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Thread: Why does Danny Roddy recommend sugar to reduce stress/estrogen? page 8

  1. #71
    magicmerl's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Paleobird View Post
    Nowhere have you addressed the differences between a sugar burning metabolism and a fat adapted one. You just keep repeating that running low on glycogen is stressful and I agree, for a sugar burner, it is. For a "fat burning machine" as Mark called it, there is no stress because there are two sources of fuel readily available.
    What does being 'fat adapted' mean? Is it just coming out the far side of the low card flu?
    Disclaimer: I eat 'meat and vegetables' ala Primal, although I don't agree with the carb curve. I like Perfect Health Diet and WAPF Lactofermentation a lot.

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  2. #72
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    Quote Originally Posted by magicmerl View Post
    What does being 'fat adapted' mean? Is it just coming out the far side of the low card flu?
    Read this post by Mark from a couple of days ago. It really breaks it down well.

    What Does it Mean to Be Fat-Adapted? | Mark&#039;s Daily Apple

  3. #73
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    For the record, I don't hate Danny or anything. In fact, from what I've read from him, he always seems quite nice.

    It's mainly that I've seen his exchanges with Kurt Harris (who I think is pretty high up there in terms of scientific knowledge) in other places, and thus now have a strongly negative view of anything Ray Peat.

  4. #74
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    Quote Originally Posted by Paleobird View Post
    Read this post by Mark from a couple of days ago. It really breaks it down well.

    What Does it Mean to Be Fat-Adapted? | Mark's Daily Apple
    Thanks. He doesn't say it in the article, but I *guess* being fat burning means being in ketosis?

    Most of that post seemed to be 'painting a pretty picture' rather than explaining the facts. The section on RQ seems to have the same crossover as what danny is talking about (CO2 is mentioned, anyway).
    Disclaimer: I eat 'meat and vegetables' ala Primal, although I don't agree with the carb curve. I like Perfect Health Diet and WAPF Lactofermentation a lot.

    Griff's cholesterol primer
    5,000 Cal Fat <> 5,000 Cal Carbs
    Winterbike: What I eat every day is what other people eat to treat themselves.
    TQP: I find for me that nutrition is much more important than what I do in the gym.
    bloodorchid is always right

  5. #75
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    Quote Originally Posted by otzi View Post
    Danny Roddy - Thanks for stopping by and putting up with the abuse. It always amazes me how people treat visitors, rather than trying to learn, they want to argue and play word games. No amount of studies will appease these people.
    I haven't seen Roddy be abused in the least here. Just a couple folk questioning his theories that aren't backed up by those living in the reality. Speaking of playing games--shouldn't you be over at Kruse's forum whining incestantly about Mark Sisson not giving Kruse's over the top nonsense the proper respect you think it deserves?

  6. #76
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    @magicmerl
    FYI, Mark addresses your question in the article at the bottom:

    A quick note about ketosis:

    Fat-adaption does not necessarily mean ketosis. Ketosis is ketosis. Fat-adaption describes the ability to burn both fat directly via beta-oxidation and glucose via glycolysis, while ketosis describes the use of fat-derived ketone bodies by tissues (like parts of the brain) that normally use glucose. A ketogenic diet “tells” your body that no or very little glucose is available in the environment. The result? “Impaired” glucose tolerance and “physiological” insulin resistance, which sound like negatives but are actually necessary to spare what little glucose exists for use in the brain. On the other hand, a well-constructed, lower-carb (but not full-blown ketogenic) Primal way of eating that leads to weight loss generally improves insulin sensitivity.
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  7. #77
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    Gotcha. Apparently I can't read so good today.

    Essentially, being 'fat adapted' means being in 'dual burner' mode. Thanks.
    Disclaimer: I eat 'meat and vegetables' ala Primal, although I don't agree with the carb curve. I like Perfect Health Diet and WAPF Lactofermentation a lot.

    Griff's cholesterol primer
    5,000 Cal Fat <> 5,000 Cal Carbs
    Winterbike: What I eat every day is what other people eat to treat themselves.
    TQP: I find for me that nutrition is much more important than what I do in the gym.
    bloodorchid is always right

  8. #78
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    Quote Originally Posted by magicmerl View Post
    Isn't the release of free fatty acids a feature of losing weight? How can someone lose fat weight without this happening?

    I realise that health is the goal and not weight loss, but for many people those two initially are aligned and getting healthier does include losing fat.


    What is the basis for the resting pulse of 85 being 'optimal'?

    I don't know what is optimal, but I would have thought that a higher pulse rate resulted in more wear on the heart....
    Its a very important point because everything Peat produces/recommend seems to be to rev up the metabolism. Many feel that things actually work in quite the opposite manner....so I'd definitely research this premise further if you are interested in any of the conclusions drawn from it.

  9. #79
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    Quote Originally Posted by otzi
    What tweaks would you recommend to the average Joe eating according to the Primal Blueprint? (ie. a fairly lax paleo with intermittent fasting and doing some form of exercise) I'm not talking about people with serious metabolic derangements or other medical problems.
    @otzi,

    I would recommend those self-diagnostics I mentioned and if you where an over-achiever, those labs I listed to see if anything was askew.

    But, if everything is fine, there's no need to change anything.

    Quote Originally Posted by magicmerl
    What is the basis for the resting pulse of 85 being 'optimal'?

    I don't know what is optimal, but I would have thought that a higher pulse rate resulted in more wear on the heart....
    @Magicmerl,

    Remember, fat is still being used even if you ate a diet of entirely carbohydrate.

    A healthy liver can remove excess PUFA from the tissue over a period of time.

    Weight loss, which I've never focused on, is likely a mix of calories and keeping the metabolic rate high.

    85 isn't "optimal" it’s just representative of where the metabolic rate is.

    Adrenaline (stress hormone) can also influence the pulse.

    A high pulse from thyroid is very different from a high pulse form adrenaline.

    You don't feel so good when adrenaline is increasing the pulse rate.

    Our cells, tissues, and organs do not "wear out" when they are increased. Our regenerative abilities depend on the production of energy, which reinforces structure.

    ^^ I don't mean to yell, but that is very important.

    Quote Originally Posted by Paleobird View Post
    For a "fat burning machine" as Mark called it, there is no stress because there are two sources of fuel readily available.
    @paleobird,

    The hormones used to become a "fat burning machine" are stress hormones.
    Last edited by dannyroddy; 07-05-2012 at 04:28 PM.

  10. #80
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    Quote Originally Posted by Dracil View Post
    For the record, I don't hate Danny or anything. In fact, from what I've read from him, he always seems quite nice.
    It's mainly that I've seen his exchanges with Kurt Harris (who I think is pretty high up there in terms of scientific knowledge) in other places, and thus now have a strongly negative view of anything Ray Peat.
    I agree with your assessment of all three, Danny, Kurt , and Ray.

    Quote Originally Posted by joe2.0 View Post
    I haven't seen Roddy be abused in the least here. Just a couple folk questioning his theories that aren't backed up by those living in the reality. Speaking of playing games--shouldn't you be over at Kruse's forum whining incestantly about Mark Sisson not giving Kruse's over the top nonsense the proper respect you think it deserves?
    *snort*

    Quote Originally Posted by magicmerl View Post
    Essentially, being 'fat adapted' means being in 'dual burner' mode. Thanks.
    Exactly. Dual burner always has readily available fuel. No stress, no mess.

    Quote Originally Posted by Neckhammer View Post
    Its a very important point because everything Peat produces/recommend seems to be to rev up the metabolism. Many feel that things actually work in quite the opposite manner....so I'd definitely research this premise further if you are interested in any of the conclusions drawn from it.
    The whole "rev up the metabolism" thing is just your basic Slimfast Shakes repackaged. CW nonsense.

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