Page 1 of 6 123 ... LastLast
Results 1 to 10 of 51

Thread: Bacteria in intestines reacts to red meat causing heart disease. page

  1. #1
    canuck416's Avatar
    canuck416 is offline Senior Member
    Join Date
    Apr 2012
    Location
    Sebastopol, CA
    Posts
    1,174

    Bacteria in intestines reacts to red meat causing heart disease.

    Shop Now
    Very interesting article. Apparently the real culprit in heart disease was not fat, they proposed instead that it was a little-studied chemical that is burped out by bacteria in the intestines after people eat red meat. It is quickly converted by the liver into yet another little-studied chemical called TMAO that gets into the blood and increases the risk of heart disease. A little disconcerting if true.

    http://www.nytimes.com/2013/04/08/he...?emc=eta1&_r=0

  2. #2
    stoney56's Avatar
    stoney56 is offline Member
    Join Date
    Mar 2012
    Posts
    62
    I think they obviously had an agenda beforehand, but I want to know how this TMAO does it's dastardly job. Or is it the CAFO meat?

    Here is the exerpt:

    The researchersí theory, based on their laboratory studies, is that TMAO enables cholesterol to get into artery walls and also prevents the body from excreting excess cholesterol.
    Last edited by stoney56; 04-07-2013 at 11:15 PM.

  3. #3
    Drumroll's Avatar
    Drumroll is online now Senior Member
    Join Date
    May 2012
    Posts
    3,463
    Quote Originally Posted by stoney56 View Post
    I think they obviously had an agenda beforehand, but I want to know how this TMAO does it's dastardly job. Or is it the CAFO meat?

    Here is the exerpt:

    The researchers’ theory, based on their laboratory studies, is that TMAO enables cholesterol to get into artery walls and also prevents the body from excreting excess cholesterol.
    All of which is still under the assumption that cholesterol is the cause and therefore our enemy.

  4. #4
    canuck416's Avatar
    canuck416 is offline Senior Member
    Join Date
    Apr 2012
    Location
    Sebastopol, CA
    Posts
    1,174
    Quote Originally Posted by stoney56 View Post
    I think they obviously had an agenda beforehand, but I want to know how this TMAO does it's dastardly job. Or is it the CAFO meat?

    Here is the exerpt:

    The researchers’ theory, based on their laboratory studies, is that TMAO enables cholesterol to get into artery walls and also prevents the body from excreting excess cholesterol.
    Agreed. I'll be interested to here Mark's and Robb's feedback on this.

  5. #5
    stoney56's Avatar
    stoney56 is offline Member
    Join Date
    Mar 2012
    Posts
    62
    I know Matt LaLonde has advocated using grass fed beef as his goto meat, I would imagine he has considered this as well. Here is a wiki chart of carnitine in food (some are questionable as to their status as being "food", yes I'm looking at you macaroni).

    Carnitine - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

    I'd like to see a comparison of grass fed to grain fed levels, but I doubt anyone has done that analysis.

  6. #6
    eKatherine's Avatar
    eKatherine is offline Senior Member
    Join Date
    Feb 2013
    Location
    Portland
    Posts
    4,867
    What got me is that they said they ran this study to confirm the evidence... from other previous badly-run and misinterpreted studies.

  7. #7
    Forgotmylastusername's Avatar
    Forgotmylastusername is offline Senior Member
    Join Date
    Mar 2012
    Location
    N/A
    Posts
    924
    Carnitine is pretty high in red meat compared to other meats, something like 20 times higher. I had a bottle of it in supplement form a long time ago but it didn't do much from what I remembered.

  8. #8
    dkJames's Avatar
    dkJames is offline Senior Member
    Join Date
    Apr 2013
    Location
    Denmark
    Posts
    477
    The question in this is:

    "What is the firestarter that causes our body to send the fireman, i.e. cholesterol, to fix things up ?"

    Cholesterol does not sneak itself inside the artery wall for the fun of causing damages. It is sent to fix things because something messes up in this area. The root-cause of the messing-up is to be tracked and eliminated!!

  9. #9
    Ouaouaron's Avatar
    Ouaouaron is offline Senior Member
    Join Date
    Nov 2011
    Posts
    101
    Carnitine does many great things for our bodies, that's a fact. You find many articles on it being heart healthy including heart muscle healthy. If it is in fact true that Carnitine turns into TMAO and TMAO causes plaque build up leading to heart attacks then that is bad. How much TMAO does one need to get heart disease? Is it truly a marker? Does it truly cause plaque? Carnitine levels in foods surprised me. Eggs have less levels than rice and bread. Cottage cheese has less than avocados. Butter, whole milk, chicken and fish have less than tempeh. Bacon (23.3 mg per 100g) is almost the same as tempeh (19.5 mg per 100g). So are the levels in Tempeh and bacon going to cause problems for both vegans and bacon eaters? I could not find how much is in organ meats. If by bad luck we have bacteria that turns high levels into artery damaging TMAO then it seems that we can go on eating organs, butter, bacon, avocados, coconut oil, fish, chicken and for vegans tempeh. I guess my main questions are: does TMAO cause problem for a fact and if yes, how much carnitine is needed to create enough TMAO to cause problem? I think I just rambled
    Last edited by Ouaouaron; 04-08-2013 at 05:01 AM.
    An optimist is someone who falls off the Empire State Building, and after 50 floors says, 'So far so good!'
    -Somebody funny

  10. #10
    emmie's Avatar
    emmie is offline Senior Member
    Join Date
    Oct 2009
    Posts
    1,167
    PrimalCon New York
    For me, the key sentence in this article is: "An association between TMAO levels in the blood and heart disease risk does not necessarily mean that one causes the other."

    In other words, they have correlation--but not causality. It is really premature to be writing articles about it as though there's a causative effect, but that's what's done these days.

    They also don't know which gut bacteria are responsible for the conversion. Perhaps it's unique in people predisposed to heart disease.

    Too many unresolved questions here for any 'conclusions.'

Page 1 of 6 123 ... LastLast

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •