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Thread: Alternate Day Fasting- Debate and Science page 4

  1. #31
    eKatherine's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Gorbag View Post
    Is that a refence to me? And where did I call you "a liar"? You make certain irrational and absurd statements that you can gain weight in a calorie deficit below 800 kcal per day, and I say that it can't be the case, but I don't call you a liar, because you probably don't know where you are mistaken or make wrong measurements. Another possibility is that you are trolling or lying, but I am not saying that, only that what you are claiming can't be the case! In an earlier post you wrote that you can gain weight in a calorie deficit:


    This is of course a complete absurdity, so I don't need to check it, because nobody can even maintain their weight in a calorie deficit, far less gain any! And if somebody claim that gravitation is not working where he lives and that a stone instead of falling down flies upwards instead, I don't need to go and check it, because I can dismiss it as pure nonsense a priori. But maybe this person believes in what he is saying though...
    You are calling me a liar once again. What possible "checking" could you possibly be referring to? You actually think I would welcome an internet troll into my home to watch as I step on the scale, to measure my food before I eat it?

    Besides, you've said you don't want to know anything about it because you already know everything there is to be known. Close enough for me. No need to generate data for you.

  2. #32
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    Quote Originally Posted by Gorbag View Post
    Is that a refence to me? And where did I call you "a liar"? You make certain irrational and absurd statements that you can gain weight in a calorie deficit below 800 kcal per day, and I say that it can't be the case, but I don't call you a liar, because you probably don't know where you are mistaken or make wrong measurements. Another possibility is that you are trolling or lying, but I am not saying that, only that what you are claiming can't be the case! In an earlier post you wrote that you can gain weight in a calorie deficit:


    This is of course a complete absurdity, so I don't need to check it, because nobody can even maintain their weight in a calorie deficit, far less gain any! And if somebody claim that gravitation is not working where he lives and that a stone instead of falling down flies upwards instead, I don't need to go and check it, because I can dismiss it as pure nonsense a priori. But maybe this person believes in what he is saying though...
    You are calling me a liar once again. What possible "checking" could you possibly be referring to? You actually think I would welcome an internet troll into my home to watch as I step on the scale, to measure my food before I eat it?

    Besides, you've said you don't want to know anything about it because you already know everything there is to be known. Close enough for me. No need to generate data for you.

    Seriously, what did I weigh today? Let's ask Gorbag. He can tell me without even knowing anything about what I ate. No need to ever step on the scale again. Gorbag knows all.

  3. #33
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    I'm not taking sides in this, but I'd like to point out that although I tend to agree with the belief that it's impossible to gain weight with a caloric deficit, I've actually done that because of thyroid problems. I have Hashimoto's thyroiditis, and one aspect of that disease is that the person can have conversion problems so that the T3 hormone isn't made by the body. When that happened, I was eating to lose about a pound a week--and had been losing steadily--when I suddenly gained 10 lbs in 2 weeks. And it wasn't 'water' either--that's how much the thyroid controls metabolism.

    I've been taking T3 hormones since then, but my level dropped so low at one point that I had to eat only 500 cal a day to keep from gaining (until I could get my Rx increased).

    My point is that there could be medical issues that will cause a person to gain even with a caloric deficit--but absent a physical problem, it's unlikely.

    I've known people who claimed that they gained weight eating only 800 cal a day, and I suspect that they were not counting accurately. Unless you weigh and measure, you can be 'off' considerably.

  4. #34
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    Quote Originally Posted by emmie View Post
    I've known people who claimed that they gained weight eating only 800 cal a day, and I suspect that they were not counting accurately. Unless you weigh and measure, you can be 'off' considerably.
    Which I was doing.

  5. #35
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    Lots of people have had the experience of not losing or even gaining while eating low calorie. Did it myself. Was hungry for years. Gorbag has called me a liar in another thread as he has now done with Katherine. He thinks he is an expert on the working of metabolism. All he's proven is that he is as close-minded as those who said the earth was flat.

  6. #36
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    Well said emmie, I am in a similar position - gained weight despite a 'calorie deficit', due to thyroid condition.

    I put 'calorie deficit' in brackets, because obviously eating 1200 calories a day, while according to all calorie counters and estimators etc was a deficit, in actual fact it can't have been a deficit because I was gaining.

    I think it comes down to semantics - how do we know that a certain number of calories is a deficit? We don't, not if the old calories in vs calories out is flawed, which I think has thoroughly been proven or argued on other threads. Therefore, we only know that we are in a calorie deficit when we lose weight.

    If we begin by believing that ekatherine is telling the truth, and did in fact gain weight on 800cal per day - and what possible reason would ekatherine have to lie? What gain? Other than incorrect feedback about their diet? And also assume that ekatherine is not a complete incompetent and unable to weigh, measure and add up this 800cal per day. Then the only answer is that for ekatherine, 800cal per day was not a deficit. Probably, as emmie says, due to metabolic or hormonal issues, eg thyroid.

    I have been there myself, and have had people tell me that I was incompetent, lying, or just too plain stupid to add up and measure my calories.

  7. #37
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    Quote Originally Posted by janie View Post
    Lots of people have had the experience of not losing or even gaining while eating low calorie. Did it myself. Was hungry for years. Gorbag has called me a liar in another thread as he has now done with Katherine. He thinks he is an expert on the working of metabolism. All he's proven is that he is as close-minded as those who said the earth was flat.
    I can't remember that I have called any person "a liar" since I was at the age of around 14, so any citation would be appreciated from those people that claims that I have called ANYBODY a liar...

  8. #38
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    Quote Originally Posted by eKatherine View Post
    You are calling me a liar once again.
    Did I? I said that the implications of your statement is a complete absurdity, i.e. that you can gain weight in a calorie deficit - but some persons believes in absurde things and are not necessary liars because what they believe is wrong - do you understand the difference?

  9. #39
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    I think this is becoming a distraction now. At some point in the future I will revisit it to see if I can figure out exactly what is happening. But for now it has just given Gorbag an excuse to hijack an unrelated thread.

  10. #40
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    It's my fault. I fed the troll...
    The process is simple: Free your mind, and your ass will follow.

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