex drive has been really erratic. Ive also had serious fatigue issues and i developed serious food sensitivity out of nowhere. Beta-glucuronidase apparently is what the liver converts estrogen into, and it gets excreted as waste by the body, but in cases like mine where you have a lot of excess, it gets reabsorbed by the body as estrogen. This also affects cortisol levels, which affect the adrenals which explains my food sensitivity!
Beta-glucuronidase gets suppressed by bifidobacteria and lactobacillus, both of which im listed as having "non growing"
So what should i do first? Im missing two beneficial bacteria and i have an over growth of bad bacteria. Do i address the bad bacteria first and then work on trying to re-populate the gut?
Ive read on here that its impossible to repopulate the gut once bacteria is lost, am i just shit out of luck barring some kind of fecal transplant?
Do i rid the bacteria, try and heal the gut with gut supporting supplements and then try and establish a gut ecology again?
I have no idea what order to do things, please help!
and sorry about all the words.
I think you should start with the digestion. The rest may work itself out and is sometimes a side effect of poor stomach acid (not enough or too much, likely not enough in your case). Start with the digestive supplements and HCL and see where that takes you. Make sure you are taking in a good source of probiotics, including the two missing bacteria types, and the "bad" stuff will likely get sorted out as well. The gut is supposed to be pretty much self regulating. I don't think you need to worry about killing off bad bacteria that much.
Originally Posted by namelesswonder
I was going to start there myself, HCL and digestive enzymes with every meal to help with my digestion / absorption, so im glad someone thinks like me to start at the top of the chain haha.
My biggest confusion comes from reading so many reports that probiotics do not grow in the human gut once they are wiped out by anti biotics and poor lifestyle choices. So im almost worried that maybe i will never be able to repopulate my gut and get my CFS and immune system under control. As it stands right now, the only way i have a normal day is by eating strict paleo and zero carbs :/
The gut is self regulating but im wondering if the balance can be restored after a few years of damage has already been done? I would continue to work with this alternative clinic but for instance yesterday they refused to give me a print out of my CDSA because i "wouldnt understand it" and after a brief 5 minute conversation about how i need to detox (without any information on my current diet and nutrition plan) he told me to see him next week. Mind you, the visits are 150 a piece, all out of pocket, so you can see why im desperately trying to remedy this myself!
Definitely understand! If they refuse to give you a print-out, threaten legal action. I'm pretty sure there's no way they can legally keep it from you and a threat should be enough.
I would suggest that you look for a paleo doctor or an office with a focus in holistic medicine to review the results with you.
Paleo Physicians Network
I would go about it differently. Eat a strict paleo (no dairy & no alcohol) diet for 3 months. At the same time take a good probiotic and a good Omega-3 with every meal. At least every other day eat a prebiotic (a partially pre-digested food, such as sauerkraut or kimchi), if not more often. (The good bacteria will be in the probiotic.)
Keep a very well balanced paleo diet. Get 8 hours sleep per night. Exercise primally. Take a very good multi-vitamin,mineral, antioxident.
Then have the test repeated after 3 months.
This worked for me and I think I was a lot sicker that you are now. My digestion had not been good for 6-8 years and finally was quitting altogether. It would be interesting for you to keep a journal not only of what you eat but also of the changes in your body and it's responses.
After an anti-biotic course, probiotics and prebiotics are absolutely required to re-populate your stomach and intestines as soon as possible. Bacteria will populate it anyway and you're way ahead when you choose to populate it with good bacteria.
The action of intestenal bacteria on food creates enzymes, as does your G.I. system. Therefore, adding enzymes is effecting the end of the process rather than the beginning, so to speak.
You will get loads of advice and support here, choose what you think will be best for your body.
Last edited by Cryptocode; 04-12-2013 at 09:39 PM.
Hi. I was in a similar state to you - HMS aka EDS type 3 is my problem but lots of similar symptoms - immune system completely out of order, terrible digestive issues, extreme fatigue. I just want to reassure you that by removing the bad and adding in the good you really can turn things around. My gut was in a really appalling state. If you want to a success story to cheer you up, read my "Hello" thread. It's only been a matter of months, and tbh it only took a few strict weeks, followed by less strict few months. I am a different person. Removing grains and adding in a lot more omega 3s were the biggies for me, plus treating some fairly major deficiencies (I think I was really malnourished). I ate a lot of good stuff, but the grains were just counteracting it all. I really think you have reason to be optimistic. If you know you can have a good day by being strict paleo then you have already taken a big step in identifying the problem/treatment.
I totally agree! There is the Heidelberg pH capsule test which can determine for certain if you have hypochlorhydria if you wanna really know. But, its suffice to say that any food that is not sufficiently broken down in the stomach due to the resultant inactivity of proper enzymatic function and whatnot will lead to problems from that point all the way through the rest of the digestive and absorption processes.
Originally Posted by namelesswonder
BTW I do know how this works and most of the doctors I know give their patients the lab report along with the recommended treatment protocols to take with them at the very same visit wherein they discuss these things. Any office not giving you or being forthcoming with providing you your lab data in hard copy when you ask IS breaking the law.... thats any doctors office. So yes, absolutely demand it if need be.... and consider taking the info to another practitioner to work with.
Last edited by Neckhammer; 04-13-2013 at 10:01 AM.
Originally Posted by Neckhammer
The crazy thing is, ive had 100 times more compassion and support from people ive met through forums postings than i have had with any doctor holistic or otherwise. Its been a long long road here, and everytime i get fed up and go seek a doctor i get the same dead eyes / zero compassion schpeal that seems to go hand in hand with people that work with people every day. He wasnt saying i couldnt have my results, he was insulting my intelligence by saying "oh you wouldnt understand those results why would you want a print out copy?" I mean, okay, im not a doctor, but i sure as hell can google :|
Anyways i spoke with a nutritionist that works for one of our local health food super markets and he recommended the same thing everyone on here has so far. Good probiotics, good amounts of fermented foods, and removing gluten / grains and remaining paleo. He suggested taking HCL with every meal, and upping the amount by 1 pill until you feel a warm sensation and then back it down by 1 pill per meal per day. He says this will encourage your body to being producing more HCL over time so you can back down on supplementing with it.
I picked up a good 100 billion refrigerated capsule that has all of the strains that im missing, picked up some local kimchi, and also scooped up some Silver to try and fight that bad bacteria overgrowth.
I just have a few questions guys: ive read on various forums (such as Cure-zone) and they claim that taking probiotics in the event of an existing bacterial overgrowth of a possible pathogen that all im doing is feeding that bad bacteria. Also taking inulin / FOS during a bad bacteria overgrowth again just feeds them rather then encourages growth of the good. What are your thoughts on this? How do we feel about silver biotics to kill the bad bacteria, should i also be taking more anti microbials like oregano oil / berberines?
Thank you so much for your replies guys!
See my issue was that AFTER i went paleo / primal (as i have been for about 8 months so far STRICTLY) i got worse not better. My energy levels were better, i lost some body fat, but the strangest thing was i became HYPER sensitive to foods after switching diets. I can barely tolerate anything aside from the absolute basics. Im talking meat and veggies, and only the LOWEST of glycemic veggies. No carrots for me. Anything carbohydrate related wrecks me within seconds. Its the most intense head pressure i can describe, like someone inflating a balloon inside of my head. Its been horrible, and the symptoms last for DAYS.
Originally Posted by Cryptocode
I feel like going paleo / primal addressed the main issue which was my diet (i was an amateur bodybuilder before all of this happened to me, so you can imagine the thousands of calories and carbs i ate) So in a way i am much healthier now, but it seems like my body recoiled once it got clean and now it thinks everything is a bad guy
Thats my main issue, correcting my over sensitive reactions
I'm looking at healing leaky gut right now. L-glutamine is supposed to be helpful too.
I have also been advised to avoid FOS whilst healing the gut.