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Thread: Does this mean I am in Ketosis/ higher metabolism or am I doing it wrong page 2

  1. #11
    Drumroll's Avatar
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    Choco, I think for the average person, fasting is very benefitial for just this purpose. It gives them a chance to use some of this fat for which they've so efficiently stored. I mean, if you're one of those almost "hyperlean" individuals who just can't store fat no matter what, I might argue against fasting in that case, but for most normal people it's not a bad thing, even healthy to run off of fat stores from time to time. It gives our bodies a chance to do what evolution wanted it to do. Of course, this is not something even Grok would have done constantly, but occasionally utilizing a fast makes me feel extremely good and I've noticed that right after the fast I often feel better than before I started it. That makes me think we were designed this way to burn fat as a primary fuel at least on an occasional basis.

    Same thing goes for occasional bouts of ketosis.

  2. #12
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    I have PCOS so I might have insulin resistance and I want to lose weight and I'm confused.

  3. #13
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    alas, I had rice and it hurt me and I threw up and then I had a burger and fries and chocolate I am a failure. I have pcos so it makes me confused as to what choices to make!

  4. #14
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    No, Niah, you are not a failure. But you have learnt one more thing that doesn't work. Do not allow confusion to derail you. Be patient with yourself, persevere and you will achieve your goals.

    PS for myself, I found weight loss quite achievable eating mainly meat, eggs and green veges. I seemed to hit on enough protein to keep me satisfied, low enough carbs to prevent cravings and just enough fat to cause my body to start burning my own stores. I wasn't really hungry, but be warned i did get grumpy. Keeping out of the house away from the pantry helped too

  5. #15
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    Quote Originally Posted by niah View Post
    alas, I had rice and it hurt me and I threw up and then I had a burger and fries and chocolate I am a failure. I have pcos so it makes me confused as to what choices to make!
    Use a nutrician tracker, like paleotrack.com that will analyse what you are eating and keep track of it. That might help you. Also, this is not a high-protean plan, but a high fat plan. Be sure your're eating enough fats.

    It takes many months for you body to fully adjust to this type of eating. You will certainly have days that are less (sometimes much) than perfect. And it take time to learn how to do it. Rome wasn't built in a day. So never feel like a failure. You can't undo the good effects in a day either. It took 400 years to destry Rome.

  6. #16
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    Niah, I'm sorry you've having a tough time. PCOS isn't easy to deal with, but a lot of women have indeed found help with a low carb primal (google primal PCOS, or enter PCOS into the search box above, and you'll find tons of discussion on this board and across the primal web).

    To keep things simple, you might try:
    -eliminate all grains (including rice for now) and sugars
    -minimize fructose because of insulin issues. So for a month, try no fruit
    -minimize starches (this might not be true for most primal folks, but for PCOS, it seems to help tremendously)
    -eat 2 to 3 reasonable servings of good protein each day. For most women, a reasonable serving is 4 to 6 oz or 2-3 eggs.
    -heavy cream and butter are usually fine for most PCOS women, but for now eliminate other dairy. Milk and cheese can cause insulin issues for many PCOS women
    -eat veggies; experiment a bit to see which ones work the best for you. Different women have different experiences with PCOS and veggies. Eat them with good fats. Cook the ones that have goitrogenic chemicals (ie, the cabbage family)
    -aim for more omega 3 fats and fewer omega 6 fats.
    -be careful with nuts for now--mostly because they're easy to overeat and can contain poor fats. Macademias and coconut seem to work the best for many PCOS women
    -make lots of bone broths
    -eat lots of seafood, take cod liver oil
    -make sure you're getting lots of saturated fat

    Good luck. Controlling insulin is key, as I'm sure you know. ChocoTacos advice may be spot on for many people, but not for women with PCOS.

  7. #17
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    +1

    Excellent sage recommendations.
    "Science is not belief but the will to find out." ~ Anonymous
    "Culture of the mind must be subservient to the heart." ~ Gandhi
    "The flogging will continue until morale improves." ~ Unknown


  8. #18
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    Quote Originally Posted by Drumroll View Post
    Choco, I think for the average person, fasting is very benefitial for just this purpose. It gives them a chance to use some of this fat for which they've so efficiently stored. I mean, if you're one of those almost "hyperlean" individuals who just can't store fat no matter what, I might argue against fasting in that case, but for most normal people it's not a bad thing, even healthy to run off of fat stores from time to time. It gives our bodies a chance to do what evolution wanted it to do. Of course, this is not something even Grok would have done constantly, but occasionally utilizing a fast makes me feel extremely good and I've noticed that right after the fast I often feel better than before I started it. That makes me think we were designed this way to burn fat as a primary fuel at least on an occasional basis.

    Same thing goes for occasional bouts of ketosis.
    I think fasting is a phenomenal idea. I don't generally eat until 12:30pm because I'm generally not hungry til lunch (I have a coffee in the morning around 8:00am and it suppresses my appetite). I guess my daily "fast window: is from around 9:30pm, when I typically finish dinner, to 12:30pm the next day. What's that? 15 hours? I usually like to toss in one 24 hour fast every single week just to make my bod feel real hunger that isn't induced by heavy lifting. IMO, that's a very healthy thing to do occasionally...but can quickly be an unhealthy thing if you overdo it.

    As an occasional stressor, maybe once a week or so, I believe in its health benefits. As a chronic stressor...well, there is no such thing as a healthy chronic stressor IMO. But the more overweight you are, the less of a stressor it is. If you're very overweight, you'll pull those calories almost entirely out of fat. If you're on the leaner size, you'll liekly lose more muscle vs fat. The 16-24 hour window seems to be ideal, where 16 hours will pull almost all fat, 24 hours is kind of where it begins to stall and returns diminish. The 48-72 hour range is the danger zone where metabolism starts to downregulate, at least that's what my research at Intermittent fasting diet for fat loss, muscle gain and health seems to have drilled into my head. I've never fasted longer than ~30 hours or so.
    Don't put your trust in anyone on this forum, including me. You are the key to your own success.

  9. #19
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    The 48-72 hour range is the danger zone where metabolism starts to down-regulate
    This is true. It's true of calorie deficits as well. After 72hrs of being in a calorie deficit metabolism starts to down-regulate. The decrease in metabolism at and after the 72hr mark is more pronounced for those with less to lose and not as pronounced(10-15lbs) in those with more to lose (20-30lbs).

  10. #20
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    Ah, but choco, if you want the benefits of some sustained autophagy which I believe is a very real thing, sometimes a longer fast in the 48-72 hour range is called for. Not that I'd recommend one does this regularly, but every once in a while perhaps. Again, it's all about moderation. This kind of fast is not about fat loss but about maximizing the other benefits of a fast. I agree that the fat loss benefits from a fast tend to diminish after about 34-36 hours. I say 36 because it takes a few hours to digest your last meal and truly enter the "fasted" state.

    I am more of a fan of the "dial in calories weekly" paradigm. As I've often posted, if someone needs 2,000 calories a day to maintain, then they will also maintain even if they fast two days a week, religiously, but still make sure to eat 14,000 calories within the week. In fact, they may lean out from the fasts but not lose overall weight because they've still eaten their calories for the week. This may mean a few days of higher cal eating,but I think the occasional (key word occasional) higher calorie day can be as much of a beneficial stressor as fasting can be, and combining the two together as you might need to to reach your weekly caloric total in this scenario, is a wonderful idea.
    Last edited by Drumroll; 02-07-2013 at 11:14 AM.

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