Why the harshness about starches? page 3

[Leida]

However, some people, especially ones who are prone to metabolic syndrome can't handle eating a lot of carb. It results in cravings and weight gain.
I wish it wasn't the case. To be honest, I'd prefer a plate of big plate of pasta over a T-bone steak, but it's the genetic hand I was dealt so I have to work with it.

OP doesn't say 'pasta', he says 'squash'. There is a world of difference between a plate of processed pasta (even without the processed 'go with it' stuff and a lovely squash. If you want a squash with a touch of spice and butter or cheese or marinara (or without) instead of a steak one night, give a shot to just eating it. Chances are that you will actually feel cozy and satisfied rather than annoyed by your food choices and chocking the beautiful meat down without pleasure - I have done that in the past.

[s-piper]

OP doesn't say 'pasta', he says 'squash'. There is a world of difference between a plate of processed pasta (even without the processed 'go with it' stuff and a lovely squash. If you want a squash with a touch of spice and butter or cheese or marinara (or without) instead of a steak one night, give a shot to just eating it. Chances are that you will actually feel cozy and satisfied rather than annoyed by your food choices and chocking the beautiful meat down without pleasure - I have done that in the past.

I agree completely! :-)

Zach: Saying that I'm genetically pre-disposed to metabolic syndrome is stating a fact, it isn't a cop out. Of course, it was my choices that untimately made me gain weight. You can have every genetic risk factor for weight gain that we know of and not be overweight.
If I go out to lunch and eat mac&cheese and leftover Valentine's Day cupcakes, it'll be my choice...and it'll be a bad one! It's not avoiding responsibility to eat a diet your body can best work with and what your body can best work with IS determined by your genetic makeup.
As for restricting micronutrients....what do you call what low-fat diets do?

[Zach]

Who said i advocated low fat diets? Everyone needs to eat a certain amount of fat to be healthy. Eating nutrient dense fat from the right sources is what i believe. not just dumping fat down your throat because you think low carb is healthy and fat is magical.

You may be predisposed to certain illnesses but that mean you have live with that fate.

[sbhikes]

But does it really matter whether you're eating carbs from broccoli or carbs from sweet potatoes, if the carb count comes out the same at the end of the day?

I don't think it matters, no. I don't really think it matters how many grams of carbs are eaten if they come from leaves, flowers, roots, stems, shoots or starchy plant organs. It's going to be hard to eat "too many" (whatever that means) if these are your sources.

[Neckhammer]

Don't think it matters. I've migrated away from the super high veggie trend that I started with. I focus first and foremost on the best pieces of meat (bone in and plenty of fat). Dress that up with some spices, herbs, and veggies just to taste and that it. Fruit and tators can fill in any of the gaps if you want more carbs, although I still see them as simply optional rather than essential.

I have read some rather convincing evolutionary models that suggest meat, fruit, tubers are fit for human consumption while vegetables are probably simply a wash as far as health goes.

[s-piper]

Who said i advocated low fat diets? Everyone needs to eat a certain amount of fat to be healthy. Eating nutrient dense fat from the right sources is what i believe. not just dumping fat down your throat because you think low carb is healthy and fat is magical.

You may be predisposed to certain illnesses but that mean you have live with that fate.

Okay, are you just trolling?

Primal does not say that fat is magical, just that it isn't the main source of modern health problems like obesity and heart disease, rather grains and sugar are the big contributor.
I was having trouble with not liking fattier meats, and people here assured me I didn't have to eat them if I didn't want to.

I assume you meant to say 'that doesn't meant you have to live with that fate' which is exactly what I just said!
And if you did mean to say that I have to live with that fate...no I don't.

[Zach]

I have read some rather convincing evolutionary models that suggest meat, fruit, tubers are fit for human consumption while vegetables are probably simply a wash as far as health goes.

I agree with this.

Okay, are you just trolling?

Primal does not say that fat is magical, just that it isn't the main source of modern health problems like obesity and heart disease, rather grains and sugar are the big contributor.
I was having trouble with not liking fattier meats, and people here assured me I didn't have to eat them if I didn't want to.

I assume you meant to say 'that doesn't meant you have to live with that fate' which is exactly what I just said!
And if you did mean to say that I have to live with that fate...no I don't.

I meant some people believe more fat is better no matter what the problem is. People are adding 70-100g to a morning coffee and atthe same time deathly afraid of a tsp of sugar to put in that coffee.

And no you do not have to live with the fate. Thats exactly why i disagreed with you. Your first post made it sound like since you were predisposed to metabolic syndrom at you should just live with the fact that you cannot eat carbs. I disagree and think that you could improve your health and eat exactly however you would like despite the bad hand dealt.

[PrimalStudent]

So do I. I went through so many cycles of doing the bestest thing that gives the most pluses as the DnD world put it... and well, my body and mind always fought back the artificial restrictions on anything and in the end it was more harm than good. I tried to dedicate my life to surviving on the latest bestest macro breakdown of only the bestest foods packing the bestest micros (and carb content) and being right down to a percentage point. I admit to gaming with FitDay to match 15% of fat exactly at one time and 25 total grams of carbs at another time and so on. And I consider it a mistake.

I can completely relate. My problem is probably that I spend too much time browsing forums... not only MarksDailyApple, but Dr. Harris' Archevore blog, and PaleoHacks too. There are SO many different perspectives on what's "right", what's completely "safe" and "benign", and what "should be limited"... and in my determination to eat ONLY the foods that ALL the groups seem to agree on, I'm left with... grass-fed beef and salad greens?

High-fat dairy -- eschewed by strict paleo people, and even on MDA as a supposed contributor to weight gain
Nuts -- again, people claim is their ticket to weight gain
Starches -- only for the super-active (if I believe the posts I read).

It can be frustrating, but I guess it's just a process of seeing what makes each individual feel best.

[Zach]

I can completely relate. My problem is probably that I spend too much time browsing forums... not only MarksDailyApple, but Dr. Harris' Archevore blog, and PaleoHacks too. There are SO many different perspectives on what's "right", what's completely "safe" and "benign", and what "should be limited"... and in my determination to eat ONLY the foods that ALL the groups seem to agree on, I'm left with... grass-fed beef and salad greens?

High-fat dairy -- eschewed by strict paleo people, and even on MDA as a supposed contributor to weight gain
Nuts -- again, people claim is their ticket to weight gain
Starches -- only for the super-active (if I believe the posts I read).

It can be frustrating, but I guess it's just a process of seeing what makes each individual feel best.

Try looking at it from a natural or man made sense. Fruit, meat, eggs, roots/tubers, greens, nuts have all been available since human evolution began. Milk, beans, grains have been a more recent addition but have helped fuel our species for thousands of years.

Anything after that is probably detrimental to health. From those groups you have to figure out which improve your health, which take away from your health and which are benign and keep you happy.