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    YogaBare's Avatar
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    Inflammation - buzz word of the year?

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    So in medical circles (and beyond), inflammation is being talked about a lot, and is believed to be a cause / contributing factor to many diseases (CVD, cancer, diabetes etc.)

    Pple talk about CRP markers, and it seems to be desirable to have these as low as possible. A lot of diets aim to reduce inflammation in the body by emphasising anti-inflammatory foods.

    But, I know one or two sick people who have no inflammation in their body. How is this possible? Maybe a bit of inflammation could be a good thing sometimes?
    "I think the basic anti-aging diet is also the best diet for prevention and treatment of diabetes, scleroderma, and the various "connective tissue diseases." This would emphasize high protein, low unsaturated fats, low iron, and high antioxidant consumption, with a moderate or low starch consumption.

    In practice, this means that a major part of the diet should be milk, cheese, eggs, shellfish, fruits and coconut oil, with vitamin E and salt as the safest supplements."

    - Ray Peat

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    Yup, in the case of acute disease or illness inflammation is a vitally important part of the healing process.

    I wouldn't say its he buzz word of "the year" though. I think chronic inflammation has been on the radar for quite a while. The problem even in the case of chronic inflammation is not really the inflammation itself, but what it indicates. It can indicate several things in different cases, but the short list is autoimmune dysfunction, chronically poor lifestyle choices (toxins), or even chronic stress like poor circadian rhythm.

    I'm actually getting tired of seeing me link stuff too.....but this guys blog name is a perfect fit (plus he's always ripping into dr. oz which is funny as heck) http://coolinginflammation.blogspot.com/
    Last edited by Neckhammer; 01-04-2013 at 05:26 AM.

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    100% agree with Neckhammer... inflammation is a symptom of the problem, not the problem itself. You have to consider what is causing it.

    AFAIK eliminating chronic inflammation via an effective o3/o6 ratio, avoiding grains, etc has always been one of the cornerstones of the MDA lifestyle so the is plenty of info out there...

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    I agree with NH too BUT I have been told by doctors that inflammation is not just a symptom. Certain foods / stresses can cause an inflammatory response, and if the body is chronically inflamed due to lifestyle / environment, it becomes a fertile ground for many diseases to take root. For example, cholesterol is not harmful in itself, but if the body is inflamed (and hence more "sticky") there's a greater chance that the cholesterol particles can attach to wall linings and form plaques, and lead to you-know-what.

    Anyway, the question was more about whether having zero inflammation in the body may not be such a good thing. Perhaps it's absence does not mean that there is no disease present in the body, but that the body's defense mechanisms are not working. Perhaps less inflammation could be symptomatic of an auto immune disease?

    Furthermore, if there is infection in the body, is it always a good thing to eat anti inflammatory foods? Maybe it's better to eat foods that are mildly inflammatory (like fruit) in order to provoke the body's defense response?
    "I think the basic anti-aging diet is also the best diet for prevention and treatment of diabetes, scleroderma, and the various "connective tissue diseases." This would emphasize high protein, low unsaturated fats, low iron, and high antioxidant consumption, with a moderate or low starch consumption.

    In practice, this means that a major part of the diet should be milk, cheese, eggs, shellfish, fruits and coconut oil, with vitamin E and salt as the safest supplements."

    - Ray Peat

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    Well I think the first paragraph is a bit of conjecture about root cause. If lifestyle -> inflammation -> disease and your an allopathic doctor then you would treat either the inflammation or the disease (both in my view are symptoms of inappropriate lifestyle). Of course this is not speaking of hard wired genetic defects, but diseases of civilization. So even in your own words the root cause was "certain foods/stresses".

    As to zero inflammation, thats interesting. As long as the body has the constituents to build the the signaling molecules necessary for inflammation then I would believe that a healthy body would produce inflammation when necessary. The only reason I could think this wouldn't happen is if there was some sort of genetic defect. In which case I actually wouldn't expect that person to live very long. Has this person you speak of ever sprained an ankle? Have they never experienced an inflammatory response of any sort?

    As to the inflammatory foods....No, I'm not really a fan of that thought process. The bodies defenses should be working optimally if the constituents of health have been given to it up to the point. I don't think you need to feed it something thats inflammatory to kick it into gear. But, that is simply my opinion.

    By the way I absolutely love this philosophy of looking at infection not as a battle between the body and invaders, but as a form of housecleaning where we are working with our environment to stay well:

    http://philipincao.crestonecolorado..../Infection.pdf
    Last edited by Neckhammer; 01-04-2013 at 07:51 AM.

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    There is no such thing as not having any inflammation or eating a non inflammatory diet. There are environmental stresses present at all times and every food has inflammatory qualities.

    I think that everyone would do well to reduce inflammation as much as thy can. There is no way to be free of it and if you have an acute injury then your body will do what it needs to do. Having chronic inflammation is never a good thing and always indicates something wrong.

    As for your friends, how do thy know? Did they have blood tests taken or are they just going off of how they feel? What kind of diseases do they have?

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    My husband has psoriatic arthritis, which is an inflammatory autoimmune condition. He's had his CRP measured many times, and several times DURING flares (at which point the baker's cyst was so inflamed that it was literally the size of a golf ball sticking out of his knee).

    The results were always the same; his CRP levels were always perfect. It's never been anything but normal. When he questioned his specialists about this, the doctors told him that CRP is a marker for generalized inflammation, which apparently he doesn't have.

    Now, I don't know about you, but having a normal CRP level during a serious autoimmune inflammatory attack kind of makes me question the purpose of measuring it.

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    Quote Originally Posted by YogaBare View Post
    Maybe it's better to eat foods that are mildly inflammatory (like fruit) in order to provoke the body's defense response?
    Where did you learn that fruit is inflammatory? I've never heard this before.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Neckhammer View Post
    Well I think the first paragraph is a bit of conjecture about root cause. If lifestyle -> inflammation -> disease and your an allopathic doctor then you would treat either the inflammation or the disease (both in my view are symptoms of inappropriate lifestyle). Of course this is not speaking of hard wired genetic defects, but diseases of civilization. So even in your own words the root cause was "certain foods/stresses".

    As to zero inflammation, thats interesting. As long as the body has the constituents to build the the signaling molecules necessary for inflammation then I would believe that a healthy body would produce inflammation when necessary. The only reason I could think this wouldn't happen is if there was some sort of genetic defect.
    Well, I was kind of referring to two things simultaneously: 1) Lifestyle can create inflammation which can contribute to disease, 2) Once disease is present in a body you would imagine that it would be chronically inflamed in response to that?

    Genetic defect, or potentially a sign that the body's immune response was not working?

    Quote Originally Posted by Zach View Post
    As for your friends, how do thy know? Did they have blood tests taken or are they just going off of how they feel? What kind of diseases do they have?
    Yip, this person gets bloods done regularly, and her CPR is always extremely low. In spite of the fact that she has Hashimotos, Pernicious anemia, nerve damage, Arrhythmia and Tachycardia (yes, posting about my mum again ). I'm no expert, but that's some pretty serious stuff, and I would think that with those conditions there should be some inflammation in teh body!

    This is why I'm saying - Low CPR is interpreted as a sign of health, but maybe it's not!
    "I think the basic anti-aging diet is also the best diet for prevention and treatment of diabetes, scleroderma, and the various "connective tissue diseases." This would emphasize high protein, low unsaturated fats, low iron, and high antioxidant consumption, with a moderate or low starch consumption.

    In practice, this means that a major part of the diet should be milk, cheese, eggs, shellfish, fruits and coconut oil, with vitamin E and salt as the safest supplements."

    - Ray Peat

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    Quote Originally Posted by BestBetter View Post
    My husband has psoriatic arthritis, which is an inflammatory autoimmune condition. He's had his CRP measured many times, and several times DURING flares (at which point the baker's cyst was so inflamed that it was literally the size of a golf ball sticking out of his knee).

    The results were always the same; his CRP levels were always perfect. It's never been anything but normal. When he questioned his specialists about this, the doctors told him that CRP is a marker for generalized inflammation, which apparently he doesn't have.

    Now, I don't know about you, but having a normal CRP level during a serious autoimmune inflammatory attack kind of makes me question the purpose of measuring it.
    Yeah ditto... hence the title of the post. It seems like everyone is talking about inflammation these days, but I find it a bit confusing... and contradictory.

    Quote Originally Posted by BestBetter View Post
    Where did you learn that fruit is inflammatory? I've never heard this before.
    Not all, but some are: Nutrition Facts and Analysis for Blueberries, raw
    "I think the basic anti-aging diet is also the best diet for prevention and treatment of diabetes, scleroderma, and the various "connective tissue diseases." This would emphasize high protein, low unsaturated fats, low iron, and high antioxidant consumption, with a moderate or low starch consumption.

    In practice, this means that a major part of the diet should be milk, cheese, eggs, shellfish, fruits and coconut oil, with vitamin E and salt as the safest supplements."

    - Ray Peat

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