CW arguments page 2

[ms sage]

Just thought I would see about some insight from those who have followed this path longer than I. And I love to argue! But from now on I will get my lazy self to the google. MagicMerl that was good info thanks.

[Neckhammer]

Just thought I would see about some insight from those who have followed this path longer than I. And I love to argue! But from now on I will get my lazy self to the google. MagicMerl that was good info thanks.

Yeah, we probably came off kinda harsh. Either way you will get way more out of it and have a more defensible position if you dig in to the info on your own. I dunno why "Mark don't count" though. You really should use his posts as a jumping off point. Many of those hyperlinks in his posts are to the primary studies that his claims are based on.

[Violette_R]

There are carbohydrates in fruits, vegetables, nuts, etc.

[Omni]

I think many people make the mistake of looking for the knockout punch in these types of discussions you have started with the fitness forum guy, but in most cases it is a twelve rounder or more.
The same for " how can I make my parents/partner etc. understand", you are up against the CW machine which has been building it's defenses brainwashing the populace for decades and more, so the exercise becomes like a "cult deprogramming" treatment, you won't convince anyone of anything primal/paleo in one post, but if you are keen go there and treat it as an educational tool for yourself.

Since the question lies with carbs are essential read up on posts from Mark and others on Ketosis as this is living proof of 0-ultra low carb intake, as neckhammer said mark and other bloggers are great starting points, they will explain how it works and in most cases provide links to scientific studies.
You will also need to search out true essential glucose requirements, when it's all broken down I think it comes back to about 50g per day and the body can easily produce this via glycogenesis, as we burn triglycerides the three fatty tales come off and the glyceride head is basically half of a glucose, so fat metabolism naturally produces raw materials for glycogenesis, there is some protein break down for glucose, it is minor, but you should be aware of it so you are not blindsided.

As I understand it there is a minor glucose requirement in the brain and the red blood cells require it as they do not have mitochondria, so they survive on anaerobic metabolism and produce lactate from glucose, which is kind of ironic as they do carry oxygen. Irrelevant to this, but lactate is another interesting area, much misunderstood and not the bad guy as often portrayed, but quite essential, but that begins another story and so it goes.

Here is a post from Mark re "glucose requirements" as a starter, there are more with that search criteria:
https://www.marksdailyapple.com/how-...n-really-need/

[RichMahogany]

As I understand it there is a minor glucose requirement in the brain and the red blood cells require it as they do not have mitochondria, so they survive on anaerobic metabolism and produce lactate from glucose, which is kind of ironic as they do carry oxygen

It was always explained to me that the fact that they have to carry oxygen is the reason they have to survive on anaerobic metabolism, or otherwise the oxygen would never make it to any of the other tissues that the RBC's are supposed to be trucking it around to. But my understanding is not sufficiently deep to know whether that's logical or whether your sense of irony is justified.

[Omni]

It was always explained to me that the fact that they have to carry oxygen is the reason they have to survive on anaerobic metabolism, or otherwise the oxygen would never make it to any of the other tissues that the RBC's are supposed to be trucking it around to. But my understanding is not sufficiently deep to know whether that's logical or whether your sense of irony is justified.

The logic is there, (like the riddle of crossing the river with the fox, chicken & bag of wheat), whether this is the actual reason no one knows, the mechanism is that they lack mitochondria which is required for the aerobic processes. It may also simply be to maximise oxygen carrying capacity by shedding excess weight (mitochondria) and the blood has a continuous supply of glucose at all times, so no fuel shortages and the heart and brain and muscles can continuously & prefer to burn the lactate that is produced by the red blood cells, this may be more than just coincidence, lactate function is still poorly understood.

I'm more inclined to think that it is an optimisation adaptation rather than a mechanism to stop red blood cells from stealing all the oxygen.The irony comment was just that there seem to be many contradictory circumstances like this in the body, but as you get deeper they all have more logic than we are capable of understanding, and there is always another layer of the onion below your most recent revelation.