Gardening, again... page 2

[tamo42]

I'd love to explore permaculture! Tell us more?

Well, the 30-second Primal-appropriate version would be something like this:

In the Primal WOE/WOL we have rejected the status quo in Western society because we have come to realize that it is not biologically appropriate for human beings to follow the CW. Permaculture (permanent agriculture or permanent culture) applies the same kind of thinking to living in the landscape, but also goes one step further to develop synergies between different elements.

That's a little opaque, so maybe an example would be clearer.

Let's say you want to have fresh tomatoes from your garden.

CW says something along the lines of pick a sunny spot, clear all the current growth, transplant tomato starts from a greenhouse or nursery, fertilize, stake/cage the plants as they grow, and then harvest. All throughout this time you'll need to weed, control insects, and water. In other words, lots of work.

A more permaculture approach is more complex in planning, but simpler in execution (work). So you might create an environment that allows the tomato plant to thrive. This could include direct sowing the seeds on a hugelkultur bed (raised bed over rotting wood) in a favorable microclimate, in a guild (supportive community of different species). The hugelkultur bed pretty much eliminates the need for watering. Direct sowing creates a stronger plant that has deeper roots and doesn't suffer from transplant shock. The various species in the guild will provide scaffolding for the climbing plant, habitat for predatory insects, exchanges of nutrients through the soil and mycelium, and so on.

For those who want to talk or learn more about permaculture, permies.com is the biggest forum around.

[Kate Ruckman]

Well, the 30-second Primal-appropriate version would be something like this:

In the Primal WOE/WOL we have rejected the status quo in Western society because we have come to realize that it is not biologically appropriate for human beings to follow the CW. Permaculture (permanent agriculture or permanent culture) applies the same kind of thinking to living in the landscape, but also goes one step further to develop synergies between different elements.

That's a little opaque, so maybe an example would be clearer.

Let's say you want to have fresh tomatoes from your garden.

CW says something along the lines of pick a sunny spot, clear all the current growth, transplant tomato starts from a greenhouse or nursery, fertilize, stake/cage the plants as they grow, and then harvest. All throughout this time you'll need to weed, control insects, and water. In other words, lots of work.

A more permaculture approach is more complex in planning, but simpler in execution (work). So you might create an environment that allows the tomato plant to thrive. This could include direct sowing the seeds on a hugelkultur bed (raised bed over rotting wood) in a favorable microclimate, in a guild (supportive community of different species). The hugelkultur bed pretty much eliminates the need for watering. Direct sowing creates a stronger plant that has deeper roots and doesn't suffer from transplant shock. The various species in the guild will provide scaffolding for the climbing plant, habitat for predatory insects, exchanges of nutrients through the soil and mycelium, and so on.

For those who want to talk or learn more about permaculture, permies.com is the biggest forum around.

Thank you! I experimented with HIGHLY simplified hugelkultur this year in my container garden (logs, sticks, etc. in the bottom of the pots), but we had to buy soil/compost, and unfortunately even with mulch and watering the dirt's very hard right now. Bad year--very hot and very dry.

I'll check out your link, I'd like to know more about the guild idea!

[Kate Ruckman]

We have about 4500-5000sf in crops right now, plus a laying flock and weaner pigs. But I guess we transitioned from garden to market farm a few years back.

One of our goals is to close loops and be as low-input as possible, so we incorporate a lot of permaculture ideas into our set up. We're also training our farm horse to help with certain tasks (aside from providing manure). Feel free to peruse our farm blog linked in my signature

I didn't really grow food much before moving here in 2005, and my first effort was two 4 x 8 raised beds in the square foot method. But each year has been a learning experience, and now we're able to grow 90% of our own food, plus sell enough to count as a 'real' farm. We could do a lot more if we didn't both work full time, but paychecks are helpful things. Just being able to eat food this good is worth more than money though.

Wow, HUGE garden. We did a quarter of an acre back in the 70s...tons of work. And yep, we had to keep the paychecks, too...

[carlh]

My garden includes a raised bed with cucumber, broccoli, zucchini, spaghetti squash, onion, garlic, several varieties of tomato and basil. We have a couple fruit trees that we're struggling to get anything from, and several berry canes that are fairly prolific for blackberries...and a fair several handfuls of raspberries. My wife has an herb garden with lemon balm, chamomile, catnip, and a dozen other things I can never remember.

[Classic]

I love the way the food tastes right out of the garden. Broccoli has an amazing color and flavor when it is cooked just moments out of the garden.
We have started a new garden at our new house this year and it certainly takes a lot of elbow grease to get a new plot ready and all the grass removed. That quack grass will make you crazy but I love gardening and watching things grow.

Our season was a little slow this year because it was so cool for soooo long. I still don't have a tomato ready. Lots of brassicas though. They love the cool wet weather. Good thing those are our favorite veggies.

I also started a berry patch. I had raspberry bushes for years but am trying blueberries this year for the first time. They seem to be a bit more fussy but I thought I would give it a whirl. Berries are another thing that tend to grow well in the NW.

[JBailey]

I love the way the food tastes right out of the garden. Broccoli has an amazing color and flavor when it is cooked just moments out of the garden.
We have started a new garden at our new house this year and it certainly takes a lot of elbow grease to get a new plot ready and all the grass removed. That quack grass will make you crazy but I love gardening and watching things grow.

Our season was a little slow this year because it was so cool for soooo long. I still don't have a tomato ready. Lots of brassicas though. They love the cool wet weather. Good thing those are our favorite veggies.

I also started a berry patch. I had raspberry bushes for years but am trying blueberries this year for the first time. They seem to be a bit more fussy but I thought I would give it a whirl. Berries are another thing that tend to grow well in the NW.

I miss broccoli!!
It grows like a weed at our place, but I just can't deal with those dang green worms. No matter how much I spray & soak & inspect, every time I steamed up a pot there'd be steamed worms too. And row covers are a pain! I guess there are limits to eating primal for me

The weeds are growing like weeds too, but I hand pull most of the juicy stuff like pig & chickweed and feed it to the ......wait for it...... pigs & chickens!
I'm sure it's full of vitamins & whatnot.

I planted blueberries under our fir trees once, thinking they'd grow like the wild ones. They died. The black currants are happy in partial shade though and the raspberries are going crazy. Funny what stuff likes our PNW climate, rain or shine...

[Nady]

I found a ladybug in the garden this morning~ remarkable, because here, in the desert, they fly away to the mountains as soon as the temps. get into the high 80's/90's. Several years ago, we brought a bunch (don't know how many but would fill a ½C measure tightly packed) back down to the lowlands and my aphid infested melons. They stayed long enough to clean up the mess and reproduce~ the offspring (I think) imprinted (?) anyway, this is the fourth year they've shown up just in the nick of time to save my melons! Imagine that, aphid eaters when you actually need them!

[tamo42]

Fir trees (and most conifers) are allelopathic and don't play nice with a lot of other plants.

[KerryK]

I have a little garden that I put a lot of work into this spring. It produced lots of cherry tomatoes, cucumbers (the taste of a fresh one straight from the garden is so different than a store bought one!), yellow squash, and black eyed peas. We got a few weeks of torrential rain, followed by blistering heat, and everything died. Now I'm just waiting to start over with a fall garden! I'd like to grow broccoli and lettuce.

For gardening related online communities, check out GardenWeb and Homesteading Today, two other forums I frequent (Homesteading Today's forum is a wealth of information on self sufficiency, not all that different from the values of the primal community!)

Jenny

Thank you for these sites - they're great!

[Neckhammer]

I am! Grew all my own salad green for about 4 months (all bolted now)....odd thing haven't had a salad since . I have this book Amazon.com: Gaia's Garden, Second Edition: A Guide To Home-Scale Permaculture (9781603580298): Toby Hemenway: Books which is basically permaculture on a backyard scale.

My garden this year was completely free form and I loved it (beens, peppers, tomatoes, squash, and second round of carrots, radishes, broccoli coming in now)! All the different stuff just intermingled and working togeather. No rows....and best of all NO WEEDS! Dense planting with various vegetables is an awesome way to reduce disease and weeds while also making the absolute best use of a small space IMO. I'm no advanced gardener (only about 6-7 years doing it), but I love this style. I even planted some fruit trees and berry shrubs for some long term turn out. Can't wait to see what that brings!