Research that vegan diet is best and our ancestors were not big meat eaters page 3

[Dirlot]

@eenu not a single reference in the second McDougall post and I have read he some of his works that have been posted and they are beyond bad. So if you have something for him post it.

As for the 1st link I have fond one bit of info on the Nurses Health Study - Trans fats are bad! Wow...like we all didn't know that. Guess what most trans fats came from processed vegetable oils.

Then he mentions around the 3:35 mark that cholesterol guidelines may not be low enough even though there is increasing evidence that ratio not level is a better marker for for heart disease - face meet palm.

Then at 6:30 he quotes a study of a single meal high in animal fat paralyzes your arteries. The meal you ask? A sausage and egg McMuffin - full of grains, sugar and processed vegetable oils - wtf!

If you have a specific study you would like us to read please post it - life if too short to get that much misinformation plus blatantly obvious information so fast.

Please post specific studies NOT youtube clips.

[eenu]

As for the 1st link I have fond one bit of info on the Nurses Health Study - Trans fats are bad! Wow...like we all didn't know that. Guess what most trans fats came from processed vegetable oils.

Then he mentions around the 3:35 mark that cholesterol guidelines may not be low enough even though there is increasing evidence that ratio not level is a better marker for for heart disease - face meet palm.

Then at 6:30 he quotes a study of a single meal high in animal fat paralyzes your arteries. The meal you ask? A sausage and egg McMuffin - full of grains, sugar and processed vegetable oils - wtf!

If you have a specific study you would like us to read please post it - life if too short to get that much misinformation plus blatantly obvious information so fast.

Please post specific studies NOT youtube clips.

It will be a couple of days for me to post you some links as I am really busy at the moment, but I will certainly do that.

The thing you failed to realise is he was presenting a talk to your average Joe Bloggs, not members of MDA forum that are probably more clued up than most. So, yeah, there might be some things that seem stupid to me and you but if you took the time to go through his site you will see the way he explains things for the lay person is superb.

Here is a good example:

Animalistic Plant Proteins | NutritionFacts.org

Cited sources can be found below the video.

[Scott F]

Durian Rider, is that you??

[eenu]

Durian Rider, is that you??

I presume your trying to insinuate I am someone else? If so, no I am not 'Durian Rider'.

[Dirlot]

It does not matter who he is talking too what he has explained so far is misleading at best and more like outright misdirection and lies. If you take what he has said in the first 7 minutes is that vegetable based oils are bad, trans fats from vegetable oils are bad, grain and process foods fried in trans fat filled vegetable oils are bad. All of which I and everyone else here agrees with. A clean diet is the way to go but he has not made any point that confirms meat eating is bad.

The links below your latest video are all to abstracts and the third abstract states " These results suggest that dietary protein and soy isoflavones, in the context of comprehensive lifestyle changes, may not significantly alter IGF-1." So no real difference with regards to the type of protein intake and I would rather eat my grass fed hormone free beef than GMO soy.

TBH one of the biggest problems with meat eating is that mass farm meat eating is grain based, and full of antibiotics and hormones...prob a bigger factor than anything else out there.

Actual full studies would be much more productive.

[eenu]

It does not matter who he is talking too what he has explained so far is misleading at best and more like outright misdirection and lies. If you take what he has said in the first 7 minutes is that vegetable based oils are bad, trans fats from vegetable oils are bad, grain and process foods fried in trans fat filled vegetable oils are bad. All of which I and everyone else here agrees with. A clean diet is the way to go but he has not made any point that confirms meat eating is bad.

The links below your latest video are all to abstracts and the third abstract states " These results suggest that dietary protein and soy isoflavones, in the context of comprehensive lifestyle changes, may not significantly alter IGF-1." So no real difference with regards to the type of protein intake and I would rather eat my grass fed hormone free beef than GMO soy.

TBH one of the biggest problems with meat eating is that mass farm meat eating is grain based, and full of antibiotics and hormones...prob a bigger factor than anything else out there.

Actual full studies would be much more productive.

The reason you only get an abstract and I don't is I have access to all these journals, you have to pay. But the paper you quoted above also clearly states:

"The mean serum IGF-I concentration was 13% lower in 92 vegan women compared with 99 meat-eaters and 101 vegetarians (P
0.0006)"

"These data suggest that a plant based diet is associated with lower circulating levels of total IGF-I and higher levels of IGFBP-1 and IGFBP-2."

This study is also from two reputable research agencies and was a full study!

[Wildrose]

lolololol

Veganism? Seriously? Any diet that REQUIRES that you take supplements or you'll get sick and possibly DIE is obviously unnatural. We don't have a fermentation chamber in our guts like a gorilla. And McDougall is an idiot. 12 pieces of bread or 4 cups of rice a day? Really?

[Dirlot]

You are quoting the 1st article which notes the difference but does not state if there is any real effect from that difference

I am quoting the third which states it makes no difference when combined with lifestyle changes esp when you consider the meat sources were probably not as good as they could be.

When you combine the above with the blatant misinformation for the Forks Over Knives video I will take my chances with a clean diet (probably the biggest factor) and enjoy some wild bison, fish or grass fed beef.

[RaeVynn]

I spent 7 or 8 years as a vegan.. a very careful, organic-only, balanced diet vegan. I followed raw veganism for awhile. I followed the "Engine 2 Diet".. I was very, very morbidly obese. My fibro was getting worse. My systemic inflammation markers were off the charts. I never slept, and my hormones were so f-d up, it was unbelievable.

Now, I'm down 60 lbs, and I can move again. My fibro is calm most of the time, my inflammation is drastically reduced, and I'm sleeping.

You can take your veganism and shove it, as far as I'm concerned.

[eenu]

And McDougall is an idiot

Whether he is or not is irrelevant, he isn't being quoted the anthropologist is!