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  1. #11
    SerialSinner's Avatar
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    Primal Fuel


    Thanks all for the feedback. After doing some online research, I am horrified by the ingredients of all the brands I have read about. ALL.


    For example: http://bit.ly/daoNa6


    Humanity's best attempts to recreate breast milk all use industrial vegetable oils and sweeteners, as well as foreign dietary components to man such as vegetable based proteins from soy. Appalling.


    The ideal scenario after breast milk would be the home-made formula described on the link provided by Maba. I am not sure if most would go through all the hassle to make it though. (After this online research, I would).


    My relative just can't breastfed anymore so the only way I can be constructive would be unfortunately, unless I find some exception to the rule, to recommend the lesser evil. And like Twinmama says, at least she will be fed. The whole thing depresses me though.

    “Every saint has a past and every sinner has a future.” -Oscar Wilde
    "The power of accurate observation is commonly called cynicism by those who have not got it." -George Bernard Shaw
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  2. #12
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    Hey Serial... It IS depressing... and I guarantee it's even more depressing for mom. I must have cried for 2-3 weeks when I finally decided that my attempts to breast feed my children was not only causing me extreme amounts of stress, additional sleep loss, but also utter frustration for my babies. They would try so hard, and end up screaming as their attempts left them quite hungry! Not good for a 3lb 11 oz baby!!!


    I really wouldn't call baby formula "evil"... I know there are ingredients that many find appalling... But this is about FEEDING a child with the best available source. If mom can't, then she can't. All judgement (even mom's) needs to be put aside.


    Also, when it's time to switch to solids... she can go straight to REAL food, organic, and make it all at home. It's SUPER EASY! (I was lucky that my kiddos didn't eat even one single jar of babyfood. AND... AND... It's MUCH CHEAPER! (trust the busy mom of twins on this one!)If you/she would like some help with this, please let me know. I'll share all my time saving tricks! How old is your relatives baby anyhow?


  3. #13
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    I agree with twinmama...try to stay positive for your relative and focus on the light at the end of the tunnel.


  4. #14
    Jeffrw's Avatar
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    So what would have happend before the invention of formula?


    Call me an a-hole or whatever,but I just can't buy you can't do something you are meant to do.


  5. #15
    SerialSinner's Avatar
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    twinmama, she is 10 months old, so she has enjoyed some of the benefits of lactation already.


    Jeffrw: community upbringing, nursing mothers, wet nurses and the like.

    “Every saint has a past and every sinner has a future.” -Oscar Wilde
    "The power of accurate observation is commonly called cynicism by those who have not got it." -George Bernard Shaw
    "The trouble with jogging is that the ice falls out of your glass." -Martin Mull

  6. #16
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    Forgive my sombre post, but in answer to Jeffrw, if mum wasn't able to feed then baby would die. Simple as.


    SS - maybe baby is old enough to move onto solids with goat milk? I hear that goat is better than cow, and at least real milk dodges the soy and veggie oil issue?

    Good luck, and I'm glad that you're trying to help


  7. #17
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    thanks NM. I don't feel qualified to give advice about infant nutrition, as their nutrient requirements and sensitivities vary from adults. For example, according to some info online, supplementing with fish oil at early ages could result in motor impairments, egg whites would be string allergens, etc.


    I also read about goat milk being a better breast milk replacement because it's less insulogenic than cow milk.


    But even goat milk would need strong supplementation to match infant nutritional requirements. The home-made formula recipe from Weston Price reflects that.


    Finally, I am not sure when it's safe to make a complete transition to solids. Maybe after full teeth growth. But then hunter gatherers breastfeed on average until the babies are 2.5 y/o, so I'm not sure...

    “Every saint has a past and every sinner has a future.” -Oscar Wilde
    "The power of accurate observation is commonly called cynicism by those who have not got it." -George Bernard Shaw
    "The trouble with jogging is that the ice falls out of your glass." -Martin Mull

  8. #18
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    FWIW, a friend of mine began weaning at 4 months and by 10 months baby was on solids (well, babyfood mush) and cow milk only.

    However the family barely counted as healthy CW, never mind primal :/ but baby seemed bright and happy at the time.


  9. #19
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    [quote]

    Forgive my sombre post, but in answer to Jeffrw, if mum wasn&#39;t able to feed then baby would die. Simple as.</blockquote>


    Paleo mamas living in a tribe who had milk supply problems (if they ever did--I&#39;m sure many of today&#39;s mamas have far more issues w/ our poor diets and lack of seeing other women nursing...) would probably have the other women in the tribe who were lactating be a &#39;wet-nurse&#39; for their babes. I read about a tribal culture in which a newborn&#39;s introduction to the tribe is to be nursed by every women there--those who are or are not lactating. I have friends who have babysat for their girlfriend&#39;s babes and have nursed each other&#39;s kiddos (which probably sounds weird to some, but it&#39;s something they were comfy with.) I doubt that a tribe that had any lactating women around (and there would probably be more with kiddos nursing to 3, 4 and beyond...) would allow a new baby to starve if the mama had serious nursing issues...


    A baby born w/ tongue tie or who comes out w/ a poor latch--that might be a different story in paleo times, although a lifetime of seeing other women nursing, along w/the support of having those experienced women around, I&#39;m certain, helped to increase the ability of the mamas to support their kiddos through those types of scenarios. (Poor latch can be corrected by help from the mama and positioning, so I bet just having the experience of seeing others nursing throughout their lives helped mamas know what to do in that situation.)


    Also, there are MANY herbal galactagogues, which help increase milk supply and let down frequency, etc. I utilized some and they worked wonders for me. (I had supply problems and ds was 3 months when we FINALLY had our milk supply/nursing relationship established.) I&#39;m betting Grokette knew lots about them and utilized them when needed back in the day...


  10. #20
    TxRain's Avatar
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    Primal Blueprint Expert Certification


    SS - I am currently breastfeeding my 11 month old (my 3rd child), but she is down to just 4 times a day. I&#39;ve never had supply issues - even while in ketosis - unless I am dehydrated. If your relative is in Houston, I have a freezer full of milk she is welcome to! lol


    I started my DD with solids at around 7 months and didn&#39;t do the mush thing. Mush teaches babies to swallow before chewing and that seems dangerous to me. Her favorite meal is short ribs (bone in) in the crockpot or even on the grill. I buy them fatty so she gets lots of good stuff. It is so cute to watch her eat meat. She gets so excited when she sees it. I should upload a video on youtube so you can see. It is really funny. At first, she just sucked the juice out of the meat. I would cut it into big chunks so she couldn&#39;t stuff it into her mouth in one piece. I also feed her veggies in large chunks or chip like pieces that I&#39;ve steamed soft so she can chew them with her gums. She loves carrots, sweet potatoes, broccoli, asparagus and avocado. Some consider avocado the perfect first food. Small sips of water when eating help. I never give juice. If she is no longer nursing, she will need water to avoid constipation. Beef broth would be good too.


    Personally, I would stay away from formula totally and if she can nurse at all - even once a day before bed or upon waking - that would be good.


    For dairy products, I would totally skip milk, but use greek yogurt - full fat. I give my DD shredded cheese that I shred myself to avoid starches. I would also use egg yolks, etc. Butter on everything.


    My DD self feeds and always has. When I give her greek yogurt, I blend some frozen berries into it and it is very thick. She likes to feed herself. I don&#39;t do it often because it is a huge mess, but fun for her.


    You&#39;ve done the research so you know what is in the stuff. Perhaps you should show her the research and urge her to try using whole foods. She can give infant vitamin supps if she feels she is missing something, but I don&#39;t think they would be necessary.


    I never did cereals with the kids (again, the whole "swallow before chew" thing) but she can give sticky white rice or white potatoes if she she feels the need to give those carbs. Let the baby do the feeding. I would just avoid gluten and casein at all costs. My DS has a dairy allergy and my DD1 (she&#39;s 3) has celiacs, so I keep a gluten and somewhat casein free house. I don&#39;t worry so much about casein in the house since there is not a cc issue like with gluten.


    Good luck to her! She&#39;s lucky to have you in her life.


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