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Thread: Lean leptin gains reset or some such crud and real food alternative to BCAA page

  1. #1
    Tribal Rob's Avatar
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    Lean leptin gains reset or some such crud and real food alternative to BCAA

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    So, I've been doing so low level research, not like I'm gonna get a pHD or anything, just looking at crazy folks on the 'tinterweb.

    I'm currently following the leptin reset protocol, though I am not 100% convinced by every aspect for the programme. Mainly the work-out timings are not fasted and at a silly time for me (late afternoon/early evening).

    I've been following the advice not to work out at first, but it's driving my nuts and I'm not sure it's good for me, so I'm giving it one more week then I'm changing things up to a way that I think will work better for me.

    I've always like working out first thing (maybe after a coffee). I'm also not convinced about the NEED to eat breakfast as soon as I get up, I'm not really all that hungry and I find I feel a bit sluggish for an hour or so after a big feed, I'd rather get on with stuff like housework and looking after the kids then eat later.

    So I have come up with the following plan;

    Fasting about 16 hours a day, starting eating about mid-day, and stopping after dinner, first meal heavy on the protien, I'll probably have some carbs as these meals will be moslty post work-out, absolutly no calories outside of meals. This will be 2 meals a day most days.

    Working out 5 days a week doing a variety of stuff which I enjoy, which includes running and cycling as well as HIIT and LHT. I will do this before I eat my first meal of the day.

    Rest days I will probably 24 hour fast - so I'll go till dinner time, or maybe not.

    The thing I'm trying to sort out is pre-work out eating - most training guides recommend some kind of protien shake and BCAA.

    So other than generally ripping apart what I am suggesting and telling me to eat potatoes , is the pre-work out protien really nessasary to maintan muscle mass or can I just go with-out, and if it is really benifical what can I have as a real food alternative. A smoothie with a spoon of coconut oil, coconut milk and an egg would probably work, but sounds bloody gross without some fruit in there for flavour.
    You know all those pictures of Adam and Eve where they have belly button? Think about it..................... take as long as you need........................

  2. #2
    Ripped's Avatar
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    From taking a glimpse of the program, if I found the correct one, the author is recommending to fix leptin resistance by eating breakfast?

    If so, I'm sorry, but that's complete nonsense. Leptin resistance occurs from being too fat. Because leptin is produced by fat cells. What happens is if you get too fat, you also produce too much leptin. Leptin is a hormone that makes you feel ful. And what happens when you get too fat and keep eating like a pig all the time, is your body develops a resistance to the hormone and starts ignoring the signals that would normally tell you that you have enough energy and that it's time to stop eating. When insulin resistant, essentially you feel like you're hungry all the time even though you just got done eating and you've got a ton of energy available stored all over your body.

    If you understand what leptin is and does and why leptin resistance occurs, it'd be easy to see that the only way to cure it is to stop eating so much and make it so you aren't fat anymore. And the only way to do that is to eat less.

    This is why eating breakfast can't correct the problem of leptin resistance. It can only make it worse. Because you are leptin resistant from being fat and eating too much, and you are fat because you eat too much. Eating breakfast only makes you fatter. Because it's eating.

    Anyways, I guess the idea you're looking at is to regain leptin sensitivity? Well, guess what happens when you eat less and get thin again. Leptin drops into the dirt. And that isn't necessarily a bad thing. Because the good news is that your body's leptin sensitivity is restored. And that means when you eat a good meal, leptin will be produced, your body will respond to it the way you should, you'll feel ful like you should, and you'll stop eating.

    This is why while eating less makes you lose weight, it's also fine and can even be helpful to include some high calorie days. Because the high calorie days cause leptin to go back up again. And this is a good thing. This is what you want. In a normal healthy body, high leptin and low leptin are neither good or bad. Allow me to explain:

    If your body produces zero leptin (this is actually a very rare disease), you'll feel like you are starving all the time no matter how fat you are and no matter how much you eat. This is the same thing that happens with leptin resistance. The body doesn't get the signal no matter how high leptin is, and so you stay hungry all the time.

    But in a normal healthy lean body, leptin will naturally go low when you don't eat for a while, and eventually you'll get hungry. Then when you eat, leptin will go high again for a while, and you'll feel ful. This is normal. This is good.

    Now if you starve yourself on the other hand, or severely restrict calories for an extended period of time, leptin levels can go down and stay down for a long time. The result is, you end up feeling hungry all the time, and you'l be more likely to binge and gain the fat back. Now theoretically this looks cute. But in reality I some how don't think it really happens this way. If there is any truth to it, I'm pretty sure that's mainly with people who have been severely starved and are underweight. And in such cases, I would find it highly unlikely that they would binge to the point where they'd be obese. Instead, my bet is that as they regained healthy weight, leptin levels would eventually go back to normal and so would their hunger and eating patterns.

    So the good news is, most people trying to lose weight will never have to worry about leptin levels getting too low. And even if they did, periodically including high calorie meals would solve this problem. And seeing as though people who are overweight love to eat, I'd say there'd be no reason to force it because they're going to slip and have a high calorie meal from time to time anyways. My idea is simply not to force a super strict diet all the time. You can do a lot of low calorie days to lose weight. Then once in a while if you feel like you really want to, have a high calorie meal. Then everything will be ok.

    Anyways, I hope that helps. I know it was rather long. But the main message I'm giving is that if you have hunger problems due to leptin resistance, it's going to be like that until you aren't fat anymore. And I suppose the only thing you can do about it is to eat satisfying foods to subside the hunger, essentially lots of protein and get your carbs from the right sources as well. Then fast when you can. My bet is that fasting would be very difficult initially.

    But my experience actually does match up with this. Have you ever noticed how some supposedly naturally lean or thin people always seem to know exactly when they are ful and so they stop? And that happens even if they eat junk food. But it's never like that for fat people. And there's a reason for it. The thin person's hunger mechanisms are working properly because they aren't fat. But the fat person has developed leptin resistance. What I noticed after I lost a lot of weight is that I started feeling ful quicker just like a skinny person would, and just the same no matter what I ate. This is what you want.

    Now as for the BCAA's and protein shakes, that's a bunch of nonsense too. They had strong and muscular men 100 years ago before the invention of protein shakes and all that. Lift heavy weights and you will be big and strong. Eat less and the fat will go away. Exercise regularly and you will mentally feel good.

    I just have a few more comments on hunger and leptin.

    First of all, the only people who are going to be leptin resistant are obese people, and possibly overweight people. If you aren't very fat, chances are you don't have any issues with leptin resistance.

    Lastly, let's talk about hunger. One extra reason why fat people think they are hungry all the time is because they don't know what real hunger really is. My best friend happens to be a real thin person who doesn't like to eat too much and fills up rather quickly. He's also been known to fast for about 24 hours once in a while because he's busy or lazy.

    When I first learned about intermittent fasting, I started to ask him about it, because I knew he did this naturally. I realized that when I was first afraid to fast, I didn't know what I was afraid of, because I was used to eating six meals per day. I asked him what real hunger was. He said to me that real hunger is when your stomach physically hurts, that's when you know your really hungry and you need to eat.

    Since then, I fast regularly. I've fasted for a few days many times. I've even fasted for up to 4 days straight. I'm still about 10 lbs overweight. And I can honestly tell you that so far I have never felt that feeling that my friend has explained to me. When you have extra fat on your body, (unlike my friend who has little to none), fasting is a breeze.

    That is why I say. Fat people have no clue what real hunger is. What they really need is a reality check, to stop whining, and to stop eating so much.

  3. #3
    otzi's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Tribal Rob View Post
    So, I've been doing so low level research, not like I'm gonna get a pHD or anything, just looking at crazy folks on the 'tinterweb.

    I'm currently following the leptin reset protocol, though I am not 100% convinced by every aspect for the programme. Mainly the work-out timings are not fasted and at a silly time for me (late afternoon/early evening).
    .
    I live way up north, not far from the Arctic Circle. When Jack Kruse came on the scene talking about cold thermogenesis, I was very interested. I have read just about everything he has written over the last 2 years, and have also followed many people doing his 'protocols' on his forum.

    All-in-all, I have to say, the Leptin Reset has been a huge bust for seemingly everyone that tried it. At first it was touted as the 'great cure-all' as leptin is the 'Master Hormone' and all that. I toyed with the leptin reset, but when I went from IF'ing to a big protein breakfast, I gained weight and was hungry all day. I was doing much better IF'ing til lunch and working out several times a week. Most people who do the Leptin Reset report gaining weight on it.

    As time went on, new 'protocols' emerged. It seems the Leptin Reset isn't a stand-alone program! You also need to chill yourself down to below 50 degrees until you are 'Cold Adapted', but a good definition of this was never given. I also toyed with Cold Thermogenesis. It has good scientific backing, but using it in conjunction with the Leptin Reset was also a bust for most.

    What next? Everyone has a leaky gut! You have to fix that by eating, not paleo, but Epi-Paleo! A high-seafood, seasonally ketogenic paleo diet. Actually ketogenic until you are in a 'fat-burning pathway' that only a very few people world-wide have ever achieved. This can take 2 or more years to reach, according to Jack Kruse.

    Still not Leptin Sensitive? Of course not! You are using too much technology! You need to block all blue light after sunset. You need to stay away from power lines and replenish your electrons.

    More tips: Drink raw mackeral head smoothies, spend lots of time naked in a dark, cold room, play with yourself a lot, take lots and lots of supplemental medicine like armour thyroid, cycloset, metformin, and D-Ribose.

    Do all this and maybe just maybe you'll achieve the Leptin Sensitivity you desire!

    Oh, and if you PAY Jack, you'll have even more access to secret parts of his website where success is surely within reach!


    What are my recommendations for achieving Leptin Sensitivity and the weight and body of your dreams?

    - Eat according to the Primal Blueprint. Once you are within 10-20 pounds of your goals weight, ensure you are not eating low carb. Add carbs, especially POTATOES and other starchy foods in to your daily eating. 1/2 to 1 pound should suffice.

    - Exercise the whole time. Yes, it's hard to gain muscle while losing fat, but at least you'll be stronger and reap the benefits of regular exercise.

    - Don't undereat for long stretches.

    - Get a good nights sleep.

    - Get some professional labs done by a doctor and evaluated for medical conditions such as hypothyroid, low Vit D, or other conditions that may hamper weight loss.
    Last edited by otzi; 02-09-2013 at 08:28 AM.

  4. #4
    Black Timber's Avatar
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    no one actually knows the ins's and out's of leptin. Oversimplification can only have one outcome!

  5. #5
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    BCAAs are necessary if you are doing intermittent fasting and weight lifting. If you're not doing the latter then I doubt it matters. If you are then buy BCAAs since there is no real alternative.

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    I found this artical useful for info on leptin - it's about my level ie fairly easy to follow Understanding Our Bodies: Leptin (The Fullness Hormone)*|*Nutrition Wonderland

    What I have figured is I lost a fair chunk of weight (about 30lbs) pretty quick and easy when I started primal, then it stalled and I lost another 15lbs or so very slowly with lots of fasting and under eating. My verdict - my body wasn't sensitive enough to my new lower level of leptin and so my appitite was in excess of my calorie need, so I under ate, which did cause weight loss, but further lowered my leptin levels.

    This may not have been a problem in its self, but I think combining that with a lack of sleep (leptin goes down when you sleep so not sleeping enough causes it to go up - cue big eating time) due to a baby of the no likey sleepy type - which leads to chromic stress which also hinders weight loss.

    Added to the is the evidence of my massive carb cravings and constant hunger I had thoughout January, where I was eating straight primal, plenty of veg including roots, butternut squash and some sweet potatos, which caused weight gain. Clearly something out of wack there when I've been primal for over a year.

    So far I have lost weight and got control of my appitite using the leptin reset method - dosn't mean I don't think Jack whatisface isn't a quack, I mean the electron thing is mental, everyone knows there is only one electron in the universe, but seing as it has virtually no mass and moves at virtualy instant speed it can be everywhere at once (this is only a theroy, but it has more solid science to back it up than one that claims we are fat as our pockets are too big and all our electrons fall out, dons't mean both ideas arn't a crock of shite though)

    But though it is working I'm not fully happy with it and as some of it is IMHO a crock I'm chaning it up.

    I think that just eating at meal times is important as a big meal increases your leptin, where as snacking, not so much, so eating twice till stuffed is better for increasing your leptin than grazing all day. It also reduces your calorie intake, in way that is managble and hopefully dosn't leave you hungry.

    I'm not convinced a coffe with heavy cream once a day outside of meal is gonna ruin everything and I'll have to go back to the start again.

    I think the protien works as it keeps you full for ages and is very saiting - so you eat less and it's easier to control your appite and thus reduce your calories - and if you think about it, a big kill and the grok that could gorge on protien then go 3 days without eating is more likely to survive than the grok who can only have a little bit and is hungry in 2 hours time.

    I don't think it has to be as soon as you get up, I've read his reasons I TBH I didn't really understand them, and I'd rather just not eat till lunch and work-out fasted in the morning at some point.
    You know all those pictures of Adam and Eve where they have belly button? Think about it..................... take as long as you need........................

  7. #7
    Tribal Rob's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by AMonkey View Post
    BCAAs are necessary if you are doing intermittent fasting and weight lifting. If you're not doing the latter then I doubt it matters. If you are then buy BCAAs since there is no real alternative.
    So I could skip the BCAA on morning when I'm running, sprinting and cycling and just take em on days when I'm boing bodyweight excersies or sandbag lifting?

    And can you point to to any easy to understand stuff that explains why they are needed - I'm not a complete numpty I just don't digest stuff on screen well (dyslexic) so find it hard to wade through propper research, ta
    You know all those pictures of Adam and Eve where they have belly button? Think about it..................... take as long as you need........................

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    Tribal Rob's Avatar
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    I've yet to find anything that convinces me BCAA are in anyway useful, I get enough of them from the meat and eggs I eat. I don't need to bulk up and I add muscle easily enough, I'm more interested in getting functionally strong and not beeing a bloater that looking ripped on the beach
    You know all those pictures of Adam and Eve where they have belly button? Think about it..................... take as long as you need........................

  9. #9
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    Quote Originally Posted by Tribal Rob View Post
    I've yet to find anything that convinces me BCAA are in anyway useful.....
    Cuz they aren't

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