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Thread: Primal diet - Pros and Cons? page 4

  1. #31
    otzi's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Paleobird View Post
    ... running around going, "Soda and candy rock and you all are just stupid! Neener Neener Neener!" gets you called a troll for a reason.
    I visit lots of forums, low carb, low fat, diabetes, body building, and even some of the quacks...Kruse, Roddy, Chief Rock, and most of the paleo.

    I love seeing the different viewpoints, and have even learnt a few things. It's very, very rare I post anywhere but here and one or two others. I just can't imagine going to a low carb forum and brow-beating them to try the Potato Diet or giving up fried foods, even though I think I could enlighten them on a few things...just doesn't seem right.

  2. #32
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    Quote Originally Posted by otzi View Post
    I visit lots of forums, low carb, low fat, diabetes, body building, and even some of the quacks...Kruse, Roddy, Chief Rock, and most of the paleo.

    I love seeing the different viewpoints, and have even learnt a few things. It's very, very rare I post anywhere but here and one or two others. I just can't imagine going to a low carb forum and brow-beating them to try the Potato Diet or giving up fried foods, even though I think I could enlighten them on a few things...just doesn't seem right.
    For the last time, where am i brow beating anyone??? Where am i telling anyone to ditch this diet? I would say the majority of my posts are helpful an in centext to what the OP is asking, the rest is trying to defend myself from the militant low carb.

  3. #33
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    Quote Originally Posted by otzi View Post
    I visit lots of forums, low carb, low fat, diabetes, body building, and even some of the quacks...Kruse, Roddy, Chief Rock, and most of the paleo.

    I love seeing the different viewpoints, and have even learnt a few things. It's very, very rare I post anywhere but here and one or two others. I just can't imagine going to a low carb forum and brow-beating them to try the Potato Diet or giving up fried foods, even though I think I could enlighten them on a few things...just doesn't seem right.
    Your post on 180health:

    I think the answer is yes. There are some short-comings with paleo, however, the biggest being that people make it ‘Low Carb’. I think that is changing rapidly, though.

    Otherwise, the adoption of eating non-processed, whole foods, exercising, getting good sleep, and paying attention to nutrition I think are all great things.I think the answer is yes.
    This is a low carb forum? FYI, I actually agree with your last sentence and everything I eat is a "whole food". That is, I know what everything in the ingredients is and does.
    Time is passing so quickly. Right now, I feel like complaining to Einstein. Whether time is slow or fast depends on perception. Relativity theory is so romantic. And so sad.

  4. #34
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    The problem isn't with Primal itself, but rather the "Carbohydrate Curve." People around here are too focused on fat and too afraid of carbohydrate. Too much fat and too high of a protein-to-carbohydrate ratio leads to a lagging thyroid, fatigued adrenals, poor performing mitochonidria, elevated cortisol and elevated adrenaline. I am strongly against a high fat diet. It generally consists of far too much muscle meat, far too many goitrogens and oxalates, a terrible calcium-to-phosphate ratio, too much polyunsaturated fat as a percentage of daily calories and too few carbohydrate to balance out protein. And when I say carbohydrate, I mean strictly fruit and starch, not roots and vegetables.

    Embrace whole foods. Eat a bit of everything. Eat more bone-in cuts of meat rich in gelatin and less muscle meat. Eat more calcium (quality dairy) - not green vegetable calcium, which humans can't really absorb. Make sure you're getting at least 1g of carbohydrate for every gram of protein you eat. Otherwise, you're generating too much glucagon versus insulin (protein generates glucacon, carbohydrate generates insulin - glucacon is catabolic, it breaks you down while insulin builds you up). And you also lose your insulin sensitivity and degrade your gut bacteria - gut bacteria thrive off sugars, you know! No fruit and no starch = a weak gut and lots of food sensitivities.

    Embrace all whole food and do not make your choices based on macronutrient breakdown. Make it based on what you feel best on. I significantly cut down my intake of vegetables and muscle meats for more eggs, cheese, fruits and starches and the difference in my health, vitality, energy and libido is huge. Cutting out fats for more sugars was one of the best decisions I ever made, and IMO it's what is holding a lot of people back here.
    Last edited by ChocoTaco369; 12-21-2012 at 01:51 PM.
    Don't put your trust in anyone on this forum, including me. You are the key to your own success.

  5. #35
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    Quote Originally Posted by Derpamix View Post
    You twist words constantly to further your own agenda, no secret there. I talk about sugar being good for you(raw pure sugar, fruit, etc) yet suddenly I'm going around telling people to eat a bunch of candy.

    I rarely, if ever, talk about what I personally eat as reference for things I post. You're the only one doing that.
    Nobody is anti-fruit across the board around here. That is another one of the things to customize. Works for some not for others.

    Last time I checked gummy bears were candy. And your buddy Zach, when called out on eating candy and soda said, "Yes I do enjoy the finer things in life". I don't know that you advocate a boatload of gummy bears but you do advocate a boatload of refined sugar. Daily. Those words don't need twisting. They speak for themselves.

  6. #36
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    Hey Zach,

    Sorry you had no pros on Primal! What do you think caused all your cons? Was it the low carb or something else?

  7. #37
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    Choco, I'm would actually be really interested to hear what your pros and cons have been, if you've had them.

  8. #38
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    Quote Originally Posted by Paleobird View Post
    Nobody is anti-fruit across the board around here. That is another one of the things to customize. Works for some not for others.

    Last time I checked gummy bears were candy. And your buddy Zach, when called out on eating candy and soda said, "Yes I do enjoy the finer things in life". I don't know that you advocate a boatload of gummy bears but you do advocate a boatload of refined sugar. Daily. Those words don't need twisting. They speak for themselves.
    Refined sugar? Where? Where do I ever give dietary advice that even resembles my own? When I was giving advice to Knifegill, I never mentioned anything except gelatin(fyi I meant great lakes beef gelatin, and bone broth), fruit, raw sugar and dairy. No coke, no gummy bears, no refined sugar.
    Time is passing so quickly. Right now, I feel like complaining to Einstein. Whether time is slow or fast depends on perception. Relativity theory is so romantic. And so sad.

  9. #39
    Paleobird's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by ChocoTaco369 View Post
    The problem isn't with Primal itself, but rather the "Carbohydrate Curve." People around here are too focused on fat and too afraid of carbohydrate. Too much fat and too high of a protein-to-carbohydrate ratio leads to a lagging thyroid, fatigued adrenals, poor performing mitochonidria, elevated cortisol and elevated adrenaline. I am strongly against a high fat diet. It generally consists of far too much muscle meat, far too many goitrogens and oxalates, a terrible calcium-to-phosphate ratio, too much polyunsaturated fat as a percentage of daily calories and too few carbohydrate to balance out protein. And when I say carbohydrate, I mean strictly fruit and starch, not roots and vegetables.

    Embrace whole foods. Eat a bit of everything. Eat more bone-in cuts of meat rich in gelatin and less muscle meat. Eat more calcium (quality dairy) - not green vegetable calcium, which humans can't really absorb. Make sure you're getting at least 1g of carbohydrate for every gram of protein you eat. Otherwise, you're generating too much glucagon versus insulin (protein generates glucacon, carbohydrate generates insulin - glucacon is catabolic, it breaks you down while insulin builds you up). And you also lose your insulin sensitivity and degrade your gut bacteria - gut bacteria thrive off sugars, you know! No fruit and no starch = a weak gut and lots of food sensitivities.

    Embrace all whole food and do not make your choices based on macronutrient breakdown. Make it based on what you feel best on. I significantly cut down my intake of vegetables and muscle meats for more eggs, cheese, fruits and starches and the difference in my health, vitality, energy and libido is huge. Cutting out fats for more sugars was one of the best decisions I ever made, and IMO it's what is holding a lot of people back here.
    Oh, Choco. Your idea that Primal is carb-phobic is so 2009. Your list of the alleged ills that are sure to befall any low carbers is just flat out wrong but yet you keep repeating it.

    Then you keep banging on the "eat whole real foods" drum as if anyone around here other than the candy and soda swillers even disagreed with you. That is not a new idea. It is the cornerstone of PB. Stop acting like you invented it.
    Last edited by Paleobird; 12-21-2012 at 01:58 PM.

  10. #40
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    Well, first of all, even the diet that doctors normally recommend tell you to eat more vegetables and less fatty foods. I've come to understand that "fatty foods" is a code word for junk food, i.e. deep fried stuff, sugar, pastries--all things the PB tells you to avoid. So, there really isn't much about the Primal Blueprint diet to be suspicious of.

    The only part that might lift an eyebrow is to avoid food-industry-created fats and grains. Once you do a little reading, you see that food-industry-created fats are not healthier than natural fats, and natural fats from animals are not poison. You also learn that grains are at best filler calories with little actual nutritional value that you couldn't find in greater quantities in other foods. So a) you're not missing anything on a Primal diet and b) you aren't adding anything truly bad.

    Even if you couldn't adhere to the no grains and eat more animal fat ideas, if you did everything else in the Primal Blueprint and ate some whole grains and beans and avoided animal fat and used mostly olive oil you'd then have the Mediterranean diet and your doctor would think you were the healthiest person in the world.

    Anyway, for me:

    Pros
    • Got my appetite under control in the beginning well enough I could lose about 20-25lbs.
    • Improved mood and sense of well-being
    • Realized it wasn't my fault I always ate too much, it was that I was eating foods that made me hungry in 2 hours and messed up my blood sugar. I had some insulin resistance going on.
    • Fixed the insulin resistance pretty nicely. Not that I'm back on the pastries or anything to see if it was a cure, but I at least know how to keep it from getting worse.
    • Learned to cook.
    • Eat better quality food that tastes so much better and makes me feel good.


    Cons
    • Although my appetite is under control and I no longer wake up a little bit heavier every day, I don't seem to have the ability to control my appetite enough to lose any more weight.


    Nons
    • My hair is still thin and fine and falls out a lot. Got some serious seborrhea, too. I don't think this diet caused it, but it certainly didn't prevent it or make my hair nicer than before.
    • Still heading toward menopause.
    • My neck is falling just like my mother and grandmother. I'm going to have a heavy neck in my old age.
    • I'm still going to get old.
    Female, 5'3", 49, Starting weight: 163lbs. Current weight: 135 (more or less).
    Starting squat: 45lbs. Highest squat: 167.5 x 2. Current Deadlift: 195 x 3

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