Going to eat at Chick Fil A today page 17

[canio6]

If we (by 'we' I mean gay people) abandon the semantics of using the word 'marriage', then it won't be seen in the same light. Yes, people are exceptionally stupid. But that doesn't mean we should stop using the 'marriage' because those nupties don't like it. Too effing bad.

I just got married, and we didn't do it in a church. In fact, most people that I know who've been married in the last few years have not been married in a church.

I didn't get married in a church either. They tend to discourage my attendance.


Seen in the same light by who? Do you care what some inbred fuck in <insert whatever state/country> thinks of your marriage? If I hand you a banana but call it an apple it is still a freaking banana. Call a marriage a civil union and if it is still exactly the same legally as a marriage what is the difference? Perhaps some closed minded folks will look down their noses and say "Ha, they are not really married only in a union!" but they are going to talk shit about you anyway.

Oh well, just my two cents. I don't have a dog in the fight so really might as well shut up. Hell, some Japanese kid married a pillow and their country hasn't fallen into the ocean yet...well, I guess parts of it did >.> Oh well.

BTW congratulations on your marriage. I wish you many happy years together.

[patski]

The other issue is that "marriage" in America is NOT primarily a matter of church/religion.
"Marriage" in the US is primarily a LEGAL contract document that gives both parties benefits, rights, and responsibilities.
The religious portion of thing is up to the people entering into the contract.
Choosing to have a church wedding has nothing to do with the LEGAL portion.
People can be legally married with no religious ceremony.
And people can be married in religious ceremony with NO legal document involved.

This +1. cori, I <3 you.

[canio6]

This is why I believe that EVERY government sanctioned LEGAL 'marriage' should be called what it actually is, a Legal Union, and that Marriage Certificates should be a separate thing awarded by individual churches according to their own standards to be sought if that is what the couple wishes.

^this. Cori says what I am trying to say only better as usual.

[patski]

I didn't get married in a church either. They tend to discourage my attendance.


Seen in the same light by who? Do you care what some inbred fuck in <insert whatever state/country> thinks of your marriage? If I hand you a banana but call it an apple it is still a freaking banana. Call a marriage a civil union and if it is still exactly the same legally as a marriage what is the difference? Perhaps some closed minded folks will look down their noses and say "Ha, they are not really married only in a union!" but they are going to talk shit about you anyway.

Oh well, just my two cents. I don't have a dog in the fight so really might as well shut up. Hell, some Japanese kid married a pillow and their country hasn't fallen into the ocean yet...well, I guess parts of it did >.> Oh well.

BTW congratulations on your marriage. I wish you many happy years together.

No church wants me there. I tend to piss 'em all off. You can't be gay and know more about the Bible than they do.

LOL! @ the kid who married his pillow.

"Hey ya'll! I just had a civil union with my partner of 9 years! WOOWOO!"

"We just came back from honeymoon after our civil union"

"We just got engaged and our civil union is on the 20th of July"

I don't know, man. I'm arguing semantics again. But language is extremely powerful, and we attach meaning, great meaning in fact, to words. No, I don't care what some inbred twat thinks, but 'civil union' doesn't sound right. It would take years of social conditioning to wean the word 'marriage' out of our mouths.

Thank you very much for your kind wishes

[patski]

^this. Cori says what I am trying to say only better as usual.

It's true. She's good at that

[Neckhammer]

I didn't get married by a 'minister' of any church, either. I was married by an 'officiant' who is not affiliated with any church.

Marriage is not a religious institution. If some people think it is, because THEIR minister is from xyz church, then so be it.

Hey thats cool for you. Its either or all of the following: social, legal, or religious. Unless you can think of any other category.

[canio6]

I don't know, man. I'm arguing semantics again. But language is extremely powerful, and we attach meaning, great meaning in fact, to words. No, I don't care what some inbred twat thinks, but 'civil union' doesn't sound right.

Oh, I totally get that. I call my wife my wife because 'life partner' or whatever sounds lame as shit. I'll be honest, it bugs me when homosexuals use the word partner. I want to say, "Dude, that is your husband!" Partner sounds like a business agreement not the love of your life. Not that is it my place to tell anyone what to call anyone. It is just a personal opinion.

I meant dropping the word marriage on a political level. As many people do still get married in churches and many see marriage as a church thing (see Cori's comment) then many object to gay marriages as it conflicts with whatever religious view they have, but what religious argument is there against two (or more) adults entering a legal contract? Seems to me there isn't any. So get married all you like to your wife/husband/partner/whatever but get it legal by whatever means necessary even if it means calling a banana an apple.

[Rasputina]

No church wants me there. I tend to piss 'em all off. You can't be gay and know more about the Bible than they do.

LOL! @ the kid who married his pillow.

"Hey ya'll! I just had a civil union with my partner of 9 years! WOOWOO!"

"We just came back from honeymoon after our civil union"

"We just got engaged and our civil union is on the 20th of July"

I don't know, man. I'm arguing semantics again. But language is extremely powerful, and we attach meaning, great meaning in fact, to words. No, I don't care what some inbred twat thinks, but 'civil union' doesn't sound right.

Thank you very much for your kind wishes

What churches have you been going to? Here we have the United Church of Christ (my mother-in-law is a reverend), the Unitarian Church, and several Episcopalian churches, that are open and affirming of gays and lesbians, are active in the outreach communities and fully embrace the true message of God. Any of these churches here would be glad to have you and are open to active dialogues about the teachings of Christ, how we interpret them, and what it means to enact kindness and change in the community. These churches don't preach dogma, they encourage good works, an active questioning, and an interest in the bettering of our community. I'm saddened to hear that some people don't have an opportunity to join a community like this, but then again, as I felt, for many years, maybe some people don't need or want this type of organized worship. Emily Dickinson didn't need a church to feel the connection to the universe, and nor do I, but it is nice to get together with others who want to do good things. Maybe I should just shut-up!

[cori93437]

It's true. She's good at that

Thanks.

I'm just half gay... but I had some very important relationships that I gave up when I was younger due to the pressure of bigotry and fear of discrimination. I have some regrets from that time. Being in a relationship and trying to stay in the closet is not fair to a partner. I eventually located and called two women who were very special to me and apologized to them. They understood, but it was a day late and a dollar short IMO.
One of them eventually moved to MA and is happily married. We are still in touch on occasion.

As I get older and care less and LESS about what the world thinks of me personally I find that my passion for trying to find some sort of end to the darkness that so many young gay or LGBTQ people face as they grow older... sometimes that is just trying to throw some facts and logic out into the world and hope that a bit of it sticks to someone who maybe never thought of those things before.
I don't want them to have to know the fear that I knew.
I want them to not even know that many people like them used to live in fear.

[Rasputina]

Thanks.

I'm just half gay... but I had some very important relationships that I gave up when I was younger due to the pressure of bigotry and fear of discrimination. I have some regrets from that time. Being in a relationship and trying to stay in the closet is not fair to a partner. I eventually located and called two women who were very special to me and apologized to them. They understood, but it was a day late and a dollar short IMO.
One of them eventually moved to MA and is happily married. We are still in touch on occasion.

As I get older and care less and LESS about what the world thinks of me personally I find that my passion for trying to find some sort of end to the darkness that so many young gay or LGBTQ people face as they grow older... sometimes that is just trying to throw some facts and logic out into the world and hope that a bit of it sticks to someone who maybe never thought of those things before.
I don't want them to have to know the fear that I knew.
I want them to not even know that many people like them used to live in fear.

as a bi-sexual woman, married to a man, I understand completely. Only my brother knows I'm bi-sexual, because he's the only one, aside from my husband, who would tolerate me.