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Thread: Vitamin D3 Brand? page 4

  1. #31
    Viking's Avatar
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    BUMP. For newbies to vitamin D3 this is important. I am really just starting to learn about K2 and D3 and A synergy.

    Vitamin D3 CAN cause toxicity if you aren't getting any K2. Then it will drive calcium into your blood vessels and other soft tissue and take it from your bones. This is not just true of supplements, but from those in tropical climates who don't get enough K2. One study (sorry can't find it right now but I read about it starting in the Perfect Health Diet book which is very interesting) discussed life guards who had blood levels of D3 in the 80-90ng range who had serious heart disease issues from calcification. More study is definitely needed on this and we might consider that study anecdotal but it should raise warning flags for us, about D3 being toxic at almost any level if there's no K.

    I recently decided to up my D3 intake to 70ng from around 60 to help avoid getting the flu but have changed my mind as I learn more about the need for K2. Earlier in this thread hebsie linked to a Mercola article and video and I think everyone taking vitamin D3 who doesn't understand the K2 issues should read it and watch the vid. "Doctor Kate" outlines how much K2 you need for each 1000 IU of D3 and it's a lot.

    Instead of upping my D3 to 70ng I think I will target the low end of the optimal range, 50ng, and try to support that with the right amount of K2. This could be very expensive and/or force me to eat "slima beans", i.e. natto. I think I will like that almost as much as liver which literally makes me vomit in the sink when I try to consume it!

    I think we are still in the early days of understanding the vitamin D3/K2/A balance game but it's pretty clear we need to have significant K2 supplementation when supplementing D3.
    Last edited by Viking; 01-25-2013 at 11:21 AM. Reason: Typo

  2. #32
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    ChocoTaco369 is offline Senior Member
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    Quote Originally Posted by Viking View Post
    BUMP. For newbies to vitamin D3 this is important. I am really just starting to learn about K2 and D3 and A synergy.

    Vitamin D3 CAN cause toxicity if you aren't getting any K2. Then it will drive calcium into your blood vessels and other soft tissue and take it from your bones. This is not just true of supplements, but from those in tropical climates who don't get enough K2. One study (sorry can't find it right now but I read about it starting in the Perfect Health Diet book which is very interesting) discussed life guards who had blood levels of D3 in the 80-90ng range who had serious heart disease issues from calcification. More study is definitely needed on this and we might consider that study anecdotal but it should raise warning flags for us, about D3 being toxic at almost any level if there's no K.

    I recently decided to up my D3 intake to 70ng from around 60 to help avoid getting the flu but have changed my mind as I learn more about the need for K2. Earlier in this thread hebsie linked to a Mercola article and video and I think everyone taking vitamin D3 who doesn't understand the K2 issues should read it and watch the vid. "Doctor Kate" outlines how much K2 you need for each 1000 IU of D3 and it's a lot.

    Instead of upping my D3 to 70ng I think I will target the low end of the optimal range, 50ng, and try to support that with the right amount of K2. This could be very expensive and/or force me to eat "slima beans", i.e. natto. I think I will like that almost as much as liver which literally makes me vomit in the sink when I try to consume it!

    I think we are still in the early days of understanding the vitamin D3/K2/A balance game but it's pretty clear we need to have significant K2 supplementation when supplementing D3.
    This is exactly what my concern is, and it is a phenomenal post. Thank you, Viking.

    We are only in the early stages of understanding these synergies, and on top of that, I'm sure there are countless synergies we haven't even discovered yet! This is what has turned me from a daily vitamin popper into a very occasional user. Citing "studies" are often laughable because they only show effects over weeks and months. Initially, they very well could be good for you. But what happens in years? I can cite you studies that show wheat is only harmful to celiacs, and you'll laugh because you'll say, "It takes years or decades for the damage to accumulate!"

    My thoughts exactly with these fat soluble vitamins - Vitamin D, fish oil and all this potentially rancid and fat-accumulating stuff we take today in the name of health.
    Don't put your trust in anyone on this forum, including me. You are the key to your own success.

  3. #33
    Viking's Avatar
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    Hey ChocoTaco thanks for the comments. I agree with your positions on taking supplements in general. I have questions for the group about how Grok got K2 and how much sun-D3 they absorbed. I might start a new thread to focus on that, but we know Grok didn't have natto, nor D3 nor K2 supplements. He got an amount of D3 from sunlight exposure and K2 and A from food. So how much and what from? If we can assume Grok evolved to optimize at the levels he was consuming then we can assume he was not deficient.

  4. #34
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    To me, this is all about balance and trade-offs. Sure, we don't know the golden ratio of these vitamins. We also might have some adverse effects from these supplements. However, we know for sure that being deficient is definitively bad.

    Take me, for example, my vitamin D level was low, even after some supplementation, indicating that I was even more deficient in the past. We know for a fact that vitamin D deficiency is linked to all kinds of really bad things such as heart disease and cancer. So, I have a choice, keep it low and know that I am at a higher risk for all these bad things, or take some supplements and increase my levels to a healthy range with potentially unknown adverse effects. I will take my chances with the unknown, rather with the known bad.

    I did get the Carlson K2, and my plan is to take the 5mg pill daily for maybe 1-2 weeks, and then gradually decrease until I take maybe one every week or so. I will also monitor my D levels, and take fewer D3 supplements once the level is good. This seems like a sensible approach to avoiding known deficiencies.

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