Why are people so concerned with weight-loss? page 23

[Knifegill]

It's not about that. Why U pretend? I'm not your straw man. Burn someone else.

[Winterbike]

I have to agree with Knifegill here.

I mean, ultimately, EVERYONE has excuses why it's hard to lose weight and stay in shape and blablabla. What makes the difference is whether you use the hardships in your life to progress and become better/more resilient/tougher or just curl in a ball and complain about how hard and unfair life is. And the hell with ''well some people have it easier than me, so I'll just do nothing and lower my standards for myself because it's much easier this way''. No one said it was supposed to be a fair race. Deal with it, keep on going, give everything you've got and please stop complaining.

[Iron Fireling]

It seems to me that broadly speaking, the men in this thread all prefer the muscular or curvy legs while the women prefer the skinny legs.

Please indulge me with a thought experiment. In one of the chapters of Sex at Dawn it talked about the difference between men and womens sexual responses. The researchers showed men and women (of various sexual persuasions) pictures of a variety of sexual scenarios (male-male, male-female, female-female, bonobos etc). They ALSO wired them up so they could see what their brain responses were. Then the subjects were asked them which scenarios aroused them.

What they found was that with men, their reported arousal and their brain arousal were the same. Men were turned on by any picture that contained their sexual target (e.g. a woman if they were hetero, or a man if they were gay).

What they found with women was... more complex. Basically women consistently gave the 'conventionally correct' answer verbally (e.g. liking the pictures with naked men in them if they self-reported as hetero), but their brain responses had little to no correlation with their verbal answers. Basically they gave the answer that they thought was right for a person like them, rather than what they actually thought.

Could something like that be happening here? Women-in-this-thread, if someone wired your brain up, and could detect what you *actually* think about those legs, which do you think you would like more? Would your 'brain' answer match the 'correct' answer of the skinny legs?

This is an interesting question... not sure I can answer the question, precisely. But I do have a few thoughts.

I am not attracted sexually to women. However, I find the look of some women to be aesthetically pleasing. What I find aesthetically pleasing in women is perhaps a little related to what I find attractive sexually in men.

By that I mean... I am not attracted to fat and chubby bits! I like lean, muscular men (not body builder types, but toned) and what I find aesthetically pleasing in women is also lean and toned (again not bulging muscles everywhere... just toned). I prefer the slim, toned legs than the larger ones. Women who are lean, toned, athletic appeal to me aesthetically far more than women who are "curvy" do. I particularly hate the look of chunky legs (oh err and guess what my legs look like??? ). I also hate the look of flabby bellies etc.

I have analysed this, because there was a time when I believed that what men found attractive was what *I* assumed to be attractive. It's only been the past few years that I've really questioned this (when I was younger I genuinely believed that if I ever got intimate with a man, and he touched my belly, he would literally RECOIL IN HORROR because it wasn't flat...and there's still a part of me that's really paranoid when it comes to body fat on myself).

So I don't know if my own personal experience/observation relates completely to this study... but I do think that our aesthetic preferences for our own gender may relate to our sexual preferences for the other gender (or whatever the case may be depending on your sexual preferences).

As for being turned on by images etc. I think women's brains are just a bit more complex, I dunno. I know that most women seem to be less visually stimulated than men. Seeing an attractive naked male doesn't immediately turn a woman on the way that seeing an attractive naked woman does to a man. There's usually an emotional component too... maybe that's one of the faults of the study, is that for women to be sexually excited there has to be more to it than just images?? So the women in the study, knowing that something's "expected" of them, respond in a way that they think is correct, even though they're not actually feeling it.

[Luce]

I'm not talking about outliers with genuine chronic ailments. I'm talking about when I go shopping and can't get through the aisles because 9 out of 10 people at too fat to walk past. Total BS. There's no way you can pretend the obese masses are ALL afflicted with such issues. I look in their grocery carts. Nothing but frozen pizzas.

If they are too large to pass by then they are not healthy.
You assume people gets fat because they want to, or because they're morons, or because they're sloths or because they're gluttons -or maybe all of that mixed in different proportions.
I think you are wrong.
People gets fat because most of what they know about health and nutrition is wrong, and most of what they know is been taught in universities and comes from their own doctors so I really don't feel like blaming a weekly pizza on them: those are after all healthy accepted carbs. The SAD prescription includes carbs enough to fuel my whole week and only a fraction of the calories I need: I would be obese and nutritionally deficient if I followed advice like that, and maybe they are exactly at that.
Here in Italy things are not as bad as in the United States but you have the golden boys of nutritional science (call it that way) preaching grains and starch in TV and candidly advising an ice cream at lunch in summer is a perfectly reasonable and healthy choice. Then wonder how comes children with T2D are doubling their number and obesity rates in teens are terrible.
Nobody CHOOSES to get fat, unhealthy, diabetic and disabled; they end up like that because they are genetically, socially, economically or educationally more vulnerable to situations which lead to obesity and its complications.
I only feel grateful to people who helped me -and keeps on helping me- regain health and hope I'll be able to do the same for others, judging others because of their size I just find it a waste of time.

Luce

[sbhikes]

Hey Knifegill what % BF do you suppose a person transfroms from being a complete moron to an intelligent human being?

Good one.

[Gadsie]

I'm not talking about outliers with genuine chronic ailments. I'm talking about when I go shopping and can't get through the aisles because 9 out of 10 people at too fat to walk past. Total BS. There's no way you can pretend the obese masses are ALL afflicted with such issues. I look in their grocery carts. Nothing but frozen pizzas.

I have to agree a little. There are not a lot of fat people where I live but those that are and I know eat cake and shit regulary.

Why do people get mad at this comment? Sure CW says grains are healthy but they also have an average calorie setpoint which a lot of people don't follow.
My dad eats like 1 bowl of muesli and a slice of bread a day but at night empties a jar of peanut butter and he doesn't understand why he's overweight, yet he is very aware of calories. I have to say that in THAT case you're a little stupid

[Rusty]

I think in the end it boils down to we are human. We each have our own ideal of what's sexy, healthy, etc. Can any of us look at a 500 lb man/woman and think "now there's a healthy human"? No, of course not. We also have no business making judgements on that person either. We don't know what brought them there.

It's also a two way street with being underweight. Models are super skinny because their job requires them to sell clothes. They are literally walking hangers. There are also plenty of underweight people who really try to gain and can't. They are probably really tired of being called anorexic or bulimic, when they are not.

The media is the media. It will show us thin and thick and everything inbetween. It will tell us that Kate Moss is too skinny and Oprah is too fat. Who's richer?

There are lots of places in the world where large women/men are idolized. For the women it means fertility and ability to protect a child in her womb. For men it's the trait of success.

If you don't want to hang with "fat" people, don't. But, also keep your comments to yourself. It's not your place to correct or chastise someone because they are not YOUR ideal shape or size. You can only work on yourself. If you want those thin legs, work hard and save money and get lipo.

[Graycat]

I'm kinda with Kinifegill on this one. I've always had an appreciation for nice looking stuff. Whether it's people, clothing, furniture, homes etc.
I know not everywhere in the US is like here, but where I live vast majority of people don't put any effort towards looking decent.
I constantly see obese people eating and drinking junk. It's not just about food, weight and body shape either. I hardly see anyone wearing nice clothes anymore. I don't mean expensive designer labels and stuff, come on pjs in public???
Well, if I'm shallow than so be it.

[OutdoorAmy]

If they are too large to pass by then they are not healthy.
You assume people gets fat because they want to, or because they're morons, or because they're sloths or because they're gluttons -or maybe all of that mixed in different proportions.
I think you are wrong.
People gets fat because most of what they know about health and nutrition is wrong, and most of what they know is been taught in universities and comes from their own doctors so I really don't feel like blaming a weekly pizza on them: those are after all healthy accepted carbs. The SAD prescription includes carbs enough to fuel my whole week and only a fraction of the calories I need: I would be obese and nutritionally deficient if I followed advice like that, and maybe they are exactly at that.
Here in Italy things are not as bad as in the United States but you have the golden boys of nutritional science (call it that way) preaching grains and starch in TV and candidly advising an ice cream at lunch in summer is a perfectly reasonable and healthy choice. Then wonder how comes children with T2D are doubling their number and obesity rates in teens are terrible.
Nobody CHOOSES to get fat, unhealthy, diabetic and disabled; they end up like that because they are genetically, socially, economically or educationally more vulnerable to situations which lead to obesity and its complications.
I only feel grateful to people who helped me -and keeps on helping me- regain health and hope I'll be able to do the same for others, judging others because of their size I just find it a waste of time.

Luce

I think this is very true. Very few people WANT to be obese or believe they are okay being obese (there are some outliers), and most don't have something like Cushings that is grossly effecting their hormones. Many if not most are following a SAD diet and having a hard time because carbs, esp. wheat, as we all know, are addictive! Hello exorphins. Add to that the stress and stigma of being overweight and you're only MORE likely to turn to those foods that give you a positive brain hit.

At some point I think a lot of people DO give up - not out of laziness or sloth or gluttony so much as trying to long to have great self-control following SAD guidelines and having no success.

I was nearly at that point before discovering paleo/primal living (after losing 15 lbs. by reducing portion sizes, but then stalling out and unable to lose any more despite only eating 1500 or so calories a day) - and now that I'm seeing results I'm more motivated than ever. I'm signing up for a freaking 5k even! I would never have done that before.

It's made me an evangelist for this lifestyle - even though at Christmas I remember laughing with my cousin about her paleo Thanksgiving and how sad that must have been (her sister, my other cousin, made the switch last year and drug Ruth into it kicking and screaming since they were living together at the time).

And now I think I'm rambling instead of making a point, so I'm gonna stop now . . .

[sbhikes]

At the time, I thought that going paleo WAS giving up. I was sure eating all that red meat and saturated fat was going to make me fat and blow my heart up but I really didn't care anymore.