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Thread: Bacteria in intestines reacts to red meat causing heart disease. page 2

  1. #11
    canuck416's Avatar
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    Appreciate everyone's feedback. Many good questions raised. I believe there will be a lot of interesting feedback on this from within the Paleo community over the next week.

  2. #12
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    this might explain the recent findings where the mummies from all over the world showed heart disease, even one predominantly eating presumably grass fed meat. This definitely is going to make me take a hard look at eating red meat everyday.

  3. #13
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    but it didn't do much from what I remembered.

  4. #14
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    I saw this too, on TV today. What stood out to me was that the doctor was "optimistic" there would soon be a new anti-biotic we could all take to kill off this bacteria. I just wonder if the pharma companies funded the study, so they could develop a new drug we need! Again, cure all our ails with yet more wonder drugs.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Drumroll View Post
    All of which is still under the assumption that cholesterol is the cause and therefore our enemy.
    I'm not sure that's exactly what they're saying though.

    Like Dr. Attia's post at MDA asserts, when those LDL particles violate the endothelium and oxidize, that's when inflammation and atherosclerosis begin. So cholesterol is not per se bad, but some lipoproteins are certainly part of the puzzle of CHD.

  6. #16
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    Quote Originally Posted by laras View Post
    I saw this too, on TV today. What stood out to me was that the doctor was "optimistic" there would soon be a new anti-biotic we could all take to kill off this bacteria. I just wonder if the pharma companies funded the study, so they could develop a new drug we need! Again, cure all our ails with yet more wonder drugs.
    Yeah, not to mention a few years ago since they started treating H.pylori we were facing the possibility of it going extinct, which led a lot of people to ask if it was really a good idea to completely wipe-out bacterial a species whose role in the ecosystem of the human body is only partially known.

  7. #17
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    Assuming this is a true causal relationship, which needs proving (I haven't read the article), the bacterial culprit(s) could well be adapted to flourish in the environment created by consumption of refined grains and sugars as dietary staples (Ian Spreadbury's "acellular carbohydrates" q.v.) It would be interesting and a bit poetic if eating SAD made the CW on red meat into a self-fulfilling prophecy.
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  8. #18
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    But is the suggestion here that we stop eating red meat; and instead eat Special K; Whole Wheat Toast and bagels and muffins? Can probiotics mitigate the production of TMAO if it is indeed problematic? What are the specific bacteria associated with the production of this compound? Not yet identified. Where do they come from? Possibly from a high carb diet? Many questions remain.
    Last edited by zebonaut; 04-08-2013 at 01:29 PM.

  9. #19
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    Anyone has links to the full text of the paper? Pop-media renderings of studies are notoriously inaccurate.

    Oh, and this: Does Dietary Choline Contribute to Heart Disease? | Mother Nature Obeyed - Weston A Price Foundation would be useful reading.

  10. #20
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    Quote Originally Posted by cantare View Post
    Assuming this is a true causal relationship, which needs proving (I haven't read the article), the bacterial culprit(s) could well be adapted to flourish in the environment created by consumption of refined grains and sugars as dietary staples (Ian Spreadbury's "acellular carbohydrates" q.v.) It would be interesting and a bit poetic if eating SAD made the CW on red meat into a self-fulfilling prophecy.
    This is the best explanation I have heard yet. Although my one concern about this idea is that vegetarians that ate beef did not make TMAO. Assuming that the vegetarians in the study at a fairly grainy/sugary diet it would mean that you need both meat consumption and a high sugar diet to maintain these bacteria in the gut.
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