Why can't I look like Mark Sisson!?!?! page 18

[Zach]

Maybe we should start a eat MOAR fruit thread.

Today i had 4 bananas, 2 apples, 6 mini oranges, half a quart carton of strawberries and some OJ.

[ChocoTaco369]

I hated it, too, and it almost made me miss the bus! The Jaminet's list of 'Safe Starches' is pretty small: Potatoes, Sweet Potatoes, Rice, Taro, Sago, Plantain, and Tapioca.

I like that their food pyramid is 1/2 starches.

A big problem with PB is even when people are keeping their carbs at 50-150g, they may not be getting any of that as starch--all sucrose, fructose, and milk sugars. I didn't eat a potato or rice for 2 years, yet rarely went under 75g carbs.

I think a huge mistake is lumping all carbs together.

This one is for you tomorrow. Sorry for the horrible photography.



5 whole eggs cooked in 1/2 teaspoon of Kerrygold with about an ounce of goat cheese and some grated potatoes I baked on aluminum foil so I didn't need oil. Served cold I ate this exact meal 4 times last week. Since Thanksgiving when I started my cut, I'm down from 157 lbs at my peak to 149 lbs. All lifts maintained, chin-ups are up to 6 with 80 lbs on my dip belt. Going for 85 on Saturday! If you're going to cut, do it with lots of cholesterol and starch I guess!

[Knifegill]

I'm SO glad I joined long ago. This thread would have sent me packing in confusion. I found what works, I've given up coffee, I DON'T want to look skinny like Mark, I'd rather look like me!

There's no biological need for lots of starch. But I never gave up fruit 100% - always had my green apple a day and some berries, even mango or melon once a week or so for the most part except for a few weeks of near zero-carb. Yeah, calories are calories, there's no magic to eating gobs of fat. I even saw an actual study where people were actually satiated by protein rather than fat! But fat burns slower and cleaner in my experience. I stay full longer and don't crave fruit, etc. My mood is more stable, etc. I DO value the nutrition and flavor of a nice juicy piece of fruit. But as long as I've been alive, potatoes have not been well-digested. Don't know why (Sick of gut theories now! No more!), but I was fine without it and can continue to be without deleterious effects.

For evidence, I just found out I can bench 205 as my starting point. First time I've done one to find out my max. I understand it's not terribly impressive, but I only weigh 175-ish and have only done body-weight for years. On low-starch! I'll be improving that number rapidly, without starch! Just watch...

[Dirlot]

15% aint bad, but if you include the word cheat in the description of your diet you will NEVER get below 10%

[zoebird]

I have to say that I have noticed the following:

1. cutting grains/legumes made a huge difference on my digestion. But, I don't get sick if I have them. I assume this is because I am metabolically fine. Dairy has the same outcome, something I learned while vegan.

2. I opted to restrict carbs to 80-100/day on average in the beginning. It went really well -- no problems. I go through phases where I'll have more, but I rarely have less. It doesn't seem to matter if I have more. It usually shows up as fruit. I tend to one piece a day, but. . . sometimes I have more. Today I had cherries, nectarine, apricot (it's the season! ), and an green apple. THere's some orange in this salad that I'm about to have, too. YUM! So, i'm fruity today.

Sometimes I have rice, potatoes or sweet potatoes -- but I tend to be less lean when I do those. I'm fine with fruit and veggies though. I've always been like this.

3. since going primal, my caloric intake has decreased. since starting IF, it decreased even more. I'm interested to see if it lowers or what.

[ballenparks]

mother-of-god-meme.jpg
What have i created

[zoebird]

lol ballenparks.

[oxide]

Ballenparks, it's not you. I've been frustrated by this for a while.

Paleobunny, I think it would help to clarify. I -- and I'm talking about only me here -- define "low-carb" by comparing to CW, not within PB.

High-carb = 150g or more carb/day. This is getting close to CW. Or actually, CW is starting to latch on to lower carb.
Low-carb = 50-150g carb/day. This is typical primal.
Very low carb = 25-50g carb/day. VLC tends to be for those focused on fitness, or a temporary kick-start to break a plateau.
Ketosis = 0-25g carb/day. This works for only a few people, and everybody knows it and is cool with it.

I align roughly with Mark's numbers, with adjustments for body size and activity. So, to me, a "low-carb fundamentalist" is simply the 50-150 crowd. So of course the board is populated with them. Someone who likes more carb borders on CW, so yes there's going to be resistance. Now if your body feels better with more than 150g carb, that's an N=1, no biggie, it works for you, and I haven't seen you push it on other people, at all. But I'm not sure I'd call it strict Primal.

----------

Meanwhile, Chocotaco, you've been contradicting yourself in this thread. Like this:

Mark generally recommends you meter your carbohydrate intake, but it's solely because he believes fat and protein will better satiate you, causing you to eat less calories.

Silly me, I thought we should meter our carb intake because our bodies were evolved to burn fat for energy, you know, the whole Grok thing. We have the DNA to make both fat-burning hormones and sugar burning hormones. But we evolved on eating fat and protein, so the fat-burning set of hormones is more efficient and causes fewer digestive problems etc. Sure, fat burners eat fewer calories, but that's more of a side effect than a strict Primal tenet.

And there you are, saying it's all about calories again. Which you have done numerous times, even though you deny it. Now, if you don't like PB, or you think PB should be about satiety and calories, or if you think that the carb curve is PB's "downfall," fine. So you're following some other diet. Please make up your own name for your own diet and stop riding on Primal coattails to promote your rice and starch diet.

[oxide]

And giving them the hope that... Hey, after a little while low carb, where they get their issues under control, they can get back to a more normal lifestyle... including fruit and potatoes or sweet potatoes or rice if that's what they want.

Cori, isn't this exactly like Atkins or South Beach or the Zone or other diets which are structured in phases? Phase 1 is low carb. Phase 2,3 are about reintroducing carbs. The idea is that low- carb "fixes" your metabolism, and then you can go back to semi-CW. And aren't these the diets that fail miserably even if you follow them? Of course they fail. Phase 1 is only two weeks, not really long enough to fix the metabolism.* And then in Phase 2 and 3 you just re-break your metabolism anyway. When you go Primal sub 150, it's for life -- FOR A REASON. By the way, which is the "normal" lifestyle? The Grok lifestyle, or the SAD lifestyle? I thought that Primal WAS the normal lifestyle. Humans began to turn turn away from normal when they first planted corn and wheat 10,000 years ago, and went totally haywire with bad wheat and high fucktose corn syrup in about 1975.


Anyway, after all the posts on this thread, it's obvious that I missed something big. When did all the anti-CW diets creep back toward more carbs? Good lord, 21-day Transformation is only a year old... did Mark turn away from fat that quickly? I've seen his posts, and youtubes, and definitive guides, where sweet potatoes were for moderation, rice was for heavy duty athletics, and white potatoes were always off-limits. I've already convinced one friend to go Primal and he's lost 45 pounds and decreased his ibuprofin by 80%. Do you honestly think I'm going to back to my low-carb friend and say, oops, all the gurus were all wrong, here's a potato, eat up? Hell no. And now we're back to splitting hairs about which are safe starches and which aren't? Hey, after I've eaten my veggies, I'm already near 90 g carbs. I don't have room for ANY starches, safe or not. So you all can argue over rice vs. tapioca. I'll avoid both, thanks.



-------------
*I personally use carb flu as the metric for signs of a changing metabolism. Sometimes carb flu doesn't kick in until 3-4 weeks. If you go back to carbs after two weeks you're back at square 1.

[specsAreGrok]

I used to always wake up during the night to pee 2-4 times even. But now its not every night, and if I do, its once, and then I go immediately back to sleep.
And no never wake up wide awake during the night. Occasionally our children will come into bed with us which disturbs me a little, but can get back to sleep quickly.
Why. Is that not what I just said.

I definitely get up to pee in the middle of the night LESS than before going primal and sleep much more soundly as well. And thats even with a toddler often trying to stake his claim and push his old man out of bed with a finely placed foot to the back. I used to toss and turn all night long, not anymore. now its down and out until the sun comes up.