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Thread: Bacteria in intestines reacts to red meat causing heart disease.

  1. #21
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    Quote Originally Posted by laras View Post
    I saw this too, on TV today. What stood out to me was that the doctor was "optimistic" there would soon be a new anti-biotic we could all take to kill off this bacteria. I just wonder if the pharma companies funded the study, so they could develop a new drug we need! Again, cure all our ails with yet more wonder drugs.
    And there it is. Follow the money. First you've gotta invent the disease.... then you can sell the miracle cure!

  2. #22
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    Whatever the mecanisms, something is bad around red meat, this has been known for a long time! Personally I limit beef to once a week, no reason to overdo it...

  3. #23
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    Quote Originally Posted by Gorbag View Post
    Whatever the mechanisms, something is bad around red meat, this has been believed for a long time!
    Corrected.

  4. #24
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    Quote Originally Posted by Finnegans Wake View Post
    Corrected.
    LOL, remember that "knowledge" is justified "beliefs" - and the evidence against red meat is more than justified, even if the scientists are still discussing the mechanisms behind why so many meat eaters gets ill or dies from it...

  5. #25
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    Quote Originally Posted by emmie View Post
    Too many unresolved questions here for any 'conclusions.'
    except the study started with a foregone conclusion.

    ZOMG!! RED MEAT KILLS!!!
    As I ate the oysters with their strong taste of the sea and their faint metallic taste that the cold white wine washed away, leaving only the sea taste and the succulent texture, and as I drank their cold liquid from each shell and washed it down with the crisp taste of the wine, I lost the empty feeling and began to be happy and to make plans.

    Ernest Hemingway

  6. #26
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    Quote Originally Posted by Gorbag View Post
    LOL, remember that "knowledge" is justified "beliefs" - and the evidence against red meat is more than justified, even if the scientists are still discussing the mechanisms behind why so many meat eaters gets ill or dies from it...
    LOL, whatever you say.

  7. #27
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    the long study was of 10,000 patients already at risk for heart disease.

    the article doesn't specify what risk factors, but this doesn't sound like a healthy baseline from which to draw conclusions, does it?

    the blip on the radar of a one-off steak meal doesn't factor in the people's diets or gut bacteria before. were these "meat-eaters" eating big macs and pepperoni logs all week? or avoiding grains and eating grass-fed meat with a widely varied diet?
    As I ate the oysters with their strong taste of the sea and their faint metallic taste that the cold white wine washed away, leaving only the sea taste and the succulent texture, and as I drank their cold liquid from each shell and washed it down with the crisp taste of the wine, I lost the empty feeling and began to be happy and to make plans.

    Ernest Hemingway

  8. #28
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    Quote Originally Posted by noodletoy View Post
    the long study was of 10,000 patients already at risk for heart disease.
    the article doesn't specify what risk factors, but this doesn't sound like a healthy baseline from which to draw conclusions, does it?
    the blip on the radar of a one-off steak meal doesn't factor in the people's diets or gut bacteria before. were these "meat-eaters" eating big macs and pepperoni logs all week? or avoiding grains and eating grass-fed meat with a widely varied diet?
    Exactly. The confounding variables are all over the place in a study such as this such as obesity, diabetes. This study population is a bunch of SAD posterchildren. And the "control group" were vegans not just vegetarians. Vegans, IME, tend to be more health conscious and less junk foody than vegetarians. So you have a group of vegans who don't have the particular gut microbe that reacts with the carnetine to form the TMAO. But was this because of not eating meat or because of not eating junk?

  9. #29
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    How about the notion that you can have all the plaque you want and never have a heart attack as long as you stand all day so your arteries are gigantic? And you can have all the plaque you want as long as you avoid the inflammation that can lead to it becoming a problem? Plaque is standard. What's not, is the plaque becoming a problem.
    Steak, eggs, potatoes - fruits, nuts, berries and forage. Coconut milk and potent herbs and spices. Tea instead of coffee now and teeny amounts of kelp daily. Let's see how this does! Not really had dairy much, and gut seems better for it.

  10. #30
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    Sorry to butt in, but even royalty in Egypt of times past were not significant carnivores. Cattle were more or less off the menu to avoid annoying Hathor, and even wild game was not a daily dietary feature. Fish was the main source of animal proteins, for commoner and royals alike. Presumably it was their high animal protein intake from cows and sheep that got the Hebrews ghettoed in Goshen to avoid offending the religious sensibilities of their new hosts. It probably also explained their famous fecundity and easy births that so dismayed the Egyptians by the time of Moses.
    Besides, if the gut bacteria is at fault, one can change the composition of them by selection of the rest of the diet. Or, failing that, fecal transplants! UGH!

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