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    tfarny's Avatar
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    Binge to re-set metabolism for weight loss? and other odd ideas

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    There is so much contradictory and just plain weird info out there, as everyone knows. One that I've run up against is the idea that if your goal is weight loss (that is my main goal for the next couple months), you need to have an overeating day once every week or two to send your metabolism the message "it's ok, don't worry, there's plenty of food available, don't go into starvation mode." Something to do with Leptin (?). The idea is that weight loss plateaus are caused by Leptin being produced when lots of fat is burned and creating a signal to slow down metabolism and block any more fat-burning (starvation mode). Let me know if I've got that wrong.

    I was stuck for two weeks without any loss, even with pretty good PB compliance and about 1000kcal daily deficit, enough for in theory a 4 lb loss w/exercise. I went to England for a week and completely went non-paleo for the first several days (beer! chips! Bread!). By five days in I was bloated and I felt heavier. The volcanic ash cloud kept me there another week (don't cry for me, it was pretty cool), so I made a devoted effort to be fairly PB during that time. When I came back I found I had lost 5 lb. Is that a common experience for others? Should I grab a double cheeseburger and fries when I can't lose weight?

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    MariaNYC's Avatar
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    I've heard of this, a variation is simply a higher carb day, maybe even once a week. I would not recommend cheesburgers and fries (unless you fry them in something other than vegetable oil), tubers and fruit should do it. Once in a while I'll have a potato, and it seems to give a jolt to my metabolism. I guess the trick is to not get carried away once you eat something carby, which is why I personally don't eat fruit when I feel like carbing-up (the sweetness makes me crave more sweets).

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    That's an interesting theory, but it doesn't make sense to me that leptin would signal to stop burning fat for any reason other than a "famine" situation. Ideally fat-loss involves keeping nutrition high, carbs low, protein moderate and getting a lot of calories from saturated and monounsaturated fats. Big caloric deficits do put the body into conservation mode so eating at least "maintenance " is a good idea. I think a lot of people might also be increasing the wrong types of fats with their overall consumption of extra fats.

    It goes Omega 6->Interleukin-6->SOSC-3=Leptin resistance=Inhibited fat loss.

    http://www.jbc.org/content/274/42/30059.long

    That increased cortisol inhibits fat loss is pretty much self-evident now and more omega 6 definitely increases cortisol. So do caloric deficits for that matter.
    Stabbing conventional wisdom in its face.

    Anyone who wants to talk nutrition should PM me!

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    I've heard the theory that you need to eat something really "bad" every once in a while to jolt weight loss, but I have never seen evidence to prove it. I always figured it was some sort of justification to make dieters feel less guilty about a cheat day. ;D

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    First of all, I have never failed to lose weight on low calories. It is true that the body doesn't like to lose weight, but "starvation mode" (if it exists) would only kick in if a person were eating about 400 cal a day for an extended period of time--not a couple of days. After all, anorexics wouldn't be in danger if their bodies simply went into 'starvation mode' and refused to lose any more--no, they can starve themselves to death.

    And you don't 're-set' your metabolism. Our bodily functions are not in as much of our control as we've been led to believe.

    There are a variety of explanations for your vacation weight loss. Often, the person is eating freely but is so busy that he or she actually eats less than usual without realizing it. There's also no one-on-one relationship between one day's menu and the subsequent number on the scale. Often the body, resisting loss, will fill empty fat cells with water. The individual will complain of being 'stalled' or [horrors!] gaining, and then after a week or so, experiences a loss of 4 or 5 lbs. It's because the body has been forced to dump that excess water.

    There are valid theories of carb and calorie cycling that are supposed to promote weight loss--but eating 'bad things' is not included. That's pure rationalization.

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    PrimalEagle's Avatar
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    Like Emmie, I had always been able to lose weight via calories-in/calories-out and had my RMR tested with the best possible equipment regularly. And it worked for years, until it stopped working. Point in fact, I was eating 500 calories below my RMR in addition to kickboxing 5 days a week, running 3 days a week and vball on the weekends. I did this for 10 weeks straight and, despite being 20 lbs or so overweight, did not lose a single pound (nor did I gain any muscle). My nutritionist blames it on some fad diets/yo-yo dieting I did in the months prior to going back to calories-in/calories-out. The body can attempt to outsmart you if you have given it reason to think that you will do it harm (starve it, over-train it, etc.). I am living proof. Sometimes you have to heal your body.

    There is conflicting evidence of whether a refeed helps or not. Some say yes, some say no. The only way you can know is to give it a shot and see how it works for you. For many, weight loss is not a good enough reason to re-introduce bad foods into your diet (nor are the resultant cravings) and they prefer the overall health that PB provides even if they are stuck at a weightloss plateau. Perhaps your goals vary and you are willing to take this chance. It appears to me that whether it works, or whether you "should", is an individualized decision.
    "If you won't be better tomorrow than you are today, what do you need tomorrow for?"

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    1000 cal daily deficit? 7000 calories = 2 pounds of fat per week, if you're losing more than that, it's lean mass and that's not a good thing. You'll definitely start affecting your metabolism with that much of a deficit, "refeeding" might help, but it would be better to have a smaller deficit (500 max) and take your time with the weight loss. You'll only end up losing lean mass, decreasing your metabolism and then when you quit the diet you'll eat more and will be gaining weight because you nuked your metabolism during the "fat" loss stage.

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    MalPaz's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by mcasse View Post
    1000 cal daily deficit? 7000 calories = 2 pounds of fat per week, if you're losing more than that, it's lean mass and that's not a good thing. You'll definitely start affecting your metabolism with that much of a deficit, "refeeding" might help, but it would be better to have a smaller deficit (500 max) and take your time with the weight loss. You'll only end up losing lean mass, decreasing your metabolism and then when you quit the diet you'll eat more and will be gaining weight because you nuked your metabolism during the "fat" loss stage.
    THANK YOU--- i was goign to say the same thing... how in the WORLD do you even FUNCTION on 1000calorie a day deficit??? no wonder you have trouble losing weight...eat more, not cycling and eating junk, eat more nutritous primal food and your body will get the signal that NUTRIENTS are available and weight can be dropped

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    tfarny's Avatar
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    As far as a 1000kcal deficit being disastrous, I don't get it - I just lost 20 lb in two months, and I'm stronger than I was before and feel great. I just had my best-ever racquetball matches yesterday. Admittedly maybe 5 lb was water weight but that's still nearly 2 lb / week. I'm operating under the assumption of 3000kcal basic rate + exercise, so if I take in 2000 that's a 1000 deficit. 2000 calories in two PB meals a day, with minimal alcohol, is plenty of food to keep me energetic on most days. Maybe I don't have a 3000kcal basic rate, who knows, but that's the baseline assumption for a 200lbs 6'1" 38yo moderately active male. 1 lb/week would be fine though, too. I would like to lose enough fat (maybe 10 more lbs, for BMI of 25) that I can refocus to fitness goals and away from fat loss goals.
    Today I had a bacon/feta omelette (two eggs w/an extra yolk), served in plenty of bacon fat, coffee with cream, and for lunch just about 2 oz of cheddar and 1/2 serving of a whey protein drink, which was seriously filling. Dinner will be leftover gazpacho and roasted cornish game hen plus some kind of sauteed veg or salad, we'll see what's in the fridge. Add a glass of wine and I'll be around 2000kcal, under 100grams carb, nearly 70% fat cals, and not exactly starving to death. This is more PB than some days, but not out of the ordinary. I definitely don't feel the need for a 'real' lunch at least today. I appreciate the thoughts and suggestions, I still haven't figured out whether having a burger and fries and pasta will help my weight loss though. I like this forum a lot!

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    tfarny's Avatar
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    I would also like to say - "when you quit the diet"? I've never been on a diet and don't intend to go on one ever. I am trying to lose weight, hence the question, but I don't consider any of this a 'diet' that I'm going to 'quit'. It's more like "finally I found out how to be healthy" and "early stages of getting healthy = losing 30 lb."

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