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Thread: Dr. Mcdougall rips apart the paleo diet - your thoughts? page 10

  1. #91
    Timthetaco's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by ketone_bill View Post

    3. De novo lipogenesis (conversion of sugar to fat) does not happen easily in humans. Even though many animals are good at this, humans are not. If you consume excess starch you will more likely burn it off with excess body heat, fidgeting, or you will be driven to physical activity. Is this true?

    4. High glycemic carbs can be beneficial because the high insulin spike that follows is good for controlling appetite. Is this true?

    5. He thinks that good sources of starch are rice, corn, potatoes, sweet potatoes, and beans. These should be the centerpiece of the diet - source of the majority of a person's calories. I avoid beans because of the anti-nutrients. But would it be harmful for a person to get over half of their calories from rice, corn, potatoes, and sweet potatoes?

    7. He does not think moderate amounts of sugar is harmful. He thinks its okay to use sauces with sugar in them to make the starch based foods taste better.

    8. He thinks dietary fat is incredibly easy for the body to store. Therefore eating too much fat will make you fat.
    If this is what he truly believes, he's not as damn crazy as I thought. Yes, de novo lipogenesis doesn't make people fat, insulin does suppress appetite, dietary fat is easy to store as fat*, those starches are all staple foods in cultures around the world and I would agree that they're some of the healthiest to eat, and a moderate amount of sugar won't kill you.

    I wouldn't recommend it to diabetics, but I think this + animal products is a pretty sensible diet. If you're not sold on primal, I say go for it.

    *Just because fat's easy to store doesn't mean it's going to stay there forever, so that point is irrelevant. In an otherwise healthy person, fat is cycled in and out of fat cells pretty regularly.

  2. #92
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    Consider the source. Then ask yourself, "Why am I wasting my precious LIFE refuting the work of an idiot?"

    Then, ignore said idiot.

    Easy-peasy.
    Peak weight on Standard American Diet: 316.8 lbs
    Initial Weight When Starting Primal: 275 lbs
    Current weight: 210.8 lbs
    Goal weight: 220 lbs (or less): MISSION ACCOMPLISHED.

    The way "ChooseMyPlate.gov" should have looked:
    ChooseMyPlate

  3. #93
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    Ask yourself and observe how healthy, happy, productive etc people are that follow any dogmatic protocols for diet & lifestyle. Primal Blueprint passes those tests with flying colors. While McDougall & his adherents, they fail to impress me one bit...Not a healthy, hearty bunch
    "Science is not belief but the will to find out." ~ Anonymous
    "Culture of the mind must be subservient to the heart." ~ Gandhi
    "The flogging will continue until morale improves." ~ Unknown


  4. #94
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    Quote Originally Posted by Iron Fireling View Post
    I don't know everything, but I DO know that "humans can't easily turn carbohydrates into fat" is rubbish... there are a LOT of people eating a high carb low fat diet, and guess what? They're fat! Obviously it isn't the fat in the food that they're eating that's the problem. As soon as I dropped my carbs and increased my fat, I lost weight. Many, many people here have done the same... increasing fat, and ironically, losing body fat.

    Even when eating a very low fat diet (10% calories from fat) that still equates a few hundred calories from fat a day which can be stored. 200 stored calories per day could almost equal just under a pound of adipose fat gain every few weeks. But most people who are even on very strict low fat diet are eating more fat than that anyway. Even most bread and steamed vegetables contain more than 10% fat.
    If someone was theoretically eating a complete zero fat diet then I guess novo de lipogenesis would start to occur but it's pretty rare in most situations.

  5. #95
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    I'm reading the Starch Solution but haven't gotten too far into it, and I already think he's an idiot. He mentions the paleolithic but the examples he picks are all agricultural societies like the Maya. He mentions that the Romans and Aztec warriors ate grains before battle, but doesn't bother to examine why. (Maybe to put on weight for all the long marches?) He says that fat gets stored as fat, which IS true if you're eating 4 cups of rice a day or 12 pieces of bread like he recommends!

    All I can say about his diet is that it's better than SAD, but not by much. I can think of several books I would recommend before his.

  6. #96
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    1. If you are in positive nitrogen balance, then you are getting enough protein in your diet. He believes that 40 to 60 grams of protein per day is enough and you will be in positive nitrogen balance with that amount. What are the dangers of keeping protein this low?

    2. The amino acid methionine is metabolized into homocysteine which is a risk factor for a bunch of diseases. Is a high level of methionine in the diet really harmful?

    3. De novo lipogenesis (conversion of sugar to fat) does not happen easily in humans. Even though many animals are good at this, humans are not. If you consume excess starch you will more likely burn it off with excess body heat, fidgeting, or you will be driven to physical activity. Is this true?

    4. High glycemic carbs can be beneficial because the high insulin spike that follows is good for controlling appetite. Is this true?

    5. He thinks that good sources of starch are rice, corn, potatoes, sweet potatoes, and beans. These should be the centerpiece of the diet - source of the majority of a person's calories. I avoid beans because of the anti-nutrients. But would it be harmful for a person to get over half of their calories from rice, corn, potatoes, and sweet potatoes?

    6. He does not think salt is harmful and a low salt diet can be harmful.

    7. He does not think moderate amounts of sugar is harmful. He thinks its okay to use sauces with sugar in them to make the starch based foods taste better.

    8. He thinks dietary fat is incredibly easy for the body to store. Therefore eating too much fat will make you fat.

    9. He thinks all animal products should be avoided. Personally, I'm still convinced that you need animal products to reach optimal health. My question here is would some people benefit from reducing meat and increasing starch. I'm not talking about eliminating meat - just altering the ratios of starch to animal products.
    I just noticed this! I'll do my best to answer your questions.

    1 - No idea, sorry

    2 - I assume this is something in meat? I have no idea about this in particular, but I'd advise you to look at Denise Minger's critique of the China study. She said that meat was weakly associated with an increased risk of a few cancers, but grain was strongly associated. Also, she said that meat eating was generally associated with lower death from all causes.

    3 - Not for me. I've lost 70 pounds so far, and I never lost any while I was eating bread.

    4 - Err, no, not really. Sure, the spike itself suppresses appetite WHILE it's spiked. But when you eat carbs, the crash comes rather quickly, which is how we ended up with the CW of 'eat every two hours'.

    5 - If you got that many of your calories from carbs, you would be sugar burning, not fat burning. So unless you're very active you'd be gaining weight. I'd say it would be harmful.

    6 - I agree with him 100%. Paleo was originally not into salt, but Loren Cordain amended that opinion in his later book

    7 - Sugar is empty calories. Even if it's not especially harmful, why use it? There's no nutritional value. But actually, I think it is harmful. Another thing to make you a sugar burner, not a fat burner.

    8 - I completely disagree with him on this point, and I'm actually pretty sure about my science. It's true that fat will get stored as fat IF you are eating high carb. When you're eating high carb, your body is desperately trying to get rid of the extra sugar by burning it, so the fat gets shuttled off to the fat cells to deal with later. If you take in high amounts of carbs all the time, later never comes.

    However, if you're primal/paleo and adapted to burning fat, it's completely different. The carbs you do take in are used for the muscles and brain while the fat is converted to ketones and used to fuel the metabolism. But that conversion can only take place if there isn't excess carbs in the diet.

    9 - If you're not talking about eliminating meat, maybe. It also depends what meat. Fish is the food of the gods IMO.

    Hope all that helped!

  7. #97
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    It's a simple choice. Which one, McDougall or Sisson would you want on your side in a bar fight?

  8. #98
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    Quote Originally Posted by Legbiter View Post
    It's a simple choice. Which one, McDougall or Sisson would you want on your side in a bar fight?
    Hell, I'd rather have Mark's wife than Dr. McDougall.

  9. #99
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    Here is a video if you have the patience. lol

    YouTube

  10. #100
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    Guy sounds like he's desperatly holding back death with every breath.

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