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Thread: How much of a caloric surplus is required to gain strength? page 2

  1. #11
    cayla29s's Avatar
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    To the OP..caloric numbers are only estimations regardless of what formula you use. If your goal is fat loss then yes you need to eat at a deficit. Ideally you need to be lifting heavy weights to preserve muscle mass while you are dieting. You can still gain strength but this depends on what kind of stimulation you give your muscles. Note that you are always better off eating at a maintenance to reach your full potential.

  2. #12
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    Quote Originally Posted by jsa23 View Post
    Muscle mass(which also boosts strength) is slower to build, and is aided more by a caloric surplus. That's not to say that you can't add muscle on a near-neutral energy balance, but it will be relatively slow.
    This was my belief as well, but after thinking about it (and hence, why I started this thread), if a surplus is required to make significant gains, then how can LeanGains work? Even with LG's +20% on workout days, the average, weekly caloric intake is still below or at maintenance, which is too avoid getting fat. I would think that rest days are just as important for muscle building, and yet the caloric deficit on those days don't seem to effect it (speaking not from my experience, but from the results of others who followed LG).

    Quote Originally Posted by Damiana View Post
    I don't think you can gain strength through diet. A steady routine of increasingly heavier and more challenging weights on a diet leaning more towards fat and protein will help, but I believe strength is built through exercise. If you eat more without exercising, you're just going to get fat.
    Did you read only the title of this thread?

    Quote Originally Posted by cayla29s View Post
    To the OP..caloric numbers are only estimations regardless of what formula you use. If your goal is fat loss then yes you need to eat at a deficit. Ideally you need to be lifting heavy weights to preserve muscle mass while you are dieting. You can still gain strength but this depends on what kind of stimulation you give your muscles. Note that you are always better off eating at a maintenance to reach your full potential.
    This ties in with my response to the first quote. If strength gains are slow, that's okay for now. My squat, pullup, chinup, and dip numbers will still go up simply because there's less weight to lift of my own body as I lose fat. However, that effect will eventually stop, plus my bench, deadlift, and row numbers will be unaffected. So I guess now my question is, will my gains be so slow that there will be weeks where no numbers went up at all? If that happened, I'm not sure how I'd keep m motivation.

  3. #13
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    [QUOTE=atmetal;960505]This was my belief as well, but after thinking about it (and hence, why I started this thread), if a surplus is required to make significant gains, then how can LeanGains work? Even with LG's +20% on workout days, the average, weekly caloric intake is still below or at maintenance, which is too avoid getting fat. I would think that rest days are just as important for muscle building, and yet the caloric deficit on those days don't seem to effect it (speaking not from my experience, but from the results of others who followed LG).



    Did you read only the title of this thread?



    This ties in with my response to the first quote. If strength gains are slow, that's okay for now.
    My squat, pullup, chinup, and dip numbers will still go up simply because there's less weight to lift of my own body as I lose fat. However, that effect will eventually stop, plus my bench, deadlift, and row numbers will be unaffected.
    I really don't think that body fat loss is the reason why you would get stronger. I have never heard of this before. Yes at some point you will reach your genetic potential and this is even me talking at a maitenance caloric intake. If you can expe riment with calorie cycling and see if you can get stronger while still dropping atleast 1lb a week then try it. Workout days eat at maintenance/rest days eat at deficit.

  4. #14
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    OK let's simplify:
    If you can't deadlift your own weight, you can eat at a deficit and still get much stronger. you should stop overanalyzing shit and get to the gym.
    If you can deadlift 1.5 times your weight, you might need to make a choice between pure strength and skinniness. Try it and see.
    If you can deadlift twice your weight, you probably can't get stronger and skinnier at the same time.

    Modify guidelines for age, general health, training history, sleep and recovery skills, and general awesomeness levels.
    If you are new to the PB - please ignore ALL of this stuff, until you've read the book, or at least http://www.marksdailyapple.com/primal-blueprint-101/ and this (personal fave): http://www.archevore.com/get-started/

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    Quote Originally Posted by tfarny View Post
    OK let's simplify:
    If you can't deadlift your own weight, you can eat at a deficit and still get much stronger. you should stop overanalyzing shit and get to the gym.
    If you can deadlift 1.5 times your weight, you might need to make a choice between pure strength and skinniness. Try it and see.
    My deadlift 1RM is almost 1.5x BW. You're also telling someone who qualified for the Navy's nuclear power program to stop overanalyzing...it's just not going to happen. That, by the way, is why I seek guidance on a forum. I'm always under a time constraint and after two years of training, I will be on a submarine, forced back to eating a DOD diet. So it would be best for me to reach my goals before then.

    It is because I wish to experiment that I am here. I simply wanted to make sure that strict adherence to LeanGains wasn't necessary and I got that answer rather quickly. The only thing that has kept the thread so long and given the appearance of over-complication is that fact that I'm polite and feel a need to reply to everyone who generously posts on a thread I created.

  6. #16
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    Quote Originally Posted by atmetal View Post
    My deadlift 1RM is almost 1.5x BW. You're also telling someone who qualified for the Navy's nuclear power program to stop overanalyzing...it's just not going to happen. That, by the way, is why I seek guidance on a forum. I'm always under a time constraint and after two years of training, I will be on a submarine, forced back to eating a DOD diet. So it would be best for me to reach my goals before then.

    It is because I wish to experiment that I am here. I simply wanted to make sure that strict adherence to LeanGains wasn't necessary and I got that answer rather quickly. The only thing that has kept the thread so long and given the appearance of over-complication is that fact that I'm polite and feel a need to reply to everyone who generously posts on a thread I created.
    I wasn't criticizing you, and you fall into my category 2 = try it and see. My overall point is that strangers cannot know the answer to this question for you, or in general, because the individual variables are hugely important.
    If you are new to the PB - please ignore ALL of this stuff, until you've read the book, or at least http://www.marksdailyapple.com/primal-blueprint-101/ and this (personal fave): http://www.archevore.com/get-started/

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