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Thread: Dr. Mcdougall rips apart the paleo diet - your thoughts?

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  1. #1
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    Dr. Mcdougall rips apart the paleo diet - your thoughts?

    I don't want to turn this into a vegan attack but am curious what your guys' thoughts are after reading this article from him bashing everything about the paleo diet

    McDougall Newsletter: June 2012 - The Paleo Diet is Uncivilized (And Unhealthy and Untrue)

    Is there a chance Mark Sisson would respond to this article? I know the 'starch solution' book has just been released by dr. Mcdougall.

    also, this is a pretty interesting article as well:

    Paleo Diet Review: Pros and Cons -- Natural Health Newsletter

    I've always been curious about the consumption of meat and the acidic nature of it.

  2. #2
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    my initial thought was 'who cares?'

    upon reading, my thoughts morphed into 'this n=1 works for me, so who cares'
    beautiful
    yeah you are

    Baby if you time travel back far enough you can avoid that work because the dust won't be there. You're too pretty to be working that hard.
    lol

  3. #3
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    Quote Originally Posted by bloodorchid View Post
    my initial thought was 'who cares?'

    upon reading, my thoughts morphed into 'this n=1 works for me, so who cares'
    <--- this.
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  4. #4
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    ok...but I care about learning what is the optimal diet and if there is research to disprove the paleo/primal diet I'm always curious what it is and what other people think of it.

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    wanderlust, my first group A-er

    see?
    beautiful
    yeah you are

    Baby if you time travel back far enough you can avoid that work because the dust won't be there. You're too pretty to be working that hard.
    lol

  6. #6
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    Quote Originally Posted by bloodorchid View Post
    wanderlust, my first group A-er

    see?
    I think I feel into Group D: realized the article was a complete waste of effing time and said eff it!
    "Go For Broke"
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  7. #7
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    Uncle Mark doesn't even need to dignify that article with a response. A high school student could tear it to pieces while nursing a hang over.
    "Go For Broke"
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  8. #8
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    Quote Originally Posted by Wanderlust View Post
    Uncle Mark doesn't even need to dignify that article with a response. A high school student could tear it to pieces while nursing a hang over.
    Whilst true, the average reader will simply believe it without fact-checking or indeed thinking about it, as they have invested no time in learning about true nutrition.

    Honestly, I'd rather live a few years less and enjoy what I eat than have a few more years of being bored shitless by my diet.
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  9. #9

    List of points from Mcdougall's book "The starch solution"

    I'm bumping this thread because I just read his book, "The Starch Solution" by Mcdougall and there are some interesting points that should be addressed from the Paleo/Primal perspective. I'm curious about the Paleo perspective on the specific points below. Now, I'm not about to give up my Eggs/beef/lamb/oxtail/cheese but his book is definitely food for thought.

    Note that I'm paraphrasing his viewpoints based on my reading of the book. Please correct me if I paraphrased any of his points incorrectly. I added in my own questions in with the paraphrased points as well. I hope the points are well written enough for an intelligent discussion.

    1. If you are in positive nitrogen balance, then you are getting enough protein in your diet. He believes that 40 to 60 grams of protein per day is enough and you will be in positive nitrogen balance with that amount. What are the dangers of keeping protein this low?

    2. The amino acid methionine is metabolized into homocysteine which is a risk factor for a bunch of diseases. Is a high level of methionine in the diet really harmful?

    3. De novo lipogenesis (conversion of sugar to fat) does not happen easily in humans. Even though many animals are good at this, humans are not. If you consume excess starch you will more likely burn it off with excess body heat, fidgeting, or you will be driven to physical activity. Is this true?

    4. High glycemic carbs can be beneficial because the high insulin spike that follows is good for controlling appetite. Is this true?

    5. He thinks that good sources of starch are rice, corn, potatoes, sweet potatoes, and beans. These should be the centerpiece of the diet - source of the majority of a person's calories. I avoid beans because of the anti-nutrients. But would it be harmful for a person to get over half of their calories from rice, corn, potatoes, and sweet potatoes?

    6. He does not think salt is harmful and a low salt diet can be harmful.

    7. He does not think moderate amounts of sugar is harmful. He thinks its okay to use sauces with sugar in them to make the starch based foods taste better.

    8. He thinks dietary fat is incredibly easy for the body to store. Therefore eating too much fat will make you fat.

    9. He thinks all animal products should be avoided. Personally, I'm still convinced that you need animal products to reach optimal health. My question here is would some people benefit from reducing meat and increasing starch. I'm not talking about eliminating meat - just altering the ratios of starch to animal products.

  10. #10
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    Quote Originally Posted by ketone_bill View Post

    3. De novo lipogenesis (conversion of sugar to fat) does not happen easily in humans. Even though many animals are good at this, humans are not. If you consume excess starch you will more likely burn it off with excess body heat, fidgeting, or you will be driven to physical activity. Is this true?

    4. High glycemic carbs can be beneficial because the high insulin spike that follows is good for controlling appetite. Is this true?

    5. He thinks that good sources of starch are rice, corn, potatoes, sweet potatoes, and beans. These should be the centerpiece of the diet - source of the majority of a person's calories. I avoid beans because of the anti-nutrients. But would it be harmful for a person to get over half of their calories from rice, corn, potatoes, and sweet potatoes?

    7. He does not think moderate amounts of sugar is harmful. He thinks its okay to use sauces with sugar in them to make the starch based foods taste better.

    8. He thinks dietary fat is incredibly easy for the body to store. Therefore eating too much fat will make you fat.
    If this is what he truly believes, he's not as damn crazy as I thought. Yes, de novo lipogenesis doesn't make people fat, insulin does suppress appetite, dietary fat is easy to store as fat*, those starches are all staple foods in cultures around the world and I would agree that they're some of the healthiest to eat, and a moderate amount of sugar won't kill you.

    I wouldn't recommend it to diabetics, but I think this + animal products is a pretty sensible diet. If you're not sold on primal, I say go for it.

    *Just because fat's easy to store doesn't mean it's going to stay there forever, so that point is irrelevant. In an otherwise healthy person, fat is cycled in and out of fat cells pretty regularly.

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