Knee pain? page

[trixie101]

Hi everyone! I've had issues with my knees for about a year now. I was hoping that going primal would help, as it seemed to help a lot of people, but it hasn't helped yet. I am only 16 though, so my bad knees aren't from age as most people's probably are.
It first started about a year ago, mostly when I was running. I'm a polevaulter, and so we never run more than 400m. No chronic cardio here I went to my doctor who recommended I go to physical therapy. My therapist thought it might be my shoes, so I got new shoes. That seemed to help a little, but they're also more cushy and I feel like it's just disguising my pain. I went to physical therapy for about 6 months, which didn't help at all. They pain got worse.

I tried taking a break but that didn't help. I went back to my doctor who sent me to an orthopedic doctor who thought that it was a growing thing and would be gone in 6 months or so. I'm a female and fairly tall (5'10") and he thought I was a textbook case based on everything for patella something or other. After six months, when it was worse, I went back and got an MRI. It showed nothing and the orthopedic doctor didn't really know what to do. He was not very helpful and pretty much just suggested I wait longer or try a brace (which doesn't help in the slightest)

Over the past 3 months I thought it was getting better, to the point of a couple weeks with no pain at all, but it's been slowly getting worse again. (in correlation with the colder weather possibly? I'm not sure) Anyway. I haven't been running very much at all, but it's been hurting when I do things for training, like squats, which is a shame because I love them. It also hurts when I jump, bounce, walk up more than 2 flights of stairs or even put my knees to the side of me when sitting down.

My doctors have always asked me to try to describe my pain but it's tricky. I can't really feel very well where it's coming from and it sometimes changes places from the front to the side. It's somewhere in between a dull and sharp pain, but probably a bit more on the dull side if that makes any sense. It usually is around 3-5 on the pain scale, which isn't horrible, but bad enough where it makes me have to stop exercises that i'm doing sometimes. I also have unstable shoulders, which I went to physical therapy for about a month or two for. I don't know if that's related to the knee problem. The shoulders don't really hurt, just feel really uncomfortable.

So that's my story. I'm sorry it's so long! I'm at my wits end. None of the doctors have been very helpful and it's creating lots of issues with my sport and life. If anyone has any advice about exercises that may help, diet changes, or even ideas of what it may be or anything else that would be amazing! Thanks

[rhjunk2k]

Hi trixie101,

Noting that it is impossible to diagnose over the Internet, IMHO you have nothing to lose if you check your vitamin B12 level, as your knee condition seems to fit the list of neurological symptoms of the B12 deficiency.

There is a great book about the subject, "Could It Be B12?: An Epidemic of Misdiagnoses", so I won't try to explain the matter here using my own words.

Long story short: you should try to convince your doctor (or your parents should do it, as you are 16 only) to do the necessary tests (serum B12, Holo-TC, whatever else needed). Also, be advised that the currently accepted "normal" levels of B12 are way too low according to many experts, so you should rather try to educate yourself/your family about this topic before by e.g. reading the above-mentioned book. B12 deficiency, if you have it, is easy and cheap to control, but left alone it can easily wreck the havoc.

Best regards,
Roman

[trixie101]

Thanks for answering Roman! I know how hard it is to diagnose over the internet, but I figured I would try this as a last ditch effort. I'll definitely look into the b12. Correct me if I'm wrong, as I'm still very new to everything, but isn't b12 in eggs and meat? I love eggs and probably eat around 10 or so a week and I have meat probably every other day. Anyway I wasn't sure about that... I plan on waiting a couple weeks to see if the pain is back for real and then I might try to go to another doctor.. Thank you for your help!

[KimT]

Let me preface this by saying, I am not a doctor, nor do I play one on tv. I am a resistance stretching practitioner and have taken several courses in Neurosomatic therapy. First, due to the fact you are 16 and 5'10", some of it could be related to growing and the muscles and ligaments not having a chance to elongate at the same rate as your bones. Second, a lot of knee pain comes from the quads and the calves. The muscles work as a balancing act and if a muscle is not able to shorten properly, it can cause tightness and lead to issues with the fascia. With the symptoms you are stating, it also sounds like very tight IT bands with the pain in the sides of your legs. Also, you could have postural distortions, even a leg length discrepency, causing tightness in the legs and then leading to knee pain. There are many options based on the info.

I'm not sure what area you live in, but a couple sites to look at would be Ki-Hara Resistance Stretching - Innovative Body Solutions., Harmonix Health | All Things Dynamic Contraction Technique, Neurosomatic Educators | Continuing Education in Advanced Massage Therapy.

Also, you may want to consider getting a foam roller and working on the quads, glutes, hamstrings, calves, adductors, and abductors. There are videos on the way to perform the motions on YouTube.

Just a few suggestions. Hope you are able to resolve it. Good luck!

[rhjunk2k]

Correct me if I'm wrong, as I'm still very new to everything, but isn't b12 in eggs and meat? I love eggs and probably eat around 10 or so a week and I have meat probably every other day. Anyway I wasn't sure about that...

The issue with B12 deficiency is that absorption of it from food sources is a rather complex multi-step process. If any step fails, you will not get enough B12 no matter what you eat, i.e. even high-dose B12 pills won't help.

Regarding growing pains - they always concentrate in muscles (e.g. in your case the knee pain would be behind the knees). So, if that is not the case, then it is unlikely that you have those.

[bostonwolf]

Not true, rhjunk2k. I had growing pains in my knees and ankles. The summer I turned 13 I grew over six inches from the time school let out in June until it started again in September.

[rhjunk2k]

Not true, rhjunk2k. I had growing pains in my knees and ankles. The summer I turned 13 I grew over six inches from the time school let out in June until it started again in September.

I'm afraid you are not entirely correct here. Probably you had some other issues, which were misdiagnosed. Just a quick set of links about growing pains:

• Kid's Health
• Mayo Clinic
• PAMF
• ...can add more, but google can do it as well...

[Velocity J]

Regarding growing pains - they always concentrate in muscles (e.g. in your case the knee pain would be behind the knees). So, if that is not the case, then it is unlikely that you have those.

There are problems with bones and tendons that can be related to growth spurts, such as Osgood-Schlatter disease, which I've seen inaccurately labeled as the non-specific term growing pains.

[carlvennt]

You can definitely go for a knee cap.But if the pain persists consult a doctor





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[Gene]

Joint pain is often "referral pain" from strained muscles. Find a therapist who does Trigger Point therapy and teach yourself to do it. Get the book, "Trigger Point Therapy" by Clair Davies. I use it for my shoulder pain.

You could have easily have strained a muscle pole vaulting, and until it heals, it sending referral pain to your knee. Get the book or see a therapist. If you can find sore knots in the suspect muscles, then this therapy will fix you up.