Do You Take Matt Stone Seriously? page 4

[Dracil]

Eh, there are other anti-low carb viewpoints that I'd rather read than Matt Stone (carbsanity and freetheanimal to start)

[Dualhammers]

So wait. People ignored Mark Sisson's reccomendation of 50-100 carbs (more if you feel worse on less) and then 100-150 carbs once you are at your ideal weight and somehow think that carb reduction is bad?

Duh. If you eat too few of a nutrient and get sick it doesn't mean that eating insanely amounts of that nutrient is the cure.

People go to crazy extremes sometimes...

[DCarr10760]

So wait. People ignored Mark Sisson's reccomendation of 50-100 carbs (more if you feel worse on less) and then 100-150 carbs once you are at your ideal weight and somehow think that carb reduction is bad?

Duh. If you eat too few of a nutrient and get sick it doesn't mean that eating insanely amounts of that nutrient is the cure.

People go to crazy extremes sometimes...

Bravo! Dualhammers! It's the all-or-nothing mindset that really makes for problems on this big spinning rock. Workable solutions are most always gray, not black or white.

[Jiigigaw]

well at first (under 100g/carb) i felt wonderful. almost high and euphoric. nothing could touch me! then about a few mos. later my energy started to drag. should i lower my carbs? i mean lowering...

Some of the problems in this discussion has to do with hormone differences between men and women. Women need more carbs then men. I can go with less than 30 grams of carbs a day if I'm relaxing for the period. This would kill my wife. I suggest reading through stuff in the blog below, as it has a unique woman-centric paleo focus.

Paleo For Women

As for the symptoms, you are right on. AS for how much an individual should or should not eat totally depends on the individual. I recommend that everyone experiment a bit to find where they feel best.

[pklopp]

wow. so sorry for the long rant. those were the symptoms I experienced. matt stone lists these symptoms when low carbing too long:
headaches
dry mouth/eyes
allergies
loss of libido
stomach issues returning
low body temp (i went from 96F vlc to 99F paleo carbs)
pms OR loss of menstruation
moodiness
fatigue
body odor
bad breath
poor glucose control
insulin resistance
panic attacks
dry hair (thyroid)
low blood pressure (adrenal)
and lots more. those are just the ones i can remember.

I'm not arguing one side or the other ... but these are issues related to hydration:

• Headaches
• Low Blood Pressure

These are byproducts of being in ketosis

• body odor ( ketones are water soluble, hence can be excreted via sweat )
• bad breath ( ditto )
• poor glucose control**
• insulin resistance**

Note that the items I've starred are the result of adaptation to ketones as an energy substrate and such value laden terms as "poor" and "resistance" are the result of conventional medicine studying subjects whose metabolisms are awash in carbohydrates.

I've posted about this before, but in a nutshell, if your metabolism is ketone adapted, then it is reserving glucose for tissues that cannot use ketones as an energy substrate ( ie red blood cells, and parts of the brain ). The last thing you want is for your muscles to compete with brain and blood cells for glucose, hence, you become "insulin resistant." If you weren't insulin resistant, then your muscles would happily put you into a hypoglycemic coma as soon as some glucose hit your blood stream.

Generally, a little knowledge is a dangerous thing, and you need to be careful to differentiate between insulin resistance when glucose is scarce vs. insulin resistance when glucose is plentiful. The former is physiological insulin resistance ( ketone adapted metabolism ), the latter is pathological ( type II diabetic ).

Fatigue is interesting, insofar as this might be indicative of phosphate metabolism issues. I would be very curious to see what would happen to folks experiencing these symptoms were they to supplement with creatine, which both acts as a phosphate donor for ATP generation and serves to increase hydration via retention of water.

Just some idle thoughts ...

-PK

[NoSaladWithoutMeat]

The guy is KA-RAY-ZE.

[PaleoLogicCheck]

The guy is KA-RAY-ZE.

Am I KA-RAY-ZE or did Mark Sisson just write an blog post for Matt Stone:

10 Health Reasons to Spend Time Outdoors – 180 Degree Health

[platyrhynchos]

So wait. People ignored Mark Sisson's reccomendation of 50-100 carbs (more if you feel worse on less) and then 100-150 carbs once you are at your ideal weight and somehow think that carb reduction is bad?

Duh. If you eat too few of a nutrient and get sick it doesn't mean that eating insanely amounts of that nutrient is the cure.

People go to crazy extremes sometimes...

Seriously. Just eat real food. Nutrient rich. Rice is O.K. Yams are O.K. People go too extreme. Keep veggies in every meal. Eat good fat. No sugar. No gluten... And eat some carbs once [or twice] in a while..

[AureliaWaterman]

it would be better to consult a doctor rather than moving for such things here and there

[TCOHTom]

he's still a douche

I think you'll get some points for that line!
And I agree completely with your stance on low carb diets; long term.
Good to know you're doing better.