How My Primal Instincts Led Me to... Veganism page 3

[heatseeker]

Wow, 2ndChance, I wish you no ill will or snark or anything. It's honestly like looking at myself from years ago. You're about to take a journey I already took; I can't help but be wistful. And really, I was just trying to get people off your back, because I know there's no point in trying to change your mind, and I respect your decision to do what you feel you need to do.

If I may say--I promise I'm not trying to be condescending--this isn't the first criticism about your diet and your ideals you're going to sustain in times to come, nor is it even close to the most vicious, so start growing your thicker skin now. Friendly advice, I swear.

I see now that that's... George Harrison? In your icon? Can't hardly blame me for thinking the soft-focus dude in your icon was you.

Perhaps in Grok's time I'd be a welcome member of your tribe

Oh, honey. In Grok's time you'd be dead within the year.

[RichMahogany]

I have a fair few of my family who are vegan, but I think there are some things to consider.

In my opinion, the only way of eating that is not fraught with contradictions is that of the meat eater, and particularly the hunter who kills and eats his/her own food. If a life is sacred, whatever the size of the animal, those who subsist mainly on cereal crops are indirectly responsible for millions of deaths, of insects, or rodents via rodenticides and being chopped to bits during harvest, animals trapped in wire mesh surrounding fields etc etc.

In fact, I may eat the equivalent of 3 large animals per year, who knows, by eating no commodity crops at all, I am relatively free of guilt for the deaths of all those smaller animals.

I was listening to a podcast the other week, can't remember who, maybe Robb Wolf, but they recounted something which had a profound affect on me. They recalled a statement by some scientist or archeologist from a few years back who said....

"Vegans are the first group of people to deny man's place in nature"

I found it profound because we are part of nature, we have been for millions of years, and we are part of the food chain, at the top. That is nature, it is undeniable.

We do however, have the ability in the modern world to make choices about that. But denying yourself meat because you think that not eating it will make you free of responsibility for mass carnage in the animal world is denying the reality that millions of small animals, and larger ones too, as well as human beings on slave wages and poisoned by pesticides, die every year to produce wheat, soy beans, etc etc, at the hands of some of the biggest agri-business companies in the world.

I agree that the source of meat, and the life it has lived, should be considered, we should respect the lives that are lost for us to eat. I am on the verge of getting another air gun so I can hunt rabbit and pigeon. Find a local farm that will allow you to kill a few cockerels, or get into a share scheme with some locals for a beast or lamb etc.

Those are just a few random views that erupted as I typed.

Really nicely said. OP - listen up. This is someone who gets it. I sincerely hope you get it some day too.

[specsAreGrok]

Just a point of clarification- dairy cows are kept almost perpetually pregnant to support the perpetual lactation.

And their male babies are the tasty treat known as veal -- not much other use for male dairy cows.

[2ndChance]

@Rich: No, it isn't. I don't know what kind of soil its grown in, only that it's certified organic (and who knows if that means anything? The USDA doesn't care about us...)

@namelesswonder: You may be right about phytates, but this is something to consider (rather unscientific, but still food for thought, especially the last paragraph): Are Phytates Bad or Good? - Dr. Weil

One thing I completely agree with from your post is this-- "Being primal is about being resourceful." My goal is to have a small footprint on this planet. I believe humans were given intelligence not so that we could force other animals to bow down to us but so that we could realize how cruel it was to do so. I do minimal cardio these days, a lot of yoga, and that allows me to get by on less food--which seems is a kind goal on a planet where many don't have enough to eat.

[MEversbergII]

It's important to be happy. I wish you the best of luck, 2ndChance!

Also, since you are extending your empathy towards the plight of animals, I also encourage you to extend it to the plight of commercial agricultural workers - it's one of the reasons I quit quinoa!

M.

[2ndChance]

Wow, 2ndChance, I wish you no ill will or snark or anything. It's honestly like looking at myself from years ago. You're about to take a journey I already took; I can't help but be wistful. And really, I was just trying to get people off your back, because I know there's no point in trying to change your mind, and I respect your decision to do what you feel you need to do.

If I may say--I promise I'm not trying to be condescending--this isn't the first criticism about your diet and your ideals you're going to sustain in times to come, nor is it even close to the most vicious, so start growing your thicker skin now. Friendly advice, I swear.

I see now that that's... George Harrison? In your icon? Can't hardly blame me for thinking the soft-focus dude in your icon was you.



Oh, honey. In Grok's time you'd be dead within the year.

You see your past self in me, I see my past self in you. *shrug* I can take the criticism. If I couldn't, do you really think I would've posted this here?

[heatseeker]

I'm honestly not really sure why you posted this here. You don't know any of us IRL, you aren't beholden to any of us, you don't owe us an explanation, you're certainly not going to convince the vast majority of people here to go vegan, and you knew all it would do is rile everybody up. So I'm a little befuddled.

[Neckhammer]

Peace everybody, keep following your instincts!

tldr: but good luck, and follow your own parting advice in a couple months

[2ndChance]

@PureFunctionalFitness, I've been trying to cut down my intake of products from central America, and I don't eat wheat, soy, or corn. Organic rice is the only commodity crop I eat, and to be honest, I would like to one day grow my own food and know for certain that I am not inflicting suffering on anyone. I wouldn't say man is at the top of the food chain, either. Tell that to lions, sharks...

Also, I stopped eating quinoa awhile ago, but I did see that increased demand for it is hurting Peruvians, so I'm glad I did. I try to support a local health market that sells organic grains, legumes, spices (among other things) in bulk. None of us is a perfect citizen of the planet but we each have our own perception of what it means to be one and what we can do to get closer to that.

[2ndChance]

I post here for probably the same reason as you, heatseeker: to have an intelligent dialogue with others who care about their health. I don't think cutting meat should mean I have to stop posting here, and I feel inclined to share my reasons for doing so with others who might be having similar thoughts to the ones I had about eating animal products.