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Thread: Looking visibly aged now, more than expected. page 7

  1. #61
    PureFunctionalFitness's Avatar
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    Primal Fuel
    Quote Originally Posted by ChocoTaco369 View Post
    I'm impressed. You are very well-read and intelligent.

    Paleo dieters eat far too much phosphate-rich muscle meat. When you eat lots of muscle meat and vegetables, you do a lot of things:

    1.) You throw your calcium : phosphate ratio out of whack. You can break this up by eating gelatin-rich bone-in cuts of meat (as mentioned), or you could consume more dairy and eggs in lieu of slabs of muscle.

    2.) Low-carb diets are stressful and promote aging. Your body WANTS to take the easiest method of creating energy. When you are constantly in a state of gluconeogenesis from lack of carbohydrate consumption, you are constantly in a state of stress. Low-carbers have high levels of adrenaline (a major stressor), high levels of cortisol (a stressor) and low levels of CO2 (meaning your mitochondria are less robust and do not respire well). Eat more sugar and starch, less fat and less phosphate-rich protein sources (slabs of muscle meat).

    Essentially, since your brain runs on glucose, you are putting your body in a constant state of starvation regardless of calorie intake. You can go through small stints of low carbohydrate dieting - quick, brief levels of stress strengthen you - but to do it for weeks, months or years is devastating to your body. You're going to look old and haggard like an Inuit.
    So how about the brain using ketones as a preferred source of fuel when low carbing, and with moderate protein intake, this negates gluconeogenesis from either dietary protein or by muscle breakdown.

    Phinney/Volek cover this in detail in 'The Art and Science of Low Casrbohydrate Living'.

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    Quote Originally Posted by ChocoTaco369 View Post
    I'm impressed. You are very well-read and intelligent.
    Thanks! I have a great respect for you and the way you present your arguments. I agree with the majority of your points as well.

    Specifically that macronutrients should be balanced. I've pointed out before that there is a synergistic way in which your body handles them. Carbs push blood sugar up, protein pulls it down, and fat slows carbs and protein from entering the blood stream. Given this, it's obvious you should work on a balanced way to have each macronutrient.
    Last edited by Derpamix; 12-14-2012 at 01:22 PM.
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    Add some carbs: potatoes, fruit, and even some sugar if you dare. Coconut oil is helpful if you have overeaten a lot of nuts and have a PUFA overload. You might try some gelatin to balance the amino acids in all the meat; Jello contains glycine and seems to be a great stress reliever. Walk a lot; walking is anti-inflammatory. If you look older, it's probably because you are inflamed.

    Superficially, consider maybe doing some light TCA peels. Buy a Clarisonic to wash your face with. You might also try copper peptides. My skin was trashed a few years ago & the CPs have really helped:
    SKIN BIOLOGY - HOME PAGE: Revitalize and Improve Your Skin's Appearance with Age-Defying Copper Peptides by Loren Pickart PhD

  4. #64
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    Quote Originally Posted by Knifegill View Post
    Whoa. So much info!
    I think well cooked they're okay, problem is excessive carotene is shown to cause further thyroid damage especially in a compromised metabolism. With the beta-carotene in carrots, it's bound to the fiber, which isn't absorbed so that's why eating a carrot salad is okay.

    Low FAT, now that does appear to induce excessive aging. But the massive amounts of inflammantion those of us with screwed up sugar metabolisms run around with every day.. getting rid of that, no way it's more aging than going ahead and eating all the carbs that are killing us.
    It's actually a fat that is accelerating aging. If you're deriving the majority of your calories from fat, it's impossible to avoid polyunsaturated fatty acids. High amounts of PUFA produce inflammation, low thyroid, lipid peroxides, free radicals, etc

    Saturated fats may be protective, but they're not needed in high amounts and by limiting fat consumption, and eating safe meats, dairy, etc it becomes a lot easier to manage unsaturated fat consumption. So, it's actually the opposite.
    Last edited by Derpamix; 12-14-2012 at 01:47 PM.
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  5. #65
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    Quote Originally Posted by PureFunctionalFitness View Post
    So how about the brain using ketones as a preferred source of fuel when low carbing, and with moderate protein intake, this negates gluconeogenesis from either dietary protein or by muscle breakdown.

    Phinney/Volek cover this in detail in 'The Art and Science of Low Casrbohydrate Living'.
    The brain always uses glucose. Even in ketosis, ketones only supplement glucose. If there is ever a time your brain is not using glucose, it means you are dead.

    If you are in ketosis, you are in gluconeogenesis.
    Don't put your trust in anyone on this forum, including me. You are the key to your own success.

  6. #66
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    Quote Originally Posted by Derpamix View Post
    I think well cooked they're okay, problem is excessive carotene is shown to cause further thyroid damage especially in a compromised metabolism. With the beta-carotene in carrots, it's bound to the fiber, which isn't absorbed so that's why eating a carrot salad is okay.
    I eat white sweet potatoes. Not orange sweet potatoes. Just don't buy the orange ones. I will never not eat sweet potatoes.

    Quote Originally Posted by Derpamix View Post
    It's actually a fat that is accelerating aging. If you're deriving the majority of your calories from fat, it's impossible to avoid polyunsaturated fatty acids. High amounts of PUFA produce inflammation, low thyroid, lipid peroxides, free radicals, etc
    I don't agree that all polyunsaturated fat is bad. I believe salmon oil to be very unhealthy, but I do not believe wild caught salmon to be healthy. Isolated PUFA oils may oxidize rapidly upon ingestion, but whole foods come paired with antioxidants that keep the animal or plant from aging rapidly and dying. I don't agree that salmon, walnuts and almonds are unhealthy, but I won't be ingesting any of those oils isolated.

    Quote Originally Posted by Derpamix View Post
    Saturated fats may be protective, but they're not needed in high amounts and by limiting fat consumption, and eating safe meats, dairy, etc it becomes a lot easier to manage unsaturated fat consumption. So, it's actually the opposite.
    Something that Peat does not address is the ideal lipid profile of a human. What is it exactly? Does anyone know? We are not ruminants where fat should be saturated and monounsaturated with next to no PUFA in our tissue. We are more like pigs. We should carry a significant amount of PUFA and arachidonic acid. At least that's my opinion. Polyunsaturated fat makes cell membranes soft and permeable. Too much and your cells leak, but not enough and they become too stiff. Aren't omega 3 and omega 6 considered EFA's because when people were fed fully hydrogenated oils containing zero PUFA for a long period of time, their cell membranes became so stiff the people died? I don't believe we should have a very low PUFA diet. I believe that the studies are skewed because the sources of PUFA are usually awful - fish oil, soybean oil, grains, legumes, etc. If the studies only used wild caught salmon and raw, soaked, sprouted walnuts as a PUFA source, I think opinions would change.
    Don't put your trust in anyone on this forum, including me. You are the key to your own success.

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    Quote Originally Posted by PureFunctionalFitness View Post
    So how about the brain using ketones as a preferred source of fuel when low carbing, and with moderate protein intake, this negates gluconeogenesis from either dietary protein or by muscle breakdown.

    Phinney/Volek cover this in detail in 'The Art and Science of Low Casrbohydrate Living'.
    Yeah, basically there is no reason to jump to the conclusion that its (OP seeing a few wrinkles or looking hagard) due to low carb when the elephant in the room is swing shifts and reduced weight. And yes you still may produce glucose via gluconeogenesis, but the amount needed via ketone adaptation is reduced by about half making it quite easy to achieve.
    Last edited by Neckhammer; 12-14-2012 at 02:00 PM.

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    I agree with the recommendations of eating less protein, less saturated fat, more primal-friendly starch, and cutting back on the night shifts if you can.

    Also, in addition to fish oil from whole fish, evening primrose oil and vitamin E are very beneficial for the skin. Also, eating more non starchy veggies. The onion familiy is usually easy on the digestion and high in antioxidants, especially garlic, leeks and red onions. Green leafy vegetables and herbs are generally quite easy to digest.

    A poor level of cellular hydration can contribute to premature ageing of the skin ... magnesium, pantothenic acid and a few other micronutrients (can't remember them off the top of my head) play important roles.
    F 5 ft 3. HW: 196 lbs. Primal SW (May 2011): 182 lbs (42% BF)... W June '12: 160 lbs (29% BF) (UK size 12, US size 8). GW: ~24% BF - have ditched the scales til I fit into a pair of UK size 10 bootcut jeans. Currently aligning towards 'The Perfect Health Diet' having swapped some fat for potatoes.

  9. #69
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    Quote Originally Posted by PureFunctionalFitness View Post
    So how about the brain using ketones as a preferred source of fuel when low carbing, and with moderate protein intake, this negates gluconeogenesis from either dietary protein or by muscle breakdown.
    Just noticed this post, and this doesn't even make sense given the most basic biology understanding.

    Metabolism - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

    Given that nothing can occur without ATP.

    Adenosine triphosphate - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

    Gluconeogenesis is particularly ineffective since it requires 6 molecules of ATP to perform a task. It also does so by converting your own body tissues.
    Longing is the agony of the nearness of the distant

  10. #70
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    Quote Originally Posted by Neckhammer View Post
    Yeah, basically there is no reason to jump to the conclusion that its (OP seeing a few wrinkles or looking hagard) due to low carb when the elephant in the room is swing shifts and reduced weight.
    This isn't an isolated post, though. Do a forum search for people that have thyroid issues, thinning hair/hair falling out, chills after eating, etc, that have been doing Primal for months or years that initially felt great then started to reverse their pgoress. It's pretty common.

    We know being in a chronic state of gluconeogenesis increases adrenaline, cortisol, serotonin and slows thyroid. We know that adrenaline, cortisol and serotonin are three of our greatest stress hormones. We also know that we cannot contract disease without stress - all disease is caused by inflammation and all inflammation is caused by stress, so no stress = no disease. Brief periods of stress = hormesis, which is very beneficial. Chronic periods of stress = inflammatory. If low carbohydrate diets increase stress hormones and stress hormones are degenerative, then longterm carbohydrate restriction can easily become degenerative. Again, look at the rapid aging of the Inuit.

    No one is saying that his diet is the sole reason why he's having issues, but it is certainly a contributing factor. No society is low carbohydrate by choice. Low carbohydrate societies exist solely because they have little option to eat carbohydrate.
    Don't put your trust in anyone on this forum, including me. You are the key to your own success.

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